2023 NFL offseason

[49erscap]

7 minutes ago, typecast said:

 

Great depth pickup, backup C/G for sure.

[Forge]

8 minutes ago, typecast said:

 

Basically the Brunskill replacement. He's not as good, and older than Brunskill, but he's cheaper and I think that the staff is basically saying that they are moving forward with Banks / Brendel / Burford full time. No more rotation for Burford so there was no need to pay the premium for Brunskill. 

 

 

[9erFreak77]

5 minutes ago, Forge said:

Basically the Brunskill replacement. He's not as good, and older than Brunskill, but he's cheaper and I think that the staff is basically saying that they are moving forward with Banks / Brendel / Burford full time. No more rotation for Burford so there was no need to pay the premium for Brunskill. 

 

 

So much for my feeling of another splash in free agency lol. I do think we need to add another edge though.

[NinerNation21]

It seems our OL is just about set.

Williams / Banks / Brendel / Burford / McKivitz

First guy off the bench: Feliciano

7th & 8th men: 2 of Moore, Zacklj, and Poe

I think we probably add a mid to late round rookie to compete for the 7th and 8th spot and/or practice squad to go along with Watson, Ismael, and a couple of UDFAs. 

It seems doubtful that we're going to sign a RT in free agency and I doubt we draft a tackle high unless they think he can compete from day one for serious playing time. Probably a McKivitz/Moore type guy in the 6th that can play both tackle and guard. 

Edited March 21, 2023 by NinerNation21

[Gravity]

got this from another forum on Jon Feliciano

Only 3 sacks, 971 snaps and 6 penalties at C. Only a 58.2 grade. maybe he's bad run blocker?

[JIllg]

9 hours ago, NinerNation21 said:

It seems our OL is just about set.

Williams / Banks / Brendel / Burford / McKivitz

First guy off the bench: Feliciano

7th & 8th men: 2 of Moore, Zacklj, and Poe

I think we probably add a mid to late round rookie to compete for the 7th and 8th spot and/or practice squad to go along with Watson, Ismael, and a couple of UDFAs. 

It seems doubtful that we're going to sign a RT in free agency and I doubt we draft a tackle high unless they think he can compete from day one for serious playing time. Probably a McKivitz/Moore type guy in the 6th that can play both tackle and guard. 

I think they'll get this year's Burford to compete with/replace McKivitz at RT if the right prospect gets in range early on. Otherwise, I agree with you. This regime has been pretty aggressive about tackle, even though they've shown much less willingness to invest important assets to the interior of the O-line. 

[NinerNation21]

4 hours ago, Gravity said:

got this from another forum on Jon Feliciano

Only 3 sacks, 971 snaps and 6 penalties at C. Only a 58.2 grade. maybe he's bad run blocker?

PFF has graded him pretty low in run blocking throughout his career and they also really hammer guys on penalties. Looking at his pass blocking numbers, they're not terrible. He's been decent all through his career. 

If you listen to guys like Brandon Thorn, who specialize in studying linemen, he actually likes Feliciano in the Brunskill role quite a bit. But if you listen to Giants fans on Twitter, they tell you he's absolute garbage. 

Feliciano might not be the best run blocker we could've brought in, but in terms of versatility and pass blocking ability, he should be a pretty decent 6th man.

[NinerNation21]

49 minutes ago, JIllg said:

I think they'll get this year's Burford to compete with/replace McKivitz at RT if the right prospect gets in range early on. Otherwise, I agree with you. This regime has been pretty aggressive about tackle, even though they've shown much less willingness to invest important assets to the interior of the O-line. 

It feels like with this regime when it comes to OL, if you only play one position, you better win the job for it from the jump or you're not going to be active on gameday. They value flexibility with their OL bench to maximize talent at other positions. Some teams carry 9 or 10 OL but we usually carry 8 because all three reserves can play multiple positions.

It's why they target flexible OL late in the draft almost every year because either they make the team because they can fill 2 or 3 positions, or they were drafted so low that they can sneak them on the PS without much notice. 

