NYRaider Posted December 11, 2023 Share Posted December 11, 2023 6 hours ago, RaidersForever said: Hardegree and Pierce stick around for familiarity and continuity. Continuity of being one of the worst teams in the NFL? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darbsk Posted December 11, 2023 Share Posted December 11, 2023 54 minutes ago, big_palooka said: Fair points. But there is a reason he is a known commodity and among the top candidates for a HC job. He built his resume with a dynamic offense around mid QB. Pierce is what? A feel good story who goes back to coaching LBs if he doesn't keep the job. Yeh, I get that. Neither would be my first choice to be honest. I’m on the Harbaugh bandwagon 🙂 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerry Posted December 11, 2023 Share Posted December 11, 2023 7 minutes ago, Darbsk said: Yeh, I get that. Neither would be my first choice to be honest. I’m on the Harbaugh bandwagon 🙂 Same. I don't follow the NFL well enough to know who the bright young OCs and DCs are. All I know is Harbaugh got his team to the SB during his tenure with the 49ers and that's all I really care about. That and the fact that everywhere he goes as a HC, his team wins. Winning is all that matters. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big_palooka Posted December 11, 2023 Share Posted December 11, 2023 1 hour ago, Darbsk said: Yeh, I get that. Neither would be my first choice to be honest. I’m on the Harbaugh bandwagon 🙂 I feel like I've been on the Harbaugh wagon so long the wheels have come off. Have to move on. If it was going to happen, it would have years back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dante9876 Posted December 12, 2023 Share Posted December 12, 2023 (edited) Going back in forth about head coaching candidates is pointless if mark is the one doing the search, interview and hire. Hire a real GM, let that gm bring you 3 or 4 candidates he wants to hire, both you guys interview them. Discuss which one you all both feel is the best fit. Than hire the guy. If they do this coach before gm or coach and gm package deal again, it's going to fail. Edited December 12, 2023 by dante9876 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bucksavage1 Posted December 12, 2023 Share Posted December 12, 2023 51 minutes ago, dante9876 said: Going back in forth about head coaching candidates is pointless if mark is the one doing the search, interview and hire. Hire a real GM, let that gm bring you 3 or 4 candidates he wants to hire, both you guys interview them. Discuss which one you all both feel is the best fit. Than hire the guy. If they do this coach before gm or coach and gm package deal again, it's going to fail. Agreed. Mark has hired 3 retread coaches in a row. The last 2 had to be overpaid to accept the job. We always seem to be the team that the top candidates don’t go to. It’s why I brought do they want to work with Mark or this organization a stay away BTW, I can guarantee any coach from the Shanahan coaching tree won’t be coming here 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Styrian Raider Posted December 12, 2023 Share Posted December 12, 2023 I don't really get why AP gets hate for the performance of the offense, while he also at the same time gets zero credit for the performance of the defense. I get it - the HC is alsways responsible for the whole team. But everybody knows that he comes from the defense side of the ball and Bo Hardegree is the playcaller on the offense and he is also most probably responsible for the game plan on the offense. Same goes for the defense. Graham is the playcaller and the one who is responsible for the game plan. Main difference is that somehow AP is fully responsible for all that didn't work on offense and for nothing that worked on the defense. I'm not advocating for AP to get the HC position (although I think there is a good chance that Mark Davis decides to give him the full time job), but I don't understand these double standards in here. (btw. who is to blame for the 13-28 loss of the Lions against the bears? Goff or Campbell?) For me the key to the success of the Raiders next year is, what happens on the offense side of the ball coaching wise. If AP gets the full-time job and he keeps Bo as his OC we're doomed. I want to see him hire a "veteran" OC and playcaller like Frank Reich or at least someone like Byron Leftwich who was once seen as one of those fancy young OCs in the HC hiring cycle. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chali21 Posted December 12, 2023 Share Posted December 12, 2023 13 hours ago, big_palooka said: I feel like I've been on the Harbaugh wagon so long the wheels have come off. Have to move on. If it was going to happen, it would have years back. Yeah it feels like a pipe dream at this point. Mark has had multiple chances to hire him since he left SF and hasn’t done it. I really don’t understand it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chali21 Posted December 12, 2023 Share Posted December 12, 2023 16 hours ago, Darbsk said: Just thinking about this and whilst I generally agree (and I'm not trying to be obtuse here), but a few guys have mentioned Ben Johnson the OC for the Lions as a potential hot candidate. Seeing as at the end of this season Pierce will have actually been an NFL Head Coach for half a season and Johnson has only had two seasons as an OC and hasn't been a HC even at college or high school level, wouldn't that make Pierce more qualified than Johnson? Pierce has also played a number of years at the NFL level so possibly understands the business more. Is this a concern with Johnson? I believe that you liked him as a candidate. I'm not trying to rubbish Johnson at all as I'd be quite excited to get a young, innovative offensive mind like him. No offense but that line of thought is what got the raiders to hire JMD. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nightmare Posted December 12, 2023 Share Posted December 12, 2023 This feels like the least likely chance we've got at Harbuagh in the 3 cycles where we've needed a HC. We should have done it before we hired Gruden, and we really should have done it before we hired McDaniels where all the stars aligned for it to happen but Mark had a brain fart. This time, though, the Harbaugh deal just feels unlikely. Mark will either do something really stupid again (give it to Pierce, bring back Bisaccia or try to bring back Gruden), or he'll properly commit to the GM > HC model. The latter option I can get on board with, but if we do that then it basically rules out Harbaugh, because no incoming GM would want to hire Harbaugh as the HC and in doing so immediately lose any control in the organization. Never say never, though. Maybe now that it makes LESS sense than it did the past couple of coaching cycles, this will finally be the time where something happens. With this team we should all have learned by now to expect the unexpected. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darbsk Posted December 12, 2023 Share Posted December 12, 2023 (edited) 4 hours ago, Chali21 said: No offense but that line of thought is what got the raiders to hire JMD. No offence taken, as I said, Johnson would be quite exciting but it’s not as if he’s a sure thing. Harbaugh would be my first choice but there’s questions there too about who’s got ultimate control, does a GM have final say or how much input, what are the dynamics. It’s certainly an imperfect science picking a coach and GM 😁 Edited December 12, 2023 by Darbsk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted December 12, 2023 Share Posted December 12, 2023 14 hours ago, dante9876 said: Going back in forth about head coaching candidates is pointless if mark is the one doing the search, interview and hire. Hire a real GM, let that gm bring you 3 or 4 candidates he wants to hire, both you guys interview them. Discuss which one you all both feel is the best fit. Than hire the guy. If they do this coach before gm or coach and gm package deal again, it's going to fail. Which is why I think Champ Kelly keeping the GM is the most likely outcome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bucksavage1 Posted December 12, 2023 Share Posted December 12, 2023 11 hours ago, Styrian Raider said: I don't really get why AP gets hate for the performance of the offense, while he also at the same time gets zero credit for the performance of the defense. It is because people have agendas and can’t give credit where credit is due while also pointing out shortcomings The same people who didn’t want AP as coach before the Giants game. Are the same people that dismissed the two wins vs Jets/Giants as bad teams Are the same people who give no credit to AP for the defense being good and credit him towards the offense being bad 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted December 12, 2023 Share Posted December 12, 2023 6 minutes ago, bucksavage1 said: It is because people have agendas and can’t give credit where credit is due while also pointing out shortcomings The same people who didn’t want AP as coach before the Giants game. Are the same people that dismissed the two wins vs Jets/Giants as bad teams Are the same people who give no credit to AP for the defense being good and credit him towards the offense being bad How can you give him credit for the defense being good when the defense has been pretty good all year, do you think the LB coach / interim HC are more responsible for it than the coordinator? Can you give me at least 3-5 reasons why AP should be seriously considered as our next head coach? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justwinning Posted December 12, 2023 Share Posted December 12, 2023 (edited) 4 hours ago, bucksavage1 said: It is because people have agendas and can’t give credit where credit is due while also pointing out shortcomings The same people who didn’t want AP as coach before the Giants game. Are the same people that dismissed the two wins vs Jets/Giants as bad teams Are the same people who give no credit to AP for the defense being good and credit him towards the offense being bad Agreed. It was also ok to be hopeful especially after a big win over the Giants and edging the Jets whose defense is top tier. What I didn’t understand is the flat out dismissal of AP from the get-go. Those wins were likely losses with JMD at the helm. The team was lifeless. Getting those 2 Ws plus having our team competing against an elite offense were encouraging signs. The wheels have fell off the moment they took a 14-0 lead against the Chiefs. Edited December 12, 2023 by Justwinning 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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