Rockice_8 Posted August 23, 2017 Share Posted August 23, 2017 You'll know if the D is good or not, it won't matter what the rankings say. The fact is we are doing the right things by going young. Face it, we were a treadmill team by being too good for a top 3 pick and too bad for the playoffs. Enough of these types of seasons where we can't get our QBOTF and have to hope a 2 round QB develops like Carr. Hack will see the field, he will likely suck, and we hopefully will be in position to land a franchise QB this year. I would go hard for a LT in round 2 next year in hopes that we can improve the line because the FA market at LT is weak. WR is straight up stacked so I would have no issue going all in for A-Rob, Hopkins, Moncrief etc. That way next year when Q is back he can stay in the slot with Hopkins/A-Rob at X, Anderson at Z and Q at the Y. That give who ever we draft a fighting chance to grow with 3 very young talented WR's. A mid round RB and C would cap off a solid offseason for our young QB. We'd still have holes at #1 CB, OLB opposite Jenkins and MLB next to Lee on defense but the D will be good enough since next year is all about the offense and QB development for our hopefully #1 pick. LT, WR, C and RB need to be high priorities along with Shell stepping up this year at RT. EDIT: Plus I wouldn't mind taking a shot at a cast off like Hill who is still 24 to pair with Powell/McGuire as 3rd down backs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jag68Sid87 Posted August 23, 2017 Share Posted August 23, 2017 I don't know if Maccagnan can survive beyond this season. I doubt Bowles will, almost regardless of record. I am concerned about Maccagnan's drafting, for sure. But, I look at the defense and I say to myself that it is good enough to win games. I truly believe that. Yeah there are a couple of holes, but which defense doesn't? So, if we can build an offense to match THIS defense, I think we will be a playoff team. But, of course, that's a big if. I am not sure why people are upset that we're going with McCown. We literally have only one NFL-caliber QB on our roster. Yeah, he happens to be the 38-year-old, but if you want to develop some young O-lineman, if you want to develop some young wideouts, some young tight ends, perhaps a McGuire in the backfield, then you have to give them a real QB. Also, if you want to keep developing the defense and turn it back into a dominant unit like we used to have, then we need to provide them with the best QB, too. Hackenberg is a nightmare. It would not be fair to every other position we are trying to develop to put in a guy who cannot play. I'd like to see us bring in another QB or two to compete with McCown this year. We are going to look for the franchise QB in the draft, regardless. But it would be nice to build up the depth a little and also seek out our next long-term backup. I don't know why we haven't brought in Griffin III already. What would be the harm? He is clearly better than either Hackenberg and Petty. And he's not ancient. Kaep, I get why we haven't (though the more people kneel, the less emphasis on Kaep there could be). TO me, it makes no sense that there are better players on the street than the guys we have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rickyt31 Posted August 23, 2017 Share Posted August 23, 2017 I can see us winning 2-3 games because of the defense. With preseason cuts coming up, I want to see Macc take a shot at a potential player at LT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doumeyer Posted August 24, 2017 Share Posted August 24, 2017 15 hours ago, Jag68Sid87 said: I don't know if Maccagnan can survive beyond this season. I doubt Bowles will, almost regardless of record. I am concerned about Maccagnan's drafting, for sure. But, I look at the defense and I say to myself that it is good enough to win games. I truly believe that. Yeah there are a couple of holes, but which defense doesn't? So, if we can build an offense to match THIS defense, I think we will be a playoff team. But, of course, that's a big if. I am not sure why people are upset that we're going with McCown. We literally have only one NFL-caliber QB on our roster. Yeah, he happens to be the 38-year-old, but if you want to develop some young O-lineman, if you want to develop some young wideouts, some young tight ends, perhaps a McGuire in the backfield, then you have to give them a real QB. Also, if you want to keep developing the defense and turn it back into a dominant unit like we used to have, then we need to provide them with the best QB, too. Hackenberg is a nightmare. It would not be fair to every other position we are trying to develop to put in a guy who cannot play. I'd like to see us bring in another QB or two to compete with McCown this year. We are going to look for the franchise QB in the draft, regardless. But it would be nice to build up the depth a little and also seek out our next long-term backup. I don't know why we haven't brought in Griffin III already. What would be the harm? He is clearly better than either Hackenberg and Petty. And he's not ancient. Kaep, I get why we haven't (though the more people kneel, the less emphasis on Kaep there could be). TO me, it makes no sense that there are better players on the street than the guys we have. You have some good points, the only problem is we all went thru two years of Fitz & I have no interest to watch a guy who will be 39 this season to play QB, he is a life time back up. I agree with you why not give Griffin 111 a shot. I have absolutely no confidence in Macc'S DRAFTING abilities. L Williams & Adams fell to us at six so drafting them was a no brainer, just look at all his high round picks who failed it is enough to make you vomit. He could have gotten a top running with our second round pick & could have gotten a very good center in