warfelg Posted January 22 Share Posted January 22 So it seems Teryl Austin’s contract is up so we are possibly looking at a DC too. This could be why we’re not hearing news on the OC front. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blitzburgh Posted January 22 Share Posted January 22 Not sure who is out there, but I’d be happy to see him replaced. I think he leaves a lot to be desired with the talent and $ spent on that side of the ball. I think his performance has gone under the radar bc of how bad the offense has been. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
August4th Posted January 22 Share Posted January 22 I wouldn't mind them doing the inside hire for DC. We might have a great defensive mind on staff with Curry, Brown or martin. They can lean on mike to help cook something up. some outside hire possibilities. The Stanley dude who got fired, was being praised as a DC with the Rams. He might be a guy whose more built for the DC role and not HC. Maybe get Leslie Frazer? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
43M Posted January 22 Share Posted January 22 1) This is good news....depending who replaces him. 2) I want an outside coach for both, preferably with no connections to us. We need fresh minds. We got them at GM...now get them on the coaching staff. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dcash4 Posted January 22 Share Posted January 22 9 minutes ago, August4th said: I wouldn't mind them doing the inside hire for DC. We might have a great defensive mind on staff with Curry, Brown or martin. They can lean on mike to help cook something up. some outside hire possibilities. The Stanley dude who got fired, was being praised as a DC with the Rams. He might be a guy whose more built for the DC role and not HC. Maybe get Leslie Frazer? If they are moving on from Austin. I'd kinda like to see them go the "DC in name only" route with Tomlin being the guy. If money has really been an issue for this team in hire coaches you need to find solutions to the problem. Don't hire a DC, put that money into other coaches or a better OC. These names do not excited me, but I see the offense following the Haley mode: Head coaching experience, now in charge of just the offense. Frank Reicht, Arthur Smith, Hugh Jackson (I said these wouldn't be exciting...). Maybe a very experienced OC like Bienemy who is very respected. But someone that can be left alone on that side of the building to run the offense. Tomlin has overarching control, but they try to silo as much as they can. If they do move on from Austin one year after having had Brian Flores in the build though, I am gonna scream. I don't know. Unless there is more news sometime I am expecting him back. Man, re-reading that list I just have zero trust of this team making a good hire. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steeler Hitman Posted January 22 Share Posted January 22 3 hours ago, warfelg said: So it seems Teryl Austin’s contract is up so we are possibly looking at a DC too. This could be why we’re not hearing news on the OC front. I was watching Locked on Steelers with Christopher Carter and Noah Farbaugh . This was a topic of discussion. It is somewhat odd that this was never brought up until now. IJS, even during the year, everyone pointed to Canada being in his last year. I never heard about him until this morning. 2 hours ago, Blitzburgh said: Not sure who is out there, but I’d be happy to see him replaced. I think he leaves a lot to be desired with the talent and $ spent on that side of the ball. I think his performance has gone under the radar bc of how bad the offense has been. I agree with you. Austin is pretty good in the secondary, but he honestly didn't have a lot to work with this year. I was somewhat surprised they didn't keep A. Witherspoon. He has a good year and then a bad one. A guy I think is a better DB Coach than coordinator. This season was to be an up year and it was. My short list after looking at who may be available: First Tier Choices *****Rex Ryan - - Great defensive mind who could do wonders with Cam, TJ, and Minkah. He also understands how to get the most out of players as well. He could do for the Steelers what Jim Schwartz did for the Browns (before injuries and meeting the Texans). A former HC and another leader who has a commanding presence. He could potentially do what his father did with the Bears for the Steelers, just minus the drama he had with Ditka and Kevin Gilbride in Houston. 😁 ****Leslie Frazier - - Another high quality defensive mind. He took a year off. He would know how to help the Steelers beat the Bills. He has former HC experience as well. He would be an upgrade as well. He gets the most from his players as well. ****Lovie Smith - - Another former HC who could do wonders as a defensive coordinator. Lovie has gotten the short end of the stick in many places, but a very underrated football mind and leader. I think coach Tomlin could use another former HC in the room who could help get the message across in a different manner than he does. This was effective when guys like Munchak and Flores where on staff. My Second Tier Choices ****Wink Martindale - - Former Ravens DC and like most coordinators can do good thing with talent. ****Jim Leonhard - - Former Raven player and former University of Wisconsin Defensive Coordinator. Pretty sharp football mind and is progressive with his schemes. 