Is Mayfield a first rounder???

[FGK]

50 minutes ago, NudeTayne said:

I actually don't think he's gotten enough of the "run first, questionable accuracy guy" label--seems like a media golden child who is more of a "transcendent right handed Michael Vick" according to them.  If you look at Jackson's stats, he is very much a questionable accuracy guy.  My eye balls say that as well--seen him look really inaccurate at times.  What's worse is that I could see Lamar Jackson being the target if we keep Hue.  Lamar Jackson is my #5 passer in the draft behind Mayfield / Rosen / Darnold / Rudolph.

 

29 minutes ago, Bonanza23 said:

He is definitely not a run first qb, but his accuracy is spotty at best. 

Agree with Bonanza that stats don't tell the story for QB's in general on accuracy, at least not raw cmpl% (Newton had awwwwful cmpl% numbers even when he was playing great because he threw deep so often). Though obviously I disagree on Jackson's accuracy specifically.

I haven't gotten that sense on Jackson from the media AT ALL. All the mainstream draft folks I follow have him pegged as a 2nd-4th round pick. He has times where he looks innaccurate for sure, but he also has times where he hits #1 overall type throws. Personally, I think he's going to be a Dak type. Get him into a more consistent NFL system, get him to try to do a little less by himself, and his accuracy will normalize and look more like the #1 guy than the innaccurate guy. It could go the other way, but I love him as a player. Might not take him #1, but would definitely take him mid-first. 

Having Rudolph over him is crazy talk IMO. That dude is the definition of a spread and heave system QB. His deep balls stay up so long half the OLBs in the league will have time to get under them, let alone elite FS's. The others I get, I have Rosen/Darnold/Jackson/Mayfield all in my "really, really like, need to do more research" tier right now. Not 100% sure how I'll feel by draft time.

[bosko1616]

Here’s my current rankings

1. Rosen

2. Darnold

3. Allen( yes I still believe in him.) 

4. Mayfield 

5. Finley 

[NudeTayne]

33 minutes ago, freakygeniuskid said:

 

Agree with Bonanza that stats don't tell the story for QB's in general on accuracy, at least not raw cmpl% (Newton had awwwwful cmpl% numbers even when he was playing great because he threw deep so often). Though obviously I disagree on Jackson's accuracy specifically.

I haven't gotten that sense on Jackson from the media AT ALL. All the mainstream draft folks I follow have him pegged as a 2nd-4th round pick. He has times where he looks innaccurate for sure, but he also has times where he hits #1 overall type throws. Personally, I think he's going to be a Dak type. Get him into a more consistent NFL system, get him to try to do a little less by himself, and his accuracy will normalize and look more like the #1 guy than the innaccurate guy. It could go the other way, but I love him as a player. Might not take him #1, but would definitely take him mid-first. 

Having Rudolph over him is crazy talk IMO. That dude is the definition of a spread and heave system QB. His deep balls stay up so long half the OLBs in the league will have time to get under them, let alone elite FS's. The others I get, I have Rosen/Darnold/Jackson/Mayfield all in my "really, really like, need to do more research" tier right now. Not 100% sure how I'll feel by draft time.

I'm pretty much in agreement with all this.  I just see Jackson & Rudolph in tier 2.  I could see both lasting as starters in the NFL.  I just don't like them as much as tier 1--Mayfield & Rosen and tier 1.5--Darnold.  I don't know what you're seeing with Rudolph, though; he really does look a lot like a true Roethlisberger type to me, and his arm looks great.  I'm not sure where you see him floating balls?  Here are a few games of his that I really liked how clean his game was--vs ranked opponents, fwiw:

 

[Bonanza23]

2 hours ago, freakygeniuskid said:

 

Agree with Bonanza that stats don't tell the story for QB's in general on accuracy, at least not raw cmpl% (Newton had awwwwful cmpl% numbers even when he was playing great because he threw deep so often). Though obviously I disagree on Jackson's accuracy specifically.

I haven't gotten that sense on Jackson from the media AT ALL. All the mainstream draft folks I follow have him pegged as a 2nd-4th round pick. He has times where he looks innaccurate for sure, but he also has times where he hits #1 overall type throws. Personally, I think he's going to be a Dak type. Get him into a more consistent NFL system, get him to try to do a little less by himself, and his accuracy will normalize and look more like the #1 guy than the innaccurate guy. It could go the other way, but I love him as a player. Might not take him #1, but would definitely take him mid-first. 

