WizeGuy Posted January 30, 2023 Share Posted January 30, 2023 Yeah. Burrow isn't ahead of Allen. They're both great, so I'm good with people leaning one way or the other, but he hasn't hit Allen's level of play in the post season. His defense is wildly better than Buffalo's against elite offenses due to a much a better pass rush. That being said, props to the Bengals because they've proven to be an elite team. They're going to be a problem for a while. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThatJaxxenGuy Posted January 30, 2023 Share Posted January 30, 2023 What we’ve really learned is you can rank him #2 if you want - but there isn’t anyone right there “along with Mahomes”. Mahomes is so far away from every other QB right now it’s absurd. 9 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AngusMcFife Posted January 30, 2023 Share Posted January 30, 2023 If Burrow is to be recognized as a big game QB, he'll have to do better than averaging 5.2 Y/PA with 2 INTs against a very mediocre Chiefs defense missing one of its best CBs. His best plays are he tosses it up into tight/double coverage and lets his all-world WRs make amazing plays: Chase with an incredible 35 yard reception on 4th down in double coverage, and Higgins making an incredible leaping 27 yard TD catch in tight coverage with the safety coming over. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SmittyBacall Posted January 30, 2023 Share Posted January 30, 2023 (edited) 8 minutes ago, AngusMcFife said: If Burrow is to be recognized as a big game QB, he'll have to do better than averaging 5.2 Y/PA with 2 INTs against a very mediocre Chiefs defense missing one of its best CBs. Did you even watch the game? Better yet, can you even interpret what you are watching? I don't care how "average" the Chiefs D is. Their pass rush killed our makeshift OL and our offense in general, period. We struggled to run the ball and Joe was under duress almost immediately at almost every drop back. Very few (if any) QBs are going to see sustained success facing that pressure. If you line up 3 back up OL against an all-pro and company, that is the result you're going to get. And this isn't even to say zero blame goes on Joe, he didn't play well. But can you really blame him? I've said it before and I'll say it again, it doesn't matter how good your receivers are if you can't provide enough protection to get them the ball. Edited January 30, 2023 by SmittyBacall Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AngusMcFife Posted January 30, 2023 Share Posted January 30, 2023 16 minutes ago, SmittyBacall said: Did you even watch the game? Better yet, can you even interpret what you are watching? I don't care how "average" the Chiefs D is. Their pass rush killed our makeshift OL and our offense in general, period. We struggled to run the ball and Joe was under duress almost immediately at almost every drop back. Very few (if any) QBs are going to see sustained success facing that pressure. If you line up 3 back up OL against an all-pro and company, that is the result you're going to get. And this isn't even to say zero blame goes on Joe, he didn't play well. But can you really blame him? I've said it before and I'll say it again, it doesn't matter how good your receivers are if you can't provide enough protection to get them the ball. In the first series he had a clean pocket and threw a ball right to a defender, who dropped it. Later in the series on 3rd and 9, he had a clean pocket but rushed forward, basically causing a sack with his own undisciplined play. 2nd series, O-line breaks down for 2 sacks. 3rd series had had time for some throws. On the play he got sacked, he just locked on to a receiver. Could have processed faster. Had at least 3 seconds to throw. Had great protection on Boyd completion on 3rd and 14. FG 4th series. Had very good protection. Throws INT. 5th series. Had very good protection. Throws INT called back on DPI. Couldn't cash in the red zone. FG. 6th series. Had good protection. TD Higgins. 7th series. Has good protection but gets happy feet, causing blocking to break down. Holding penalty on 3rd down kills drive. 8th series. Has good protection, checks down to Perine on 3rd down for no reason to set up 4th down. Throws jump ball to Chase on 4th down. Run in TD. 9th series. Initial holding penalty overcome. Has excellent protection, throws INT to Higgins. 10th series. Solid protection breaks down after 3 seconds. Burrow throws intentional grounding. Great protection allows completion to hurst on 3rd and 16. Had good protection on 1st and 2nd down, only get 2 yards. Sacked on 3rd down. So overall I'd say the 2nd and 10th series ended due to protection breakdowns. But the premise that "Joe was under duress almost immediately at almost every drop back" is categorically false. He had plenty of clean pockets to throw from. Should have had a 3rd INT that was dropped. Poor pocket discipline a few time induced pressure. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SmittyBacall Posted January 30, 2023 Share Posted January 30, 2023 (edited) 36 minutes ago, AngusMcFife said: In the first series he had a clean pocket and threw a ball right to a defender, who dropped it. Later in the series on 3rd and 9, he had a clean pocket but rushed forward, basically causing a sack with his own undisciplined play. 2nd series, O-line breaks down for 2 sacks. 3rd series had had time for some throws. On the play he got sacked, he just locked on to a receiver. Could have processed faster. Had at least 3 seconds to throw. Had great protection on Boyd completion on 3rd and 14. FG 4th series. Had very good protection. Throws INT. 5th series. Had very good protection. Throws INT called back on DPI. Couldn't cash in the red zone. FG. 6th series. Had good protection. TD Higgins. 7th series. Has good protection but gets happy feet, causing blocking to break down. Holding penalty on 3rd down kills drive. 8th series. Has good protection, checks down to Perine on 3rd down for no reason to set up 4th down. Throws jump ball to Chase on 4th down. Run in TD. 9th series. Initial holding penalty overcome. Has excellent protection, throws INT to Higgins. 