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2024 NFL Draft

Humble_Beast

By Humble_Beast
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NYRaider

NYRaider

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2 hours ago, big_palooka said:

Might want go take a look at USC QBs produced before making broad statements.

How many of those guys played under Lincoln Riley? 

They said the same thing about Ohio State, doesn't seem to be hurting Stroud. 

Lincoln Riley coached up Jalen Hurts, Kyler Murray, and Baker Mayfield. 

But again, Caleb is an all star prospect, he will not be on Ziegler's radar.

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NYRaider

NYRaider

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1 hour ago, ronjon1990 said:

Aside from Hurts...who he only had for 1 season, that's really not all that impressive 

Kyler is above average and Baker is about average, Hurts is a superstar. What other program in the country has produced a better group of QBs?

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ronjon1990

ronjon1990

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14 minutes ago, NYRaider said:

Kyler is above average and Baker is about average, Hurts is a superstar. What other program in the country has produced a better group of QBs?

Sarkisian could lay claim with Tua, Mac, Hurts, Young, and now Ewers. 

But let's be real, "QB factories" may churn out average-above average QBs here and there, but the true studs aren't coming from them. 

Mahomes- random TTech, Rodgers- Cal, Lawrence- only real QB prospect Clemson had, Allen- Wyoming, Wilson- NCSt/Wisconsin, Brees- Purdue, Burrow- LSU, so on so forth. 

I don't want a great college QB that's average in the NFL. 

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Devilshark69

Devilshark69

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6 hours ago, NYRaider said:

Kyler is above average and Baker is about average, Hurts is a superstar. What other program in the country has produced a better group of QBs?

Kyler is above average but mayfield is average? Both are average, but kyler is a top notch headcase. Lol! 

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NYRaider

NYRaider

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8 hours ago, ronjon1990 said:

Sarkisian could lay claim with Tua, Mac, Hurts, Young, and now Ewers. 

But let's be real, "QB factories" may churn out average-above average QBs here and there, but the true studs aren't coming from them. 

Mahomes- random TTech, Rodgers- Cal, Lawrence- only real QB prospect Clemson had, Allen- Wyoming, Wilson- NCSt/Wisconsin, Brees- Purdue, Burrow- LSU, so on so forth. 

I don't want a great college QB that's average in the NFL. 

Caleb looks like he’s going to be unstoppable son

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ronjon1990

ronjon1990

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43 minutes ago, NYRaider said:

Caleb looks like he’s going to be unstoppable son

Caleb reminds me a lot of Johnny Manziel on and off the field. His mechanics are better- I thought Manziel's were a mess. but he's too reliant on highlight reel plays against inferior competition amd his attitude is questionable. Perhaps "attitude" is a bit broad, so we'll tailor it down to "priorities". 

Kyler is similar- his mechanics were far better than Manziel's, but still a bit wonky. He thrives outside of structure, but teams (good teams, not the 2022 Raiders) learned pretty quickly how to negate Kyler's penchant for playing school yard ball. But, Murray has been at least serviceable as a starter unlike Manziel. I will give him that. But serviceable is not good for a QB1. Moreover, Kyler's priorities haven't been conducive to the NFL. He's chased the money, not the glory, and his work ethic- something that was hailed as great coming out- has been largely lacking. 

Caleb strikes me as the $ chaser, not the QB that wants to be great to be a great QB. I don't even really blame him as the whole NIL thing has become a farce itself. But it's a red flag for me. He's great in college, particularly when freelancing, but he makes no bones about the NIL deals and talks of returning to school depending on who holds the top pick(s). 

That rubs me the wrong way. It rubbed me the wrong way when Kyler expressed similar sentiment, it rubbed me the wrong way when Eli got Archie to piss and moan about the Chargers drafting him. It bugged me in the past, it will big me in the future. Why? Because I don't think Caleb (or any draft eligible player for that matter) sees the NFL as anything more than a quick money grab and fears that they won't make as much if a bad team drafts them and they struggle to land the same level of endorsements and media adulation. At that point, I question their heart, dedication, and their belief in themselves. I have absolutely zero doubt practically every top prospect shares that sentiment in silence, but for someone to outright say it....no thanks. 

I think Caleb comes in with a ton of hype and becomes an almost immediate prima donna headache, flashes some tantalizing potential here and there, gets 1 big payday and falls off the map or holds out for a trade to somewhere he wants to go. He wants too much- to be the star, to be paid, to be adored...those are normal. To be in total control of where he goes is a step too far for me. That's NIL/transfer portal mentality, and I honestly think the NFL is going to be a rude awakening for a lot of college players as time goes on and they realize their star at the NFL level will never shine quite as bright as at the college level. 

