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Zeke Released by Cowboys


textaz03

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On 3/15/2023 at 11:07 AM, textaz03 said:


Jane needs to imply context on those 12 TD’s. More than half of those were within 5 yards or at goal line stances. 

I think if one wants to look at context we should also consider that the blocking in the running game was trash after Steele went down. People would see Zeke swarmed by a player or two immediately after the hand off and be like “WTF ZEKE SUCKS” as if he should have just been truck sticking everyone in his path and getting yard’s regardless of anything.

Pollard was largely performing the same way down the stretch but for some reason no one wants to talk about it. It’s one thing to talk about this from a money perspective, and certainly he isn’t what he used to be, but to say he’s washed is.. dumb. 

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1 hour ago, NoFlyZone said:

I think if one wants to look at context we should also consider that the blocking in the running game was trash after Steele went down. People would see Zeke swarmed by a player or two immediately after the hand off and be like “WTF ZEKE SUCKS” as if he should have just been truck sticking everyone in his path and getting yard’s regardless of anything.

Pollard was largely performing the same way down the stretch but for some reason no one wants to talk about it. It’s one thing to talk about this from a money perspective, and certainly he isn’t what he used to be, but to say he’s washed is.. dumb. 

You my friend have an eye for the field.

A big portion of Zeke's issues were not just from blocking, but look at the boxes Zeke ran against vs what Pollard had. Pollard came in when the play action was killing the safeties and corners. Zeke was in there before the playaction was a factor. 8 vs 5 or 7 vs 5 is a big, big difference.

Zeke isn't washed. He's just worn. He doesn't have that same explosive turn of the corner, or the same push through contract, or the jets through the hole he used to. But come on, guys only had like a million touches a year for almost a decade now (including college). But that doesn't mean his contact balance, vision, and ability to take a hit and still move have diminished. Some runners, after they lose a step, become better running backs because they rely on their veteran skills over their god given talents, and learn to grind the yards in a more efficient, albeit less explosive manner.

The real issue here is, Pollard is younger, has tremendous balance off contact, a gear Zeke hasn't had in 3 seasons at the least, and is a better overall fit for this more athletic blocking style Dallas deploys. In fact, one could argue that Zeke was NEVER a good fit system wise behind this blocking style. Murray? He did what he did because he was a perfect fit. Zeke did what he did because he was an otherworldly level of talent. If the fit was better, the man could have held a 2k season by now to his record.

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1 hour ago, NoFlyZone said:

I think if one wants to look at context we should also consider that the blocking in the running game was trash after Steele went down. People would see Zeke swarmed by a player or two immediately after the hand off and be like “WTF ZEKE SUCKS” as if he should have just been truck sticking everyone in his path and getting yard’s regardless of anything.

Pollard was largely performing the same way down the stretch but for some reason no one wants to talk about it. It’s one thing to talk about this from a money perspective, and certainly he isn’t what he used to be, but to say he’s washed is.. dumb. 

No it’s not dumb, and no Pollard wasn’t performing the same. He had over 5 YPC against the bucs in the playoffs when Zeke couldn’t hit 3 YPC. Anyone with eyes could see the team was more effective on the ground when TP was in.
 

I told you was washed mid season and here he is now a free agent. What’s dumb is you continuing to live in 2016. If Zeke was still what you believe he is, a team would have signed him immediately. Nothing is stopping them. Or perhaps we would have worked on a pay cut. But any intelligent decision maker can see tape and understand Zeke is nothing more than a backup at this point in his career, which makes him….. washed. 

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1 hour ago, NoFlyZone said:

I think if one wants to look at context we should also consider that the blocking in the running game was trash after Steele went down. People would see Zeke swarmed by a player or two immediately after the hand off and be like “WTF ZEKE SUCKS” as if he should have just been truck sticking everyone in his path and getting yard’s regardless of anything.

Pollard was largely performing the same way down the stretch but for some reason no one wants to talk about it. It’s one thing to talk about this from a money perspective, and certainly he isn’t what he used to be, but to say he’s washed is.. dumb. 

