Deshaun Watson

[Rod Johnson]

1 hour ago, Reginaldm9 said:

Hey nerds, 

Long time no see. It's pretty clear that Watson already doesn't look great. Money wise, we can't move on from Watson so he'll be the QB for the foreseeable future. It's funny, but this season is two games in, one of which we've won, and already feels pretty much over. It's 100% due to the QB position.

The Chubb injury, though personally devastating, should have been the catalyst for decisive action from team leadership to play inspired. That didn't happen and looks like it's not going to happen. 

With that said, Stefanski, whether you love him or hate him, is the cheapest variable to change and will be replaced with another young OC with a QB guru vibe (think Brian Johnson of the Eagles, Kellen Moore of the Chargers, or Ken Dorsey of the Bills) to help save the team from a horrific backslide. I kind of doubt that Berry gets the axe too because that would be admitting that the Watson trade was a colossal failure, but we'll see. 

That's the forecast. The only question now is whether we get there at 5-12 (the team's floor) or a more respectable 9-8 (the team's ceiling). 

The only thing worse than paying a guy until 2027 to not be your starting QB would be to pay a guy until 2027 to be a terrible QB, with a terrible attitude, and to fire every competent person in the building that he's going to throw under the bus along the way. So you're probably right, that's what we'll end up doing.

[LETSGOBROWNIES]

26 minutes ago, sdrawkcab321 said:

You think the players enjoy a coach whose idea of a post game victory speech is reading off a stat sheet? Players like a personality. Just not an overbearing ahole. 

I’d hope they’d be forming their opinion of them on more than their victory speeches. 
 

You get real jazzed up when your manager starts talking wild stuff?  Me either.  

[Rod Johnson]

7 minutes ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said:

I’d hope they’d be forming their opinion of them on more than their victory speeches. 
 

You get real jazzed up when your manager starts talking wild stuff?  Me either.  

My experience at UPS tells me people, especially in their early-mid 20s, can respond well to either, and it's nice to have both.

[LETSGOBROWNIES]

24 minutes ago, Rod Johnson said:

My experience at UPS tells me people, especially in their early-mid 20s, can respond well to either, and it's nice to have both.

There’s literally nothing another human is going to say to get me more motivated to deliver packages lol.

just my opinion but if your team needs “win one for the gipper” speeches you’re already toast as you’ve brought in the wrong kinds of players.

[MWil23]

2 minutes ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said:

There’s literally nothing another human is going to say to get me more motivated to deliver packages lol.

just my opinion but if your team needs “win one for the gipper” speeches you’re already toast as you’ve brought in the wrong kinds of players.

As with most things, speeches have their place, but if you give a speech every week, it loses it's value.

The same with yelling. After a while, it's just noise.

The same with being a hard you-know-what. You establish a militant culture and then after that it's just time to roll your eyes because you're getting dressed down for not double knotting your shoes.

Or the same with being a player's coach. After a while, you just know you can take advantage of them and acta accordingly, or at least you watch as others do it.

[Rod Johnson]

9 minutes ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said:

There’s literally nothing another human is going to say to get me more motivated to deliver packages lol.

just my opinion but if your team needs “win one for the gipper” speeches you’re already toast as you’ve brought in the wrong kinds of players.

Different strokes for different folks, the main thing is holding people accountable when they are letting everybody else down and getting excited for when they are kicking butt. Older guys usually want to be treated like professionals, younger guys want to find glory in whatever their doing.

I hated that job.

[roger murdock]

I remember when Ray Lewis left the Ravens, Joe Flacco got heat for saying Ray’s pre-game speeches did nothing for him and if you actually listened to what he said it didn’t make any sense. Still his crazy rambling got other players fired up even though it didn’t work for him. 
 

different strokes for different folks. At my job I’m heavily analytical (work in rev-management) and pretty calm / calculated. Despite that I get fired up from the marketing and sales leaders speeches because it hits a different chord than I’m used to. 

[LETSGOBROWNIES]

13 minutes ago, MWil23 said:

As with most things, speeches have their place, but if you give a speech every week, it loses it's value.

The same with yelling. After a while, it's just noise.

The same with being a hard you-know-what. You establish a militant culture and then after that it's just time to roll your eyes because you're getting dressed down for not double knotting your shoes.

Or the same with being a player's coach. After a while, you just know you can take advantage of them and acta accordingly, or at least you watch as others do it.

I think there’s a balance that’s required for sure.  
 

You’ve got to show some emotion, show you’re human, etc., but less is more imo.  
 

The militant vs players coach stuff is very simple imo.  You set an expectation and when it’s not met there are consequences.  Those consequences don’t entail screaming, humiliation, etc., simply a conversation to correct any misunderstandings, a reduction in your PT or being cut.  It’s not a personal thing, it’s a simple understanding between all parties about how things will be done and what will happen if they’re not.

I think emotion is good for letting others know you care and to show your personality, but acting like a maniac isn’t going to make people play football better.  Making sure they know their assignments and have the resources to succeed will do that.