10th series. Solid protection breaks down after 3 seconds. Burrow throws intentional grounding. Great protection allows completion to hurst on 3rd and 16. Had good protection on 1st and 2nd down, only get 2 yards. Sacked on 3rd down. So overall I'd say the 2nd and 10th series ended due to protection breakdowns. But the premise that "Joe was under duress almost immediately at almost every drop back" is categorically false. He had plenty of clean pockets to throw from. Should have had a 3rd INT that was dropped. Poor pocket discipline a few time induced pressure. What is this even based on? How can you generalize an entire series as good or bad protection when protection differs play to play? This doesn't make any sense. Edited January 30, 2023 by SmittyBacall 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AngusMcFife Posted January 30, 2023 Share Posted January 30, 2023 7 minutes ago, SmittyBacall said: What is this even based on? How can you generalize an entire series as good or bad protection when protection differs play to play? This doesn't make any sense. I rewatched them. Go to condensed game on NFL+. On the 2nd series the O-line played badly. The last sack was bad protection. A couple sacks were on Burrow getting happy feet, where protection was good but broke down once Burrow started moving in the pocket unnecessarily. But there was a good stretch when the protection was generally holding up. His 2 INTs were from a clean pocket, and he should have had a 3rd that was dropped. The idea that he was getting constantly harassed on every play is simply false. But you are known to fabricate facts to support your guy, we've already established that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fluhartz Posted January 30, 2023 Share Posted January 30, 2023 3 hours ago, SmittyBacall said: Did you even watch the game? Better yet, can you even interpret what you are watching? I don't care how "average" the Chiefs D is. Their pass rush killed our makeshift OL and our offense in general, period. We struggled to run the ball and Joe was under duress almost immediately at almost every drop back. Very few (if any) QBs are going to see sustained success facing that pressure. If you line up 3 back up OL against an all-pro and company, that is the result you're going to get. And this isn't even to say zero blame goes on Joe, he didn't play well. But can you really blame him? I've said it before and I'll say it again, it doesn't matter how good your receivers are if you can't provide enough protection to get them the ball. please quit arguing with that idiot!!!! you can't win 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SmittyBacall Posted January 30, 2023 Share Posted January 30, 2023 41 minutes ago, fluhartz said: please quit arguing with that idiot!!!! you can't win I can’t help it I am a sick person. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AngusMcFife Posted January 30, 2023 Share Posted January 30, 2023 4 hours ago, SmittyBacall said: What is this even based on? How can you generalize an entire series as good or bad protection when protection differs play to play? This doesn't make any sense. If there are 4 throws in a given series, and 3 are from a clean pocket, and 1 the QB has to scramble outside the pocket to get the throw away, the protection is generally good. One is able to generalize by deducing averages. I'm sorry that this is some novel way of thinking for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mizter_Clean10 Posted January 31, 2023 Share Posted January 31, 2023 9 hours ago, SmittyBacall said: What is this even based on? How can you generalize an entire series as good or bad protection when protection differs play to play? This doesn't make any sense. Lol that tweet - and Chiefs probably win by more if Mahomes isn’t injured or they don’t lose their top 3 WR or their best CB. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
biggie. Posted January 31, 2023 Share Posted January 31, 2023 19 hours ago, WizeGuy said: Yeah. Burrow isn't ahead of Allen. They're both great, so I'm good with people leaning one way or the other, but he hasn't hit Allen's level of play in the post season. His defense is wildly better than Buffalo's against elite offenses due to a much a better pass rush. That being said, props to the Bengals because they've proven to be an elite team. They're going to be a problem for a while. lol what? Allen had two big postseason games: one against us and another he ultimately lost. He's only been to the conference championship once (which his team got blown out) and has never been to the SB. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SmittyBacall Posted January 31, 2023 Share Posted January 31, 2023 8 hours ago, Mizter_Clean10 said: Lol that tweet - and Chiefs probably win by more if Mahomes isn’t injured or they don’t lose their top 3 WR or their best CB. I don’t think he’s saying Bengals win if they have a healthy OL, more so if the backup OL played half as well as they did against Buffalo. Regardless, that wasn’t the point of why I posted the tweet. Focus is the pressure rate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AngusMcFife Posted January 31, 2023 Share Posted January 31, 2023 8 hours ago, biggie. said: lol what? Allen had two big postseason games: one against us and another he ultimately lost. He's only been to the conference championship once (which his team got blown out) and has never been to the SB. Burrow has never had a big postseason game. His best game is 240 yards with 2TDs. He threw for over 300 yards once, and it was with 0 TDs, 1 INT, and scored a whopping 19 points. Allen has had games where he's thrown for over 300 yards with 4/5 TDs and no INTs. Games where he single-handedly dominates his opponent. Allen's 3rd best postseason game (vs the Colts) is far better than any postseason game Burrow has played. Burrow so far has played solid and will get you to 20-24 points. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
biggie. Posted January 31, 2023 Share Posted January 31, 2023 16 minutes ago, AngusMcFife said: Burrow has never had a big postseason game. His best game is 240 yards with 2TDs. He threw for over 300 yards once, and it was with 0 TDs, 1 INT, and scored a whopping 19 points. Allen has had games where he's thrown for over 300 yards with 4/5 TDs and no INTs. Games where he single-handedly dominates his opponent. Allen's 3rd best postseason game (vs the Colts) is far better than any postseason game Burrow has played. Burrow so far has played solid and will get you to 20-24 points. Yeah get back with me when Allen reaches a SB. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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