a later round, but as usual he failed. This is what happens when you have a weak owner, you end up with a lousy GM & head coach and we have both. If for some reason Hack fails ( I sure hope not ) that will be the straw that brakes Macc. My one man crusade to dump Macc continues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rdelaney89 Posted August 24, 2017 Share Posted August 24, 2017 Macc will not be fired, he made a potent offense year 1 to make a final playoff push with our aging vets that still had contracts. Year 2 we thought there was enough gas in the tank for one more run at it, unfortunately there wasn't so we cut bait with all the dead weight with little to no effect on the cap. Now we are playing our young players to see who is worth investing and who we need to move on from. The defense looks complete to me, I actually really like Lee and Davis in the middle. We are going to see if Hack can play while setting ourselves up for a top 3 pick and prepping for an $80M spending spree on offense next season. Macc very clearly has a plan and it's the right one. I have no problem with the way we are going about this season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rdelaney89 Posted August 24, 2017 Share Posted August 24, 2017 I'll add this too: If we can develop young players then as long as we land a top 5 pick or find our QBOTF in Hack then this was a successful season. If McCown starts and wins us 7 games then yea I'll be upset since we'll have to trade the farm to get up to #1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockice_8 Posted August 24, 2017 Share Posted August 24, 2017 9 hours ago, doumeyer said: You have some good points, the only problem is we all went thru two years of Fitz & I have no interest to watch a guy who will be 39 this season to play QB, he is a life time back up. I agree with you why not give Griffin 111 a shot. I have absolutely no confidence in Macc'S DRAFTING abilities. L Williams & Adams fell to us at six so drafting them was a no brainer, just look at all his high round picks who failed it is enough to make you vomit. He could have gotten a top running with our second round pick & could have gotten a very good center in a later round, but as usual he failed. This is what happens when you have a weak owner, you end up with a lousy GM & head coach and we have both. If for some reason Hack fails ( I sure hope not ) that will be the straw that brakes Macc. My one man crusade to dump Macc continues. The draft is a crap shoot even the great ones have crappy drafts. If you are around for a few years you are going to have a few bad picks. I doubt you had an issue with the Mac signing as he was finally a life long scout who supposedly had an eye for talent so I don't see why you are blaming ownership. They do enough dumb stuff but getting a GM with a football mind was the right thing. You lose a ton of credibility bringing up RGIII. If he was still an option as a franchise QB then why does he not have a job somewhere in camp? Because he's not. that's why. One of the worst things I continue to read on this site is how Mac gets no credit for Williams and Adams because they fell to us. Either way he's made some good draft moves like Simon, Shell, Peake Anderson, Jenkins, Lee, WIlliams, Burris who look like NFL players and some bad ones like Smith, Mauldin, Harrison, Petty, Hack. Overall he's just been so so, not horriblebut not great either. I think they're both on a short leach this year if some of the young guys don't improve or the locker room is broken again. When it's all said and done I think both come back in 2018 and if the direction doesn't improve in 2018 with a young QB looking like a franchise guy we will have a completely new regime before the start of the 2019 season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rickyt31 Posted August 24, 2017 Share Posted August 24, 2017 8 good draft picks & $80M+ next offseason. Macc created himself a safety net for his job. Could land another pick if they are looking to trade Richardson before the deadline. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doumeyer Posted August 24, 2017 Share Posted August 24, 2017 36 minutes ago, rickyt31 said: 8 good draft picks & $80M+ next offseason. Macc created himself a safety net for his job. Could land another pick if they are looking to trade Richardson before the deadline. Just like last year he wanted to stock pile draft picks and what did he do, he gave away a third round pick for nothing. If Hack can't start this year then he blow another high draft pick. The current GM has had three off season to find a NFL QB, and we are going to start another season with a washed up bum who was never any good at QB for the 2017 season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ekill08x Posted August 24, 2017 Share Posted August 24, 2017 2 hours ago, doumeyer said: Just like last year he wanted to stock pile draft picks and what did he do, he gave away a third round pick for nothing. If Hack can't start this year then he blow another high draft pick. The current GM has had three off season to find a NFL QB, and we are going to start another season with a washed up bum who was never any good at QB for the 2017 season. This years draft and how he handle trades and offseason contracts leaves me with very little faith he can do this job. He makes a tremendous trade to obtain Marshall and everything has been down hill since. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rdelaney89 Posted August 25, 2017 Share Posted August 25, 2017 7 hours ago, doumeyer said: Just like last year he wanted to stock pile draft picks and what did he do, he gave away a third round pick for nothing. If Hack can't start this year then he blow another high draft pick. The current GM has had three off season to find a NFL QB, and we are going to start another season with a washed up bum who was never any good at QB for the 2017 season. Writing off draft picks before they play a game isn't really the best move. Hack is 22 years old, he's younger than the rookies that came in this year. Are you going to write off the rookies too? Hack will play this season, we'll still take a QB in next years draft and then let them battle in camp next year. Macc has been aligning this team to fill holes with home grown talent rather than the stop gaps we've tried over the last 30 years. $80M in cap is going to revamp this entire team and we'll be able to spend it wisely if we know which players we currently have are good. If that takes McCown to start so we can figure out every other position then so be it. We know he's not the future but if Hack isn't the best QB on the team then we won't be able to gauge any other position and we're left with more question marks. Hack needs to win the job not be handed it. Once we are eliminated from contention I'm sure they will throw him in to sink or swim. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockice_8 Posted August 25, 2017 Share Posted August 25, 2017 I hope he doesn't just blow 80M next year as I'd like to ease into this rebuild. Let's not go full Jags on this one and sign everyone. A third year of Hack and a top pick QB for 2018 isn't the worst place you can be at QB. With some smart decisions in the draft (O-line "cough" LT "cough") and a big time WR (tons of good young WR's in FA next year) we could have a nice camp battle between an even more developed Hack and hopefully a stud like Darnold. It's all about the QB though so lets hope that we can lose but look good doing so. Until we have that QB it doesn't matter if we have a decent LT or need an upgrade at RB. Jags are in a worse position than us. They spent a ton of money on the defense and have almost 20M tied up in Bortles who can beat out Henne. We have no big deals outside Mo who we can get out of after this year if we so choose. We are sitting in a great spot if everything goes well. Right now lets just keep our eye on the prize and pray Darnold shines and doesn't pull a Manning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rickyt31 Posted August 25, 2017 Share Posted August 25, 2017 20 hours ago, doumeyer said: Just like last year he wanted to stock pile draft picks and what did he do, he gave away a third round pick for nothing. If Hack can't start this year then he blow another high draft pick. The current GM has had three off season to find a NFL QB, and we are going to start another season with a washed up bum who was never any good at QB for the 2017 season. After firing Idzik on a short term, the organization doesn't want a bad rep with real potential GMs that have options. They are not going to fire him and now he can make it seem that this was a part of his game plan to rebuild this offseason. He didn't get much of a choice for the coach because we started searching for a HC before we hired him. By the time he came on, we were down to 3 options. With all this, along with having some pretty good options at QB in the draft class, he has covered himself. _________ I'm really surprised by how many fans are mad on here after a lot of people spent all last season saying how we should blow up the roster and rebuild. Some of yall wanted to cut everyone over 30. This is what it looks like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockice_8 Posted August 25, 2017 Share Posted August 25, 2017 20 hours ago, doumeyer said: Just like last year he wanted to stock pile draft picks and what did he do, he gave away a third round pick for nothing. If Hack can't start this year then he blow another high draft pick. The current GM has had three off season to find a NFL QB, and we are going to start another season with a washed up bum who was never any good at QB for the 2017 season. He hasn't exactly went all in either. Sure Hack was a 2nd rounder but far from a crippling decision. If we traded up for Trubisky or Goff and he bombed then you have a point but instead he played it conservative (whether that was right or not remains to be seen). Each and every time we were close to landing a QB (see Mariota/WInston draft) or Trubisky (who we seemed to be very high on) we missed out by winning. let hope that doesn't happen again because that would be devastating. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockice_8 Posted August 25, 2017 Share Posted August 25, 2017 2 minutes ago, rickyt31 said: After firing Idzik on a short term, the organization doesn't want a bad rep with real potential GMs that have options. They are not going to fire him and now he can make it seem that this was a part of his game plan to rebuild this offseason. He didn't get much of a choice for the coach because we started searching for a HC before we hired him. By the time he came on, we were down to 3 options. With all this, along with having some pretty good options at QB in the draft class, he has covered himself. _________ I'm really surprised by how many fans are mad on here after a lot of people spent all last season saying how we should blow up the roster and rebuild. Some of yall wanted to cut everyone over 30. This is what it looks like. And anyone who thinks we should have kept guys like Harris, Decker etc. would be the same ones screaming how we missed on a franchise QB when we win 4 or 5 games and have the 5th pick. It's about time that we committed to the rebuild and not continue to meddle in mediocrity. For once there actually seems like a plan in place from the owner down to the HC. I think everyone understands that this year will be tough and unless something crazy happens everyone will get a chance to see this through. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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