Had I continued to play in college and made it far enough to get drafted, I 100% would have wanted to be a star, get paid big bucks, and play for the Raiders specifically. I would've thrown up if the Chiefs or Broncos or Chargers or 9ers drafted me (I would've retired on the spot if the Browns did, but that's a whole different story). I would've held my breath every time the Jets or Rams pick came around. But I would have never vocalized that feeling. It's disrespectful to other draftees who fought and clawed in hopes of any team choosing them, every UDFA in waiting hoping for a phone call, and every staff/framchise that spent time and resources to scout me. That's not where leaders come from, it's how targets are placed squarely on your back. 

And right now, that's where I see Caleb Williams trending towards. It's not a matter of who's *** he chaps- owners, coaches, fellow players, fans- but how many he ultimately chaps. To me, it's got all the makings of a disaster for a franchise just waiting to happen. And that's why I'd go with Maye or any of the other top tier guys- they simply haven't rubbed me the wrong way to the same degree. 

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big_palooka

big_palooka

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10 minutes ago, ronjon1990 said:

Caleb reminds me a lot of Johnny Manziel on and off the field. His mechanics are better- I thought Manziel's were a mess. but he's too reliant on highlight reel plays against inferior competition amd his attitude is questionable. Perhaps "attitude" is a bit broad, so we'll tailor it down to "priorities". 

Kyler is similar- his mechanics were far better than Manziel's, but still a bit wonky. He thrives outside of structure, but teams (good teams, not the 2022 Raiders) learned pretty quickly how to negate Kyler's penchant for playing school yard ball. But, Murray has been at least serviceable as a starter unlike Manziel. I will give him that. But serviceable is not good for a QB1. Moreover, Kyler's priorities haven't been conducive to the NFL. He's chased the money, not the glory, and his work ethic- something that was hailed as great coming out- has been largely lacking. 

Caleb strikes me as the $ chaser, not the QB that wants to be great to be a great QB. I don't even really blame him as the whole NIL thing has become a farce itself. But it's a red flag for me. He's great in college, particularly when freelancing, but he makes no bones about the NIL deals and talks of returning to school depending on who holds the top pick(s). 

That rubs me the wrong way. It rubbed me the wrong way when Kyler expressed similar sentiment, it rubbed me the wrong way when Eli got Archie to piss and moan about the Chargers drafting him. It bugged me in the past, it will big me in the future. Why? Because I don't think Caleb (or any draft eligible player for that matter) sees the NFL as anything more than a quick money grab and fears that they won't make as much if a bad team drafts them and they struggle to land the same level of endorsements and media adulation. At that point, I question their heart, dedication, and their belief in themselves. I have absolutely zero doubt practically every top prospect shares that sentiment in silence, but for someone to outright say it....no thanks. 

I think Caleb comes in with a ton of hype and becomes an almost immediate prima donna headache, flashes some tantalizing potential here and there, gets 1 big payday and falls off the map or holds out for a trade to somewhere he wants to go. He wants too much- to be the star, to be paid, to be adored...those are normal. To be in total control of where he goes is a step too far for me. That's NIL/transfer portal mentality, and I honestly think the NFL is going to be a rude awakening for a lot of college players as time goes on and they realize their star at the NFL level will never shine quite as bright as at the college level. 

Had I continued to play in college and made it far enough to get drafted, I 100% would have wanted to be a star, get paid big bucks, and play for the Raiders specifically. I would've thrown up if the Chiefs or Broncos or Chargers or 9ers drafted me (I would've retired on the spot if the Browns did, but that's a whole different story). I would've held my breath every time the Jets or Rams pick came around. But I would have never vocalized that feeling. It's disrespectful to other draftees who fought and clawed in hopes of any team choosing them, every UDFA in waiting hoping for a phone call, and every staff/framchise that spent time and resources to scout me. That's not where leaders come from, it's how targets are placed squarely on your back. 

And right now, that's where I see Caleb Williams trending towards. It's not a matter of who's *** he chaps- owners, coaches, fellow players, fans- but how many he ultimately chaps. To me, it's got all the makings of a disaster for a franchise just waiting to happen. And that's why I'd go with Maye or any of the other top tier guys- they simply haven't rubbed me the wrong way to the same degree. 

What, outside the finger nail painting thing a year ago points to any of this "diva" talk?

He seems pretty goal oriented by all accounts. Put in the work and is a great teammate. 

Off the field and his NIL money, he's pretty much debunked your whole narrative:

https://reignoftroy.com/posts/usc-trojans-qb-caleb-williams-is-as-great-off-field-as-he-is-on-it

 

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