Lets talk about Ozzie

[AFlaccoSeagulls]

3 hours ago, coordinator0 said:

Yes, Newsome and the front office is as much to blame about acquiring players as Pees is about not utilizing the players he actually has in roles that they fit it. And Harbaugh is in the middle of all of it by not having any effect whatsoever on the way players are used and also hiring terrible coordinators. It's not a good situation to be in for Baltimore's franchise regardless of their (misleading) win/loss record this season.

With that said I think the players the front office acquires would actually look good if utilized properly. I've beaten this dead horse for years but I won't stop: scheme > talent. Unless you're talking about the true elites, talent needs the right circumstances to thrive. So clear out the coaching staff and get guys that know what they're doing in this day and age. Stick with Newsome, DeCosta, etc. That's the safer and smarter bet.

Yeah if we get rid of Pees maybe the guys we draft/acquire would be good, but the chances of that happening are slim. It's amazing how apologetic this organization is for Pees.

[wackywabbit]

1 point loss on the road to what may be the best team in football right now that caused a minor hit to our playoff odds. Burn everything to the ground.

[M.10.E]

7 minutes ago, wackywabbit said:

1 point loss on the road to what may be the best team in football right now that caused a minor hit to our playoff odds. Burn everything to the ground.

We lost the same way two years in a row to our biggest rival. This team has a problem holding leads. Hell, if our lead wasn't huge in the Superbowl, we lose that game too.

We've done NOTHING to fix it. How many times must it happen before we change SOMETHING?!?! Everyone saw that coming on Sunday Night. I had zero faith in that team to hold the lead.

[Danand]

38 minutes ago, wackywabbit said:

1 point loss on the road to what may be the best team in football right now that caused a minor hit to our playoff odds. Burn everything to the ground.

If you invested heavily in fixing a problem with your car, and the mechanic told you it was fixed, and despite paying a lot of bucks to get rid of the problem, it happens in the exact same way that made you wanted it repaired in the first place.

[berlin calling]

hard to argue with someone who only points at the final result and does not reflect they way the game went down. i called a 4th quarter blow up to be overdue just because i got so used to it over the last seasons with Pees at DC. inacceptable in any way and yet they still trusted him another season because things sure would change somehow after years of let down.

[RavensTillIDie]

2 hours ago, wackywabbit said:

1 point loss on the road to what may be the best team in football right now that caused a minor hit to our playoff odds. Burn everything to the ground.

Come on now, that's sugar coating the hell out of this loss. Usually I'm all for being optimistic, but the manner in which we lost was pathetic and a culmination of all the faults on this team finally coming to light. They absolutely deserve to be lambasted for the way they gave that game away. If we're going to anoint these guys as some type of great defense, they better be able to hold a damn double digit lead.

[AFlaccoSeagulls]

29 minutes ago, RavensTillIDie said:

Come on now, that's sugar coating the hell out of this loss. Usually I'm all for being optimistic, but the manner in which we lost was pathetic and a culmination of all the faults on this team finally coming to light. They absolutely deserve to be lambasted for the way they gave that game away. If we're going to anoint these guys as some type of great defense, they better be able to hold a damn double digit lead.

And this thread is more than just about one game.

[diamondbull424]

3 hours ago, wackywabbit said:

1 point loss on the road to what may be the best team in football right now that caused a minor hit to our playoff odds. Burn everything to the ground.

Agreed. I remember a time when some Steelers fans wanted to replace Tomlin for pretty much the same reasoning.

I understand being critical. And I agree that the loss needs to cause the organization to dig deep and establish new and better systems. I think it’s all levels, players included. But calling for heads? Meh... we played a great team. Whether they’re a divisional rival or not, they’re a great team. We could obtain another coordinator, we could get another quartback, we could replace Ozzie, and we could replace Harbaugh...

But I think perspective is also very important. We could have Greg Mattison or Cam Cameron (imagine Flacco begind this line in that offense?). We could have Kyle Boller, heck, even Nathan Peterman. We could replace Ozzie and find out that Eric DeCosta does no better at drafting than Phil Savage did for the Browns. And lastly we could replace the relative stability and consistency as a playoff contender that we’ve had under the Harbaugh administration and be searching for the next great coach every few years like the Giants once they got what they wanted when Tom Coughlin left- which was supposed to “fix” things and make them “better”.