Oh, hate to.quote you again but also had to add one more point to your point -

Even when Zeke was out and Pollard was atop the depth chart. Who was in there against the tougher box? Who was in there hammering against the extra man when the pass wasn't really an option? Malik Davis. Not Pollard.

I love Pollard and his ability to stay on his feet despite his own blockers being shoved into him let alone a linebacker, is top tier. In fact, I think his ability to stay balanced despite contact is even better than Zeke's was at his peak. That said, Pollard is not the talent Zeke was. Pollards fit in a  wide angle, stretch style running game that gives him a zone option to go inside shoulder or outside shoulder, is perfect. A great fit for a runner who keeps balance probably as good as LeVeon Bell used to. 

But anyone expecting Pollard to be that grinder churning out first downs and asking to be fed after a tough 6 yard gain on 3rd and 3 (and deserving to be fed!) Like Zeke ... Is clearly not paying attention to the whole field.

McCarthy said he wants to run the ball. Pollard is the star. But the team needs a grinder if McCarthy was serious. And Pollard, after this tag year and assuming he hits a relatively easy milestone of 1200ish yards, is going to command a hefty pay day. Think the Joneses don't see that on the horizon? Think McCarthy is serious about wanting to run the ball?

Then expect a first or second round pick on a gifted runner with the ability to grind the clock. 

 

 

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12 minutes ago, DaBoys said:

No it’s not dumb, and no Pollard wasn’t performing the same. He had over 5 YPC against the bucs in the playoffs when Zeke couldn’t hit 3 YPC. Anyone with eyes could see the team was more effective on the ground when TP was in.
 

I told you was washed mid season and here he is now a free agent. What’s dumb is you continuing to live in 2016. If Zeke was still what you believe he is, a team would have signed him immediately. Nothing is stopping them. Or perhaps we would have worked on a pay cut. But any intelligent decision maker can see tape and understand Zeke is nothing more than a backup at this point in his career, which makes him….. washed. 

I disagree about Zeke being washed. Worn, not washed...(reasons listed in other posts) BUT that does not mean I disagree with you man.

Cause I do agree mostly...

Pollard has a bounce to his knees Zeke no longer has. A gear Zeke may have never really had. And his fit in this style of blocking (beat you off the snap, out hustle you to the contact, and play with your brain, feet and hands instead of just braun..athletic blocking) is A+. Pollard is better for the future, especially this coming season, for Dallas than Zeke. By a wide margin. Not even close really 

And that 5ypc against that very physical Tampa Bay down 4 and very athletic LB group is a clear testament to exactly what you are saying (minus the washed up thing. But to each their own dude)

Edited by Dallas94Ware
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23 minutes ago, Dallas94Ware said:

Even when Zeke was out and Pollard was atop the depth chart. Who was in there against the tougher box? Who was in there hammering against the extra man when the pass wasn't really an option? Malik Davis. Not Pollard.

This is simply untrue.

Zeke missed 2 games. What did TP do those two games? 36 carries 246 yards and 4 TDs rushing alone. 
 

Malik Davis got 8 carries in the first game, 5 of which came in the 4th quarter. He had 5 totes in game two and 4 of them came in the 2nd half. 
 

He was not in fact the early down dirty yards back. He barely played. 
 

But to really drive home the point, Malik Davis had 13 carries for 61 yards in the two games Zeke was out. That’s 4.69 YPC. Zeke was able to hit that mark just 4 times all year. (Only 3 times in games that he had 13 or more carries.)
 

Davis wasn’t doing anything more difficult than TP while Zeke was out and even if he was, he did it better than Zeke. 

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I told you mid season that Zeke might retire at the end of the year, and I’m not ruling that out. He’s done. Finished. Washed up. It’s over. The only team I could see giving him a chance is TB because they have Skip Pete. 
 