So when it comes to a guy like Blake Freeland, for example, if we were to draft him, he would need to either win the RT spot or be able to play also LT and kick inside to G in a pinch for them to consider drafting him or someone like him. 

[JIllg]

23 minutes ago, NinerNation21 said:

It feels like with this regime when it comes to OL, if you only play one position, you better win the job for it from the jump or you're not going to be active on gameday. They value flexibility with their OL bench to maximize talent at other positions. Some teams carry 9 or 10 OL but we usually carry 8 because all three reserves can play multiple positions.

It's why they target flexible OL late in the draft almost every year because either they make the team because they can fill 2 or 3 positions, or they were drafted so low that they can sneak them on the PS without much notice. 

So when it comes to a guy like Blake Freeland, for example, if we were to draft him, he would need to either win the RT spot or be able to play also LT and kick inside to G in a pinch for them to consider drafting him or someone like him. 

All fair points. Freeland is too tall and upright to give much value other than a tackle. And there is really only one roster spot for the OL if they keep 8 and that is only if they are aren't particularly interested in Jaylon Moore and one of Zakelj/Poe any more. I just know that he was one of the official visits and they tend to stick very closely to players they have talked to in person. And I feel pretty strongly that McKivitiz is more of a hedge than an outright starter expectation. But they might expect that competition to come from within. Jaylon Moore and Burford were both tackles in college. Zakelj and Poe can now be looked at as guards rather than centers. And they might feel more strongly about McKivitz than I do like with Hufunga or Banks last year where I looked at those starting positions as major question marks and the team very obviously considered them filled.

[NinerNation21]

10 minutes ago, JIllg said:

All fair points. Freeland is too tall and upright to give much value other than a tackle. And there is really only one roster spot for the OL if they keep 8 and that is only if they are aren't particularly interested in Jaylon Moore and one of Zakelj/Poe any more. I just know that he was one of the official visits and they tend to stick very closely to players they have talked to in person. And I feel pretty strongly that McKivitiz is more of a hedge than an outright starter expectation. But they might expect that competition to come from within. Jaylon Moore and Burford were both tackles in college. Zakelj and Poe can now be looked at as guards rather than centers. And they might feel more strongly about McKivitz than I do like with Hufunga or Banks last year where I looked at those starting positions as major question marks and the team very obviously considered them filled.

I agree. I don't love the idea of McKivitz starting. I thought he seemed like a good swing tackle who could play guard if needed, but like you, I was also very apprehensive with giving Huf the starting role as well as Banks. Maybe they see McKivitz the same way? He was one of the Gold Helmet guys in his draft class, so there's that. 

Bringing in a quality RT and having Feliciano and McKivitz as the first two guys off the bench would make this OL the best that it could be, but I'm guessing it's one of the situations they're just rolling with what they got because of more expensive issues elsewhere like DE.

I've soured on Moore. When we drafted him, I was pretty excited with his athletic profile and college production. He also looked good at LT in pre-season his rookie year. I thought we might have something there, but he's been pretty terrible when he's played in the regular season. 

I remain intrigued with Zacklj and Poe. The team seems to think very highly of Zacklj and Poe more than held his own last training camp. 

I'd love to draft a guy who can compete with Moore for a spot as the swing tackle and emergency guard. I feel like Moore is a bubble guy and could be on the chopping block this year (I feel the same about Ambry Thomas, too.)

[NinerNation21]

This rule has come in handy the last couple of years. 

[JIllg]

11 minutes ago, NinerNation21 said:

I agree. I don't love the idea of McKivitz starting. I thought he seemed like a good swing tackle who could play guard if needed, but like you, I was also very apprehensive with giving Huf the starting role as well as Banks. Maybe they see McKivitz the same way? He was one of the Gold Helmet guys in his draft class, so there's that. 

Bringing in a quality RT and having Feliciano and McKivitz as the first two guys off the bench would make this OL the best that it could be, but I'm guessing it's one of the situations they're just rolling with what they got because of more expensive issues elsewhere like DE.