[LETSGOBROWNIES]

5 minutes ago, Rod Johnson said:

Different strokes for different folks, the main thing is holding people accountable when they are letting everybody else down and getting excited for when they are kicking butt. Older guys usually want to be treated like professionals, younger guys want to find glory in whatever their doing.

I hated that job.

I agree with a lot of this.  I think the excitement has to come from positivity, but too much and people start feeling themselves a bit. Keeping a the highs and lows stable is an important thing for the top guy.

I think the energy and “bad cop” schtick if needed can come from coordinators or position coaches.

Accountability isn’t optional.

[mtmmike]

9 hours ago, NateDawg said:

Story of the Browns since I’ve been alive. Chubb injury and the leshaun debacle is just par for the course. 32 teams and I had to be born into being a Browns fan.

Excellent quote when leshaun achieved great things he had 3 number 1 receivers. 

Right now we have 1 starting receiver.

That is why after 8 games he has 1 pass completed over 30 yards.

To project that he would complete 2 passes over 30 yards in a 16 game season.

The major short fall is that not 1 wide receiver came here on a discounted contract that says it all in a nutshell.

[LETSGOBROWNIES]

As all of this relates to Stefanski some people don’t like that he’s not hooting and hollering like a jackass after every game, good or bad.  
 

I don’t think the absence of a theatrical, perhaps over the top performative display of emotion is required to show others your personality, get your point across, relate to others or motivate.

People can have presences, sure, but I think that being competent, respectful and consistent will work with almost everyone.

I also think it’s entirely possible Stefanski, being not an imbecile, realizes when camera are present and maintains a certain level of professionalism.  It wouldn’t shock me if he’s a bit looser in private/team only settings 

[candyman93]

5 minutes ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said:

As all of this relates to Stefanski some people don’t like that he’s not hooting and hollering like a jackass after every game, good or bad.  
 

I don’t think the absence of a theatrical, perhaps over the top performative display of emotion is required to show others your personality, get your point across, relate to others or motivate.

People can have presences, sure, but I think that being competent, respectful and consistent will work with almost everyone.

I also think it’s entirely possible Stefanski, being not an imbecile, realizes when camera are present and maintains a certain level of professionalism.  It wouldn’t shock me if he’s a bit looser in private/team only settings 

I think Stefanski has the same problem as Brandon Staley.

 

I don’t care how incredibly brilliant you are, if you cannot articulate a message that resonates with people under your leadership, good luck.

 

There’s a reason the term “culture fit” gets brought up when keeping / firing someone.

 

It’s why @sdrawkcab321 and me know the Bluejackets are doomed before the nhl season begins. They have soft friendly players and had a players coach, but lost. Then the bluejackets hired Mike Babcock who’s a complete ******, but was needed to fix the soft culture. Then what happens? Soft players act soft and will end up with a soft coach again. Then 1-2 years from now when they’re getting bullied and losing they’ll try to say it’s something else.

[LETSGOBROWNIES]

6 minutes ago, candyman93 said:

I think Stefanski has the same problem as Brandon Staley.

 

I don’t care how incredibly brilliant you are, if you cannot articulate a message that resonates with people under your leadership, good luck.

 

what’s the message that’s not being articulated though?  If “this is your job, this is how we expect it to be done, and these are the consequences for not doing so” doesn’t work, the issue isn’t leadership.  You’ve brought in morons.

I’m not seeing leadership issues here.  I’m seeing, thus far, a QB who isn’t finding open receivers and is holding the ball.  That’s an execution issue by one player.  The rest of the team has ranged from “fine” to “outstanding”.

Players aren’t acting out, quitting, etc...  Players are signing here and resigning here, they’re not looking for the door at the first opportunity.  

6 minutes ago, candyman93 said:

 

There’s a reason the term “culture fit” gets brought up when keeping / firing someone.

it’s also a way of simply saying “players tuned him out/quit”.  That’s not happening right now.

 

[Rod Johnson]

21 minutes ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said:

As all of this relates to Stefanski some people don’t like that he’s not hooting and hollering like a jackass after every game, good or bad.  
 

I don’t think the absence of a theatrical, perhaps over the top performative display of emotion is required to show others your personality, get your point across, relate to others or motivate.

People can have presences, sure, but I think that being competent, respectful and consistent will work with almost everyone.

I also think it’s entirely possible Stefanski, being not an imbecile, realizes when camera are present and maintains a certain level of professionalism.  It wouldn’t shock me if he’s a bit looser in private/team only settings 

I threw that in as an weakness earlier just because we played a very uninspiring brand of football, and a lot of that is saddling up with Joe Woods for too long. He's can't be fake and reach outside of himself to be some passionate leader, but he can have the awareness to put people on his staff that are going motivate players in ways he isn't. And a lot of it is stuff we don't know, like how did he respond to Deshaun having two facemask penalties and is that effective? It's easy to see him being soft on that because that's what he portrays.

[Rod Johnson]

Also, how is he going to demand respect from Deshaun at all? The FO gutted most of his leverage in that relationship.