Having Rudolph over him is crazy talk IMO. That dude is the definition of a spread and heave system QB. His deep balls stay up so long half the OLBs in the league will have time to get under them, let alone elite FS's. The others I get, I have Rosen/Darnold/Jackson/Mayfield all in my "really, really like, need to do more research" tier right now. Not 100% sure how I'll feel by draft time.

Yeah I just don’t agree about Jackson. But let it be said I haven’t seen all his games. Maybe I’m missing something. The game I just watched, the lady sideline reporter stated many of the scouts she talked to said they really like him. So it’s an incomplete for me right now. 

I liked Rudolph a lot last year. But with all the must watch qbs this year I haven’t seen one down of his this year. So another incomplete with him too. 

[Fatgerman]

6 hours ago, NudeTayne said:

Well yes, this of course.  It is my fapdream to end up with Saquon/Minkah/Baker.  If we trade down from #1 to #3 with the NYG so they can grab Darnold & then the 49ers trade down so they can grab an LT/WR/pass rusher and get picks for another team to scoop up Rosen, I'd trade the Giants 2018 2nd rounder from the deal--keep the 2019 1st--and #33 to get up into the high teens for Mayfield after we grab Barkely #3 & Fitzpatrick #5.  I'd have to get a new laptop, though, but it'd be worth it.

I gotta feeling Baker is the Patty Mahomes of this draft and winds up drafted simularly around 10-11. I wouldnt gamble he gets past 11, so if you do those trade downs, which Im cool with since theyre my ideafrom my mock, you better work a trade up to 9 or 10.

[Fatgerman]

5 hours ago, freakygeniuskid said:

 

Agree with Bonanza that stats don't tell the story for QB's in general on accuracy, at least not raw cmpl% (Newton had awwwwful cmpl% numbers even when he was playing great because he threw deep so often). Though obviously I disagree on Jackson's accuracy specifically.

I haven't gotten that sense on Jackson from the media AT ALL. All the mainstream draft folks I follow have him pegged as a 2nd-4th round pick. He has times where he looks innaccurate for sure, but he also has times where he hits #1 overall type throws. Personally, I think he's going to be a Dak type. Get him into a more consistent NFL system, get him to try to do a little less by himself, and his accuracy will normalize and look more like the #1 guy than the innaccurate guy. It could go the other way, but I love him as a player. Might not take him #1, but would definitely take him mid-first. 

Having Rudolph over him is crazy talk IMO. That dude is the definition of a spread and heave system QB. His deep balls stay up so long half the OLBs in the league will have time to get under them, let alone elite FS's. The others I get, I have Rosen/Darnold/Jackson/Mayfield all in my "really, really like, need to do more research" tier right now. Not 100% sure how I'll feel by draft time.

I could not agree more with the part on Rudolph. IMO, a mid-round total rebuild from the ground up. Dude just chucks up high arching deepballs that his recievers often grab because Big 12 CBs are garbage most times. They do take a beat to arrive. The difference between him and Baker throwing is like batting cage machine versus a laser canon. frickin lasers.

[NudeTayne]

2 minutes ago, Fatgerman said:

I could not agree more with the part on Rudolph. IMO, a mid-round total rebuild from the ground up. Dude just chucks up high arching deepballs that his recievers often grab because Big 12 CBs are garbage most times. They do take a beat to arrive. The difference between him and Baker throwing is like batting cage machine versus a laser canon. frickin lasers.

Agreed that he is a shadow of Mayfield.  I think he sneaks into the first, if not the 2nd round, though.  I just don't especially want him.  He's alright, though.

[Fatgerman]

2 minutes ago, NudeTayne said:

Agreed that he is a shadow of Mayfield.  I think he sneaks into the first, if not the 2nd round, though.  I just don't especially want him.  He's alright, though.

Youre getting soft

[ditchdigger]

20 minutes ago, Fatgerman said:

I gotta feeling Baker is the Patty Mahomes of this draft and winds up drafted simularly around 10-11. I wouldnt gamble he gets past 11, so if you do those trade downs, which Im cool with since theyre my ideafrom my mock, you better work a trade up to 9 or 10.