39 minutes ago, August4th said: I wouldn't mind them doing the inside hire for DC. We might have a great defensive mind on staff with Curry, Brown or martin. They can lean on mike to help cook something up. some outside hire possibilities. The Stanley dude who got fired, was being praised as a DC with the Rams. He might be a guy whose more built for the DC role and not HC. Maybe get Leslie Frazer? I am going to say go outside the building until we remodel what is inside somewhat. They need some fresh ideas brought in and some different ways of sending Tomlin's message. I mentioned Rex Ryan, Leslie Frazier, and Lovie Smith as being guys who can provide leadership, stability, experience, motivation, and knowledge. I have nothing against DC Austin, I just think he has never stood out as a DC as the others have as DC's. 6 minutes ago, 43M said: 1) This is good news....depending who replaces him. Yep! What are your thoughts on the guys that I listed above or other potential candidates? 2) I want an outside coach for both, preferably with no connections to us. We need fresh minds. We got them at GM...now get them on the coaching staff. Yep! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rivers Posted January 22 Share Posted January 22 45 minutes ago, Steeler Hitman said: First Tier Choices *****Rex Ryan - - Great defensive mind who could do wonders with Cam, TJ, and Minkah. He also understands how to get the most out of players as well. He could do for the Steelers what Jim Schwartz did for the Browns (before injuries and meeting the Texans). A former HC and another leader who has a commanding presence. He could potentially do what his father did with the Bears for the Steelers, just minus the drama he had with Ditka and Kevin Gilbride in Houston. 😁 ****Leslie Frazier - - Another high quality defensive mind. He took a year off. He would know how to help the Steelers beat the Bills. He has former HC experience as well. He would be an upgrade as well. He gets the most from his players as well. ****Lovie Smith - - Another former HC who could do wonders as a defensive coordinator. Lovie has gotten the short end of the stick in many places, but a very underrated football mind and leader. I think coach Tomlin could use another former HC in the room who could help get the message across in a different manner than he does. This was effective when guys like Munchak and Flores where on staff. where is Vrabel? Frazier is a good one, and his CB skills could help Porter as well, lets not forget that Frazier was a really good CB for the Bears Rex would be good after he got a DL with players suitable for the scheme. watts loudermilk and leal are no good. Cam is about done if not able to get 100% healthy , while Benton and Ogunjobi are decent. tomlins idea of a DL rotation is a failure that Rex would better abolish as top priority. Get a DC, let him run the defence and don't let tomlin get involved . Leal should try doing a few curls now and then instead of covering up those pythons with a shirt. 17 reps on the bench, who drafts a DL this weak. Colbert strikes again, another jarvis but a few rounds later. What another waste of a RD3 pick 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steeler Hitman Posted January 22 Share Posted January 22 28 minutes ago, Dcash4 said: If they are moving on from Austin. I'd kinda like to see them go the "DC in name only" route with Tomlin being the guy. I think Coach Tomlin has had his hand in the defense from all reports. I think he needs some coaches that he can delegate to as he had the respect and confidence in Brian Flores. In my previous response I listed Rex Ryan, Leslie Frazier, Lovie Smith, Wink Martindale, etc. These are coaches who have had success as DC's and some got promoted to HC. If money has really been an issue for this team in hire coaches you need to find solutions to the problem. Don't hire a DC, put that money into other coaches or a better OC. I hear that all the time. There is no salary cap on coaches salaries. There is not limit on how many coaches on staff that you can have. Here's where you push back somewhat. Mr. Rooney, the team, fans, etc. want to win. There is nothing except thought/philosophy stopping them from getting both. Great coaching typically leads to great teams and wins. These names do not excited me, but I see the offense following the Haley mode: Head coaching experience, now in charge of just the offense. Frank Reicht, Arthur Smith, Hugh Jackson (I said these wouldn't be exciting...). Maybe a very experienced OC like Bienemy who is very respected. But someone that can be left alone on that side of the building to run the offense. Tomlin has overarching control, but they try to silo as much as they can. I believe that he actually should because he is ultimately responsible and held accountable for his coaches. Lost in a lot of Coach Tomlin's critics is the fact that he takes responsibility of the actions of his staff. During his presser about firing Matt Canada, he said that he felt like he didn't protect him. I am not necessarily a huge fan of Arthur Smith or Hue Jackson, but I love Frank Reich. His success as an OC speaks for itself and some guys are just better coordinators than head coaches like Norv Turner. Great coordinator so so head coach