CWood21 Posted April 23 Share Posted April 23 4 hours ago, packfanfb said: We were talking about the variance of opinion on Suamataia yesterday... Not surprising at all. You look at the athleticism and tools, that's a clear Day 1 prospect. You put on the tape, he's a clear day 2 prospect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sgtcheezwiz Posted April 23 Share Posted April 23 As far as trading up, I would trade up a few spots for DeJean but I am counteracting the loss of draft picks with a trade down from 41. Even without the trade up, I love the idea above of trading down from 41 and moving up one or both of the third round picks. Would be able to package the 4th round pick we gain with 88 or 91 to move up and get somebody. As for trading down from 25, I think that we will have potential trade partners due to a falling receiver or one of the athletic tackles. Again, gives you tons of ammo to move up in day three to get the guys you want - and there seem to be plenty of options in that range. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NFLGURU Posted April 23 Share Posted April 23 18 minutes ago, sgtcheezwiz said: As far as trading up, I would trade up a few spots for DeJean but I am counteracting the loss of draft picks with a trade down from 41. Even without the trade up, I love the idea above of trading down from 41 and moving up one or both of the third round picks. Would be able to package the 4th round pick we gain with 88 or 91 to move up and get somebody. As for trading down from 25, I think that we will have potential trade partners due to a falling receiver or one of the athletic tackles. Again, gives you tons of ammo to move up in day three to get the guys you want - and there seem to be plenty of options in that range. I think Kool Aid is a strong candidate to be on the Packers whether it's at #25 or a trade up from #41 if we take someone else at #25 other than DeJean. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sgtcheezwiz Posted April 23 Share Posted April 23 6 minutes ago, NFLGURU said: I think Kool Aid is a strong candidate to be on the Packers whether it's at #25 or a trade up from #41 if we take someone else at #25 other than DeJean. He is probably one of the very, very few guys I would see them trading back into the first round for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kampfgeist Posted April 23 Share Posted April 23 (edited) 3 hours ago, packfanfb said: Telling you guys...the buzz is real. Also, I'm not sure any prospect has been more slept on this entire cycle than Junior Colson. Doesn't help that he didn't test during the pre-draft process, but speaking as a certainly biased Michigan guy, Colson can flat out play and he's a great culture guy. If we go ILB in early round 2 and it's not Cooper, I'd be perfectly content with Colson. Sell me on Colson. I'm not sure I've seen a player talked about as highly as him that has such an empty statistical profile. More assists than solos every year, 2.5 sacks career total (2 in 2022 0 in 2023) 5 passes defensed career total (no more than 2 in any season), 8.5 tackles for loss career total (6 in 2022 and only 2 in 2023) -0- career forced fumbles -0- career interceptions. More assists than solos, almost all tackles beyond the line of scrimmage and total lack of any impact plays Obviously Michigan had a fantastic defense and Colson and Sainristil get much of the credit nationally and I know Colson won numerous defensive player of the week awards, but I'm just amazed at the total lack of any impact statistics other than total tackles (solos+assists). There's value in an "assignment sure" player but is that enough for a top 60 player? I've tried to watch as many highlight and single game videos as I could on Colson but haven't felt whelmed. So to be clear - not trying to start an argument - I'm genuinely interested to hear from those that are really biased towards Colson or have watched him and come away with a different impression than mine as to what I'm missing or should expect, because clearly a lot of people like him early in the Draft. EDIT: ***Over the last two seasons 5'9" 182 lb Mike Sainristil had 10.5 tackles for loss, 3 sacks, 2 forced fumbles and then obviously the INT's and PD's were substantially higher based on position Edited April 23 by Kampfgeist 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VonKarman Posted April 23 Share Posted April 23 The biggest thing with Colson for me is that he does everything OK. Having on the field a high-effort guy at ILB that won't embarrass himself during his rookie year is a great thing to have. ILB is a position where it's better to be OK at everything, rather than being great vs the pass and poor vs the run or viceversa. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vegas492 Posted April 23 Share Posted April 23 23 minutes ago, Kampfgeist said: Sell me on Colson. I'm not sure I've seen a player talked about as highly as him that has such an empty statistical profile. More assists than solos every year, 2.5 sacks career total (2 in 2022 0 in 2023) 5 passes defensed career total (no more than 2 in any season), 8.5 tackles for loss career total (6 in 2022 and only 2 in 2023) -0- career forced fumbles -0- career interceptions. More assists than solos, almost all tackles beyond the line of scrimmage and total lack of any impact plays Obviously Michigan had a fantastic defense and Colson and Sainristil get much of the credit nationally and I know Colson won numerous defensive player of the week awards, but I'm just amazed at the total lack of any impact statistics other than total tackles (solos+assists). There's value in an "assignment sure" player but is that enough for a top 60 player? I've tried to watch as many highlight and single game videos as I could on Colson but haven't felt whelmed. So to be clear - not trying to start an argument - I'm genuinely interested to hear from those that are really biased towards Colson or have watched him and come away with a different impression than mine as to what I'm missing or should expect, because clearly a lot of people like him early in the Draft. Remember when Gary was coming out and there were a few of his teammates saying it was Gary who set them up for success? Yah, Colson is not Gary. But, with his football IQ, things just get better with him manning the middle. Little things get cleaned up. He isn't dynamic. He's not really a fast sideline to sideline guy. And I don't think he's a Will. He's a Mike. And he's steady. I think he will be like the kid in Tampa (Britt, I believe) who supplanted White at ILB because he was assignment sure and a very good tackler. That's my view, at least. Freely admit to being wrong, but one has to think that Colson is a kid who loves football, understands football and who may be just scratching the surface of his potential, because he hasn't played all that long. Lots of upside there. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thrILL! Posted April 23 Share Posted April 23 6 hours ago, ReasonablySober said: PFF hates the "All Visits" mock.* *almost all. There’s no chance that Cooper falls to 58 and yet even there, additionally a position of great need for us, he only gets a C. lol PFF. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
packfanfb Posted April 23 Share Posted April 23 1 hour ago, Kampfgeist said: Sell me on Colson. I'm not sure I've seen a player talked about as highly as him that has such an empty statistical profile. More assists than solos every year, 2.5 sacks career total (2 in 2022 0 in 2023) 5 passes defensed career total (no more than 2 in any season), 8.5 tackles for loss career total (6 in 2022 and only 2 in 2023) -0- career forced fumbles -0- career interceptions. More assists than solos, almost all tackles beyond the line of scrimmage and total lack of any impact plays Obviously Michigan had a fantastic defense and Colson and Sainristil get much of the credit nationally and I know Colson won numerous defensive player of the week awards, but I'm just amazed at the total lack of any impact statistics other than total tackles (solos+assists). There's value in an "assignment sure" player but is that enough for a top 60 player? I've tried to watch as many highlight and single game videos as I could on Colson but haven't felt whelmed. So to be clear - not trying to start an argument - I'm genuinely interested to hear from those that are really biased towards Colson or have watched him and come away with a different impression than mine as to what I'm missing or should expect, because clearly a lot of people like him early in the Draft. I think he's the best "Mike" LB in this draft. I like guys, especially on defense, who play in systems that translate to the NFL. Michigan's defense is as complex as any pro-style defense. Hell, McDonald was the hottest thing around last year and he ran the Michigan defense in Baltimore. Colson has genuine experience in a complex scheme where the LBs have to drop, blitz, play the run, and he did everything. By the end, he played through 2 broken hands and was still effective. He doesn't have the pure race-horse athleticism as Cooper, but that may actually make him a better fit in GB if they think Quay is going to be around for at least a few more years. I think Colson is the better player at the point of attack in the run game. Now all this being said, I would not want Colson at 25. If the "first round buzz" is real, let someone else have him. But in round 2, I'm game. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChaRisMa Posted April 23 Share Posted April 23 (edited) 5 hours ago, wgbeethree said: No. There's significant variances based on the coin, the flipping technique, and which side is facing up when tossed. And yes, I am fun at parties. Because of these factors, I can flip a coin and make it land on the side of my choosing based on which side faces up when I flip it. This power has been used for evil. Edited April 23 by ChaRisMa 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
packfanfb Posted April 23 Share Posted April 23 Will over here speaking my language. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OneTwoSixFive Posted April 23 Share Posted April 23 (edited) You don't like Colson at, say, 58 ? Get Eichenberg in the 4th instead. Not as athletic as Colson, but reliable and smart as a Mike. I would want to see him run in the 4.7 area, though. Edited April 23 by OneTwoSixFive Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mazrimiv Posted April 23 Share Posted April 23 44 minutes ago, thrILL! said: There’s no chance that Cooper falls to 58 and yet even there, additionally a position of great need for us, he only gets a C. lol PFF. As far as PFF is concerned, you are either a PFF lemming or you are a terrible drafter. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
packfanfb Posted April 23 Share Posted April 23 Welp, Bob picked DeJean so cross him off the list for 25. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWood21 Posted April 23 Share Posted April 23 6 hours ago, craig said: Dumb question. Do the trade charts already factor in the value of 5th-year option for 1st-rounders? I'm looking at a Drafttek chart and they do **not** seem to consider that. I'm kinda wondering whether giving away that 5th option year is more costly than we appreciate, when we consider small trade-downs from back-of-1st into front-of-2nd round? *IF* the player is a success (sure hoping so....), losing that year of club control is a bummer. Also pushes up extension decisions sooner. More time to track the player, see how he handles success, see whether he keeps improving or maybe stalls or relapses a little? Sometimes extension assumes arrow-up and that a guy will just keep improving, which doesn't always prove true. They shouldn't. Because there's very few players where you'll pick up a 5th year option but aren't considering extending the guy. And Jordan Love isn't a good example. You've got guys who are pretty much locks not to be picked up, and those that are getting their options picked up likely aren't playing on that 5th year option unless it's a situation like Tua where it's more of an injury concern. That 5th year option value is overstated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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