We tried to get cute with Mahomes and lost our chance to get him.  

 

[Fatgerman]

11 minutes ago, ditchdigger said:

We tried to get cute with Mahomes and lost our chance to get him.  

 

Dont you know? Thats because we were waiting for Baker. Sashi has Baker Mayfields picture in his locker. Hes been scribbling Mrs Sashi Mayfield on the back of his note-book. Jimmys been practicing in a mirror for the first time he shakes his hand. How long do I shake? Two pumps or three? What will I say? Candidly, what should I wear? Paul Depodesta has a Baker fathead on his wall, next to the dart-board with Jonah Hills Moneyball photo attached to it and the words IM NOT FAT carved below.

[Iamcanadian]

I will start out by saying, this is one of the best QB drafts I have ever seen and I will not be shocked to see as many as 6 QB's go in round 1, although 3 or 4 seems more likely!!!

I would say that the NFL GM's and scouts would rank them thus: Darnold is #1, Rosen #2, Jackson #3, Mayfield #4 and Rudolph #5, although I would not touch Rudolph with a ten foot pole myself.

Darnold has the greatest upside and the potential to be special.

Rosen is as technically sound as a prospect can be, but may lack some leadership qualities and the 'it' factor.

Jackson is the second coming of Michael Vick, but is far more accurate as a passer, but due to his build, could have a much shorter career, otherwise, he might be #1 on this chart.

Mayfield could be as short as 5'10" which the pro GM's and scouts hate, but he has everything else you could want in a pro QB.

Rudolph comes from a HC who has had multiple college QB's who put up great stats, but do nothing as pros, so he could be a complete bust, or maybe another Rodgers who came from the same type of HC(multiple high picked QB's who all flopped as pros) and was given a couple of years to remake his technique.

I actually prefer Stidham of Auburn as my #5 QB, but so far as I have researched, GM's and scouts seem to disagree with me and prefer Rudolph???

[ditchdigger]

Candidly, you're pretty funny for a German. 

[ditchdigger]

4 minutes ago, Iamcanadian said:

Mayfield could be as short as 5'10" which the pro GM's and scouts hate, but he has everything else you could want in a pro QB.

He's a shade over 6', but that doesn't matter.  This stat does, though.

 

[Fatgerman]

17 minutes ago, Iamcanadian said:

I will start out by saying, this is one of the best QB drafts I have ever seen and I will not be shocked to see as many as 6 QB's go in round 1, although 3 or 4 seems more likely!!!

I would say that the NFL GM's and scouts would rank them thus: Darnold is #1, Rosen #2, Jackson #3, Mayfield #4 and Rudolph #5, although I would not touch Rudolph with a ten foot pole myself.

Darnold has the greatest upside and the potential to be special.

Rosen is as technically sound as a prospect can be, but may lack some leadership qualities and the 'it' factor.

Jackson is the second coming of Michael Vick, but is far more accurate as a passer, but due to his build, could have a much shorter career, otherwise, he might be #1 on this chart.

Mayfield could be as short as 5'10" which the pro GM's and scouts hate, but he has everything else you could want in a pro QB.

Rudolph comes from a HC who has had multiple college QB's who put up great stats, but do nothing as pros, so he could be a complete bust, or maybe another Rodgers who came from the same type of HC(multiple high picked QB's who all flopped as pros) and was given a couple of years to remake his technique.

I actually prefer Stidham of Auburn as my #5 QB, but so far as I have researched, GM's and scouts seem to disagree with me and prefer Rudolph???

Id take Stidham before Rudolph, or Lamar Jackson for that matter.

[Iamcanadian]

25 minutes ago, ditchdigger said:

He's a shade over 6', but that doesn't matter.  This stat does, though.

 

I said could be 5'10", his height will be decided at the Combine, because colleges lie all the time about height and weight to give their stars a better shot at being named All American, which also helps their recruiting. What makes me suspicious about his height, is how much it is mentioned in scouting reports and the fact he started the season as a possible 4th or 5th rounder. Makes me think he could be shorter than what he is listed as??? The Combine will tell all!!!

Remember also, that Baker likes to roll out a lot to compensate for his height, even so, I love him precisely because he is so effective at whatever his height proves out to be.