There is only one Bill Belichick. Otherwise, Harbaugh and Tomlin, these are some of the best guys at what they do at building teams that can contend. Not every year or every other year will a particular team be that contender, and like we’ve seen with Andy Reid (Harbaugh’s mentor) and the 1990s Buffalo Bills team, not every contender will win the championship. But perspective is key. And until Ozzie, Harbaugh, and Flacco prove total ineptitude, I’ll side with the fact that this team is allowed to have flaws, even big flaws, as long as when looking at the big picture, they photograph pretty darn well. Be the model with the angular face or the thick eyebrows. Let that flaw be the reason we stand out and get noticed. We’re winners even though we’ve had to overcome x,y, and z... and it’s cool because we do overcome x,y, and z.

[DontTazeMeBro]

I actually don’t want to fire Ozzie. I just want him to join us in this decade. I feel like he’s still the right guy to evaluate the players. He just needs to ditch outdated philosophies 

[berlin calling]

could we do worse with coaches? Sure. Should that affect the way coaches should be evaluated? Nope. You can ALWAYS do better and should have an unbiased look at results of your staff. Its their profession, they should earn their pay or you replace them. 

[AFlaccoSeagulls]

1 hour ago, DontTazeMeBro said:

I actually don’t want to fire Ozzie. I just want him to join us in this decade. I feel like he’s still the right guy to evaluate the players. He just needs to ditch outdated philosophies 

Agreed as well here. I want Ozzie to have a better understanding of what players fit into Pees' scheme OR for Ozzie to fire Pees and actually get a DC who has a scheme that he can tell Ozzie "I need this type of player for this position". Ozzie can evaluate with the best of them, but there is a clear disconnect between the guys we're signing and players who fit our scheme on defense.

[diamondbull424]

6 hours ago, DontTazeMeBro said:

I actually don’t want to fire Ozzie. I just want him to join us in this decade. I feel like he’s still the right guy to evaluate the players. He just needs to ditch outdated philosophies 

Agreed. I do believe that’s a valid point. But I suppose my statement is less about you venting about Ozzie and more about the overall “meltdown” it seems a lot of Ravens fans are in right now. The way I see it, we win a super bowl this year and no one would remember this loss to the Steelers. Which would be equally as hypocritical from my viewpoint.

I mean, if we miss the playoffs again this season then I can understand looking for a coordinator change. But as of right now. We loss to a quality team. We loss on the road in a difficult place to play. And we still control our destinies on making the playoffs. I just think the outlook should be more positive. But perhaps I’ve become too patient a fan as I’ve gotten older.?‍♂️

So I guess you might say my post was more of a rant in general.

[drd23]

40 minutes ago, diamondbull424 said:

Agreed. I do believe that’s a valid point. But I suppose my statement is less about you venting about Ozzie and more about the overall “meltdown” it seems a lot of Ravens fans are in right now.

The thing is though, this loss was the perfect example of a lot of the problems that people have been pointing out for ages.  It's not like it's only after Sunday's loss that people are calling for Marty Mornhinweg and Dean Pees to go - there were threads on this in the off-season on this forum, and IIRC people like c0 and myself were sceptical of Marty when he was hired.

And I'm fairly certainly I've said many times in the past that this FO seems to love to build the team for a previous version of the NFL, and not the modern, pass-happy version the team is actually competing in.

[jpeter15]

In the past 10 years we have the 8th best record in the NFL. 1 fewer win than the Saints and 1 more win than the Seahawks. We have established for years our coordinators suck and now we are talking about Ozzie sucking.... Something doesn't add up. How are we winning with bad coaches and a bad GM?

[AFlaccoSeagulls]

2 hours ago, jpeter15 said:

In the past 10 years we have the 8th best record in the NFL. 1 fewer win than the Saints and 1 more win than the Seahawks. We have established for years our coordinators suck and now we are talking about Ozzie sucking.... Something doesn't add up. How are we winning with bad coaches and a bad GM?

Things add up quite well. Ozzie's draft magic ran out, and for the past 5 years we've been stuck with underwhelming rosters with no leaders like Ray and Ed to hold things together. Sure, we have the 8th best record in the NFL since 2008, but now cut that in half and evaluate 2008 - 2012 and 2013 - now and you'll see a massive disparity there.