Commanders not picking up Young's 5th year option.

[naptownskinsfan]

8 minutes ago, lavar703 said:

Having all of your DE ending up as free agents at the same time would be very Ron Rivera. This is the same guy who gutted our OL so he could sign his old Panther buddies. 

It is beyond frustrating to see all of this.  And the chances that both are not wearing a Commanders uniform in 2025 can not be overlooked either.  

[offbyone]

4 hours ago, turtle28 said:

I don’t agree with this for all the reasons I’ve mentioned for months, his age vs Montez’s age & the 5th-year option is cheaper than the franchise tag next year, plus, I don’t like having Chase & Tez’s contracts ending in the same offseason & them both being free agents next March.

But, I hope this works out for the best & Chase is motivated & focused more and has a double digit sack season and they sign him to a long term deal next March.

Yeah, the more I think about this, the more I think you have been right on this one.

I guess there are two options to solve this.

1)They have to extend either Sweat or Young before the end of the season

2)They trade one of them this year before the trade deadline.  

I think #2 is the best option because if I am these players I wait and put pressure on the team.

 

[Slappy Mc]

This really should surprise no one. As I said before there is a strong possibility that both players are not on the team next year.

Whether people want to admit it or not Chase Young has been a bust so far. His lone season he showed any promise he made DROY on potential/name value more than stats/performance. 

There is an argument to be made for Montez Sweat being retained as he is both decent in the run game and an adequate pass rushers. As long as he doesn't get top dollar, I would be okay with an extension (but I need to see double digit sacks). 

At this point trading Chase Young would be our best move, but would prove very tricky. His value is very low. If someone were to trade for him, it's off potential more than anything. But the biggest issue is how he is "valued" here. Former #2 overall pick, generational prospect, and local boy.

I don't think he ends up getting traded, but I also do believe this is his last year in Washington. 

 

For those upset about declining the 5th year option, if it was your money, I guarantee you would do the same thing. 

If I pay a company to do a job for 3 years and never got satisfactory results past the first go, I'm cutting ties and finding someone that can do the job. Simple economics.

[lavar703]

32 minutes ago, Slappy Mc said:

This really should surprise no one. As I said before there is a strong possibility that both players are not on the team next year.

Whether people want to admit it or not Chase Young has been a bust so far. His lone season he showed any promise he made DROY on potential/name value more than stats/performance. 

There is an argument to be made for Montez Sweat being retained as he is both decent in the run game and an adequate pass rushers. As long as he doesn't get top dollar, I would be okay with an extension (but I need to see double digit sacks). 

At this point trading Chase Young would be our best move, but would prove very tricky. His value is very low. If someone were to trade for him, it's off potential more than anything. But the biggest issue is how he is "valued" here. Former #2 overall pick, generational prospect, and local boy.

I don't think he ends up getting traded, but I also do believe this is his last year in Washington. 

 

For those upset about declining the 5th year option, if it was your money, I guarantee you would do the same thing. 

If I pay a company to do a job for 3 years and never got satisfactory results past the first go, I'm cutting ties and finding someone that can do the job. Simple economics.

I just don't agree. There is no viable replacement as every single DE on the roster is approaching free agency in 2024. The tag goes up to $24M for DE next off-season (per Standig and Nicky J) so you would've saved around $6M just by picking up is option if he plays well.  I also don't trust Rivera to adequately replace Sweat and Young if they're both gone and honestly if it shakes out that way he should never be allowed near a teams front office again. I figured he would've learned his lesson after the Norwell/Turner debacle.

[Slappy Mc]

43 minutes ago, lavar703 said:

I just don't agree. There is no viable replacement as every single DE on the roster is approaching free agency in 2024.

I'll break this into sections. 

First, replacing Chase Youngs production is easy. 31.5 tackles and 1.5 sacks in two years with a total of 12 games play in that same span. Let's not act like his production is what is keeping him here. He is here simply because of his potential and draft capital used to get him. Had he been a later round pick or UDFA, they would have cut ties already. 

43 minutes ago, lavar703 said:

The tag goes up to $24M for DE next off-season (per Standig and Nicky J) so you would've saved around $6M just by picking up is option if he plays well. 

So this is with the mindset of him performing well enough to warrant an extension or the tag. Most fans here have been completely in denial that there is even a possibility that Chase just doesn't ever return to his above average form from his rookie season. The fact is, by denying his 5th year option, they saved a guaranteed 17.45M that would have been paid to him whether he returned to form or not. This is on top of his salary this season of just under 5.5M. 

43 minutes ago, lavar703 said:

I also don't trust Rivera to adequately replace Sweat and Young if they're both gone and honestly if it shakes out that way he should never be allowed near a teams front office again. I figured he would've learned his lesson after the Norwell/Turner debacle.