“Bob Sturm of The Athletic explains in a recent piece that scouts are whispering that Dallas Cowboys running back Ezekiel Elliott is done — without actually saying it. “He has very little left in his legs, and the word is out.” “

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1 hour ago, DaBoys said:

I told you mid season that Zeke might retire at the end of the year, and I’m not ruling that out. He’s done. Finished. Washed up. It’s over. The only team I could see giving him a chance is TB because they have Skip Pete. 
 

“Bob Sturm of The Athletic explains in a recent piece that scouts are whispering that Dallas Cowboys running back Ezekiel Elliott is done — without actually saying it. “He has very little left in his legs, and the word is out.” “

That wouldn't surprise me, honestly. Hate to see it, but wouldn't be surprising at all. 

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Just to put things in perspective Zeke is just 27 years old, but he has the miles of someone much older. 

He had 592 carries at Ohio st. And has had 1,881 carries in the NFL. That 2,473 carries since high school. 

Tony Pollard will be 26 this year. You might say, “wow that’s only two years younger than Zeke!” But TP was a backup in college and has been a backup in the NFL. He only got 139 carries in college. That’s less that 25% of Zekes college workload. TP has less NFL carries(510) than Zeke did in college(592)

# of carries (college plus NFL):

Zeke: 2,472

Tony: 649

Zeke is like a 2016 F-250 with 240k miles

Pollard is like a 2018 Honda Civic with 60k miles

Not a huge difference in age but a big difference in wear and tear. 

Let’s take it a step further…

The oldest active RB in the league in 2022 was saints RB Mark Ingram at age 34. He has 1,817 career NFL carries. Zeke had 1,881. Mark Ingram, like Zeke, was HEAVILY used in college at Alabama amassing 572 collegiate carries. 

At age 34 Ingram has 2,389 carries in college and NFL. Zeke, at age 27, has 2,473. 

He is the equivalent of a 34 year old RB. He has more carries than any active RB in the league, but he’s no where near the oldest. 

He is 48th all time in rushing attempts.

Some guys that surround him on that list and the age they were to get to those carries:

#47 Larry Csonka(33), #45 Jim Taylor(32), #51 Garrison Hearst(33), #43 Herschel Walker(35), #44 Stephan Davis(32), #49 Maurice Jones-Drew(29), #41 Rogar Craig(33), and #40 Ahman Green(32)

Then theres #48 Zeke(27)

giphy.gif

 

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17 hours ago, DaBoys said:

This is simply untrue.

Zeke missed 2 games. What did TP do those two games? 36 carries 246 yards and 4 TDs rushing alone. 
 

Malik Davis got 8 carries in the first game, 5 of which came in the 4th quarter. He had 5 totes in game two and 4 of them came in the 2nd half. 
 

He was not in fact the early down dirty yards back. He barely played. 
 

But to really drive home the point, Malik Davis had 13 carries for 61 yards in the two games Zeke was out. That’s 4.69 YPC. Zeke was able to hit that mark just 4 times all year. (Only 3 times in games that he had 13 or more carries.)
 

Davis wasn’t doing anything more difficult than TP while Zeke was out and even if he was, he did it better than Zeke. 

That 36 carries over two games though. That's my point. Another back was grinding those toughies out besides Pollard. 

36 Carries .. maybe a bit more than one games worth in Zeke's prime, but Zeke as a grinder was carrying it more than an average of 17 times a game man. 

Pollard is by far the better fit now and for the immediate future. Zeke, he punished his knees and it showed. This cut was a season overdue honestly. Not arguing that.

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16 hours ago, DaBoys said:

Just to put things in perspective Zeke is just 27 years old, but he has the miles of someone much older. 

He had 592 carries at Ohio st. And has had 1,881 carries in the NFL. That 2,473 carries since high school. 

Tony Pollard will be 26 this year. You might say, “wow that’s only two years younger than Zeke!” But TP was a backup in college and has been a backup in the NFL. He only got 139 carries in college. That’s less that 25% of Zekes college workload. TP has less NFL carries(510) than Zeke did in college(592)

# of carries (college plus NFL):

Zeke: 2,472

Tony: 649

Zeke is like a 2016 F-250 with 240k miles

Pollard is like a 2018 Honda Civic with 60k miles

Not a huge difference in age but a big difference in wear and tear. 

Let’s take it a step further…

The oldest active RB in the league in 2022 was saints RB Mark Ingram at age 34. He has 1,817 career NFL carries. Zeke had 1,881. Mark Ingram, like Zeke, was HEAVILY used in college at Alabama amassing 572 collegiate carries. 

At age 34 Ingram has 2,389 carries in college and NFL. Zeke, at age 27, has 2,473. 

He is the equivalent of a 34 year old RB. He has more carries than any active RB in the league, but he’s no where near the oldest. 

He is 48th all time in rushing attempts.

Some guys that surround him on that list and the age they were to get to those carries:

#47 Larry Csonka(33), #45 Jim Taylor(32), #51 Garrison Hearst(33), #43 Herschel Walker(35), #44 Stephan Davis(32), #49 Maurice Jones-Drew(29), #41 Rogar Craig(33), and #40 Ahman Green(32)

Then theres #48 Zeke(27)

giphy.gif

 

Exactly what I have been saying. The amount of touches, not even just carries (remember he had a 60 catch season with Dallas too) have worn his knees to a nub. It's no secret why the burst and explosion through contact is no longer there. Or why two seasons in a row he's dealt with knee issues. He's a grinder, not a guy slipping away from a would be tackler but rather powering away from someone actually tackling him. That's him abuse on those joints.

Some runners get like that, and learn to rely on their veteran instincts - vision, balance, patience, and knowing when to give up and fight another day and when that another day is right now - and actually become better backs because of it. They can no longer rely on those physical gifts they were blessed with to do all the work, and they find a way to stay consistent anyway. We never saw that from Zeke. We very well may with time, if he is willing to change. But we may not, if he continues to play like he's tough tougher, stronger, and more powerful than everyone trying to grab him - because he just no longer is.

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On 3/16/2023 at 10:05 PM, DaBoys said:

Just to put things in perspective Zeke is just 27 years old, but he has the miles of someone much older. 

He had 592 carries at Ohio st. And has had 1,881 carries in the NFL. That 2,473 carries since high school. 

Tony Pollard will be 26 this year. You might say, “wow that’s only two years younger than Zeke!” But TP was a backup in college and has been a backup in the NFL. He only got 139 carries in college. That’s less that 25% of Zekes college workload. TP has less NFL carries(510) than Zeke did in college(592)

# of carries (college plus NFL):

Zeke: 2,472

Tony: 649

Zeke is like a 2016 F-250 with 240k miles

Pollard is like a 2018 Honda Civic with 60k miles

Not a huge difference in age but a big difference in wear and tear. 

Let’s take it a step further…

The oldest active RB in the league in 2022 was saints RB Mark Ingram at age 34. He has 1,817 career NFL carries. Zeke had 1,881. Mark Ingram, like Zeke, was HEAVILY used in college at Alabama amassing 572 collegiate carries. 

At age 34 Ingram has 2,389 carries in college and NFL. Zeke, at age 27, has 2,473. 

He is the equivalent of a 34 year old RB. He has more carries than any active RB in the league, but he’s no where near the oldest. 

He is 48th all time in rushing attempts.

Some guys that surround him on that list and the age they were to get to those carries:

#47 Larry Csonka(33), #45 Jim Taylor(32), #51 Garrison Hearst(33), #43 Herschel Walker(35), #44 Stephan Davis(32), #49 Maurice Jones-Drew(29), #41 Rogar Craig(33), and #40 Ahman Green(32)

Then theres #48 Zeke(27)

giphy.gif

 

592 carries in college is insane. Zeke didn’t even get paid for that either. They really need to change that 3 year rule to declare for the NFL. 

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