I've soured on Moore. When we drafted him, I was pretty excited with his athletic profile and college production. He also looked good at LT in pre-season his rookie year. I thought we might have something there, but he's been pretty terrible when he's played in the regular season. 

I remain intrigued with Zacklj and Poe. The team seems to think very highly of Zacklj and Poe more than held his own last training camp. 

I'd love to draft a guy who can compete with Moore for a spot as the swing tackle and emergency guard. I feel like Moore is a bubble guy and could be on the chopping block this year (I feel the same about Ambry Thomas, too.)

Definitely agreed on Moore and Ambry Thomas. I thought they'd be valuable contributors last year. Thomas got better at the end of 2021 and Moore was a quality athlete that played well in college and was fine in limited 2021 snaps. But both were terrible according to all information that we have from last year. Moore single-handedly nearly lost the Denver game. Thomas was so bad that the coaching staff barely trusted him to absorb any snaps. I have them as orange on my prospective roster right now - that's the wrong side of the 53 man bubble.

[NinerNation21]

1 minute ago, JIllg said:

Definitely agreed on Moore and Ambry Thomas. I thought they'd be valuable contributors last year. Thomas got better at the end of 2021 and Moore was a quality athlete that played well in college and was fine in limited 2021 snaps. But both were terrible according to all information that we have from last year. Moore single-handedly nearly lost the Denver game. Thomas was so bad that the coaching staff barely trusted him to absorb any snaps. I have them as orange on my prospective roster right now - that's the wrong side of the 53 man bubble.

Yeah, this seems like it's now or never for both of these guys. The fact that both Lenoir and Womack jumped Thomas in the pecking order after closing out 2021 the way he did was really eye-opening, especially considering that the team really didn't want to put Womack on the field outside of garbage time. Thomas fell really far. 

Having Ward, Lenoir, and Oliver as our top 3 corners, we kind of have a void after them if we're reading the tea leaves correctly.

Fans (including myself) seem to like Womack more than the team does and Thomas is an after-thought at this point. But they're the best we have to come off the bench right now, which means we're probably going to add a vet and/or a day 2 pick to the corner group.  

 

[JIllg]

16 minutes ago, NinerNation21 said:

Yeah, this seems like it's now or never for both of these guys. The fact that both Lenoir and Womack jumped Thomas in the pecking order after closing out 2021 the way he did was really eye-opening, especially considering that the team really didn't want to put Womack on the field outside of garbage time. Thomas fell really far. 

Having Ward, Lenoir, and Oliver as our top 3 corners, we kind of have a void after them if we're reading the tea leaves correctly.

Fans (including myself) seem to like Womack more than the team does and Thomas is an after-thought at this point. But they're the best we have to come off the bench right now, which means we're probably going to add a vet and/or a day 2 pick to the corner group.  

 

Agreed. We may very well need an additional corner to round out that group satisfactorily. As for the O-line shake up, I wouldn't be surprised if they looked at Poe, Burford, and McKivitz as three guys for two starting spots with Burford getting a look at both RG and RT. Poe didn't get much roster love because he is just a guard, but he was the most promising young guy in training camp and preseason last year except maybe Burford in one on one situations and limited game time. I really think that Poe has the physical tools to be a starter and hope that he gets opportunities.  

[49erscap]

12 hours ago, NinerNation21 said:

It seems our OL is just about set.

Williams / Banks / Brendel / Burford / McKivitz

First guy off the bench: Feliciano

7th & 8th men: 2 of Moore, Zacklj, and Poe

I think we probably add a mid to late round rookie to compete for the 7th and 8th spot and/or practice squad to go along with Watson, Ismael, and a couple of UDFAs. 

It seems doubtful that we're going to sign a RT in free agency and I doubt we draft a tackle high unless they think he can compete from day one for serious playing time. Probably a McKivitz/Moore type guy in the 6th that can play both tackle and guard. 

This would be my OL for 2023- I would keep 9.

LT- Trent

LG- Banks

C- Brendel

RG- Burford

RT- McKivitz

C/OG- Feliciano 

OL- Zakelj

OL- Poe

RT- Rookie(trade up) or Moore