I think we are all in agreement that, barring a deep playoff run, this will be Ron and Co's last ride here. He won't need to replace them as someone else will do the replacing. Chase and Montez will play out their contracts this year and the new staff will evaluate who, if anyone, deserves to be extended/tagged. 

Edited April 27, 2023 by Slappy Mc

[turtle28]

4 hours ago, lavar703 said:

Having all of your DE ending up as free agents at the same time would be very Ron Rivera. This is the same guy who gutted our OL so he could sign his old Panther buddies. 

[Slappy Mc]

For context, Casey Toohill, Efe Obada and James Smith-Williams all had roughly the same stats this past season. Only Toohill came in under Young's 1.5 sack by a half sack, while Obada and JSM finished with 4 and 3 sacks respectively. Toohill played 16 games, Obada played 17 and JSM played in 14. 

[MikeT14]

I mean it's a fair point. We could always SIGN someone else...

[turtle28]

1 hour ago, offbyone said:

Yeah, the more I think about this, the more I think you have been right on this one.

I guess there are two options to solve this.

1)They have to extend either Sweat or Young before the end of the season

2)They trade one of them this year before the trade deadline.  

I think #2 is the best option because if I am these players I wait and put pressure on the team.

 

I’ve been thinking they should trade Tez during the draft & draft a DE in R2 or maybe even R1 eventhough I wouldn’t love it.

The issue with trading Tez right now is he’s the only DE we have who’s really proven that he’s more than a serviceable player. 
 

We all hope Chase will finally reach his potential but we don’t know, and the rest of our guys - JSW, Obada & Toohill are just serviceable.

I think it’s more likely/makes more sense to franchise & trade one of them next March but, if Chase doesn’t play well & hits FA we might be losing him for nothing or a late round comp pick if he won’t re-sign. 
 

All I know is our front office has now made a mess of our DE situation by having both Chase & Tez’s contracts ending in the same offseason.

[turtle28]

Just now, MikeT14 said:

I mean it's a fair point. We could always SIGN someone else...

Great DEs rarely come available in FA. We’ll probably be drafting another DE next draft in round 2 or something. We’ll see it’s anyone’s guess right now.

[turtle28]

7 minutes ago, Slappy Mc said:

For context, Casey Toohill, Efe Obada and James Smith-Williams all had roughly the same stats this past season. Only Toohill came in under Young's 1.5 sack by a half sack, while Obada and JSM finished with 4 and 3 sacks respectively. Toohill played 16 games, Obada played 17 and JSM played in 14. 

For context, that was 1/2 a season in 2021 & none of them had 2 sacks taken away for bogus roughing the passer calls. Beyond that, when you watch the tape there’s an obvious difference in the impact Chase has on every play vs those other guys, even if he’s not getting the stats which is all you care about. Chase got a lot of pressures in his 1/2 of a season in 2021 which caused early throws, incompletions & interceptions. Film don’t lie

Edited April 27, 2023 by turtle28

[turtle28]

16 minutes ago, Slappy Mc said:

So this is with the mindset of him performing well enough to warrant an extension or the tag. Most fans here have been completely in denial that there is even a possibility that Chase just doesn't ever return to his above average form from his rookie season.

I don’t think people are in denial that that could happen, but I’m not going to openly suggest it could happen bc I’d like to think it won’t. We will see what happens, right now I’m not trying to think bad thoughts of another top 5 pick for this team never reaching his potential; Howard, Shuler, Westbrook, Lavar & RG3 come to mind and then Sean Taylor got killed.

I'm trying to think good thoughts until I now otherwise.

[MikeT14]

3 minutes ago, turtle28 said:

Great DEs rarely come available in FA. We’ll probably be drafting another DE next draft in round 2 or something. We’ll see it’s anyone’s guess right now.

Maybe, maybe not. Guys like Davenport, Ngakoue, Allen, all switched teams. I dunno how good Quinn still is. 

[lavar703]

13 minutes ago, Slappy Mc said:

For context, Casey Toohill, Efe Obada and James Smith-Williams all had roughly the same stats this past season. Only Toohill came in under Young's 1.5 sack by a half sack, while Obada and JSM finished with 4 and 3 sacks respectively. Toohill played 16 games, Obada played 17 and JSM played in 14. 

Chase Young PFF 78.4

Casey Toohill PFF 64.9

Efe Obada PFF 55.5

JSW PFF 59.8

According to PFF they weren't roughly the same. Chase was graded as starter level the rest were graded as back up or replaceable.

[turtle28]

6 minutes ago, MikeT14 said:

Maybe, maybe not. Guys like Davenport, Ngakoue, Allen, all switched teams. I dunno how good Quinn still is. 

As free agents. So yeah, if he’s a free agent. Obviously it can happen. I sure hope it doesn’t get to that point, but I do understand why you think it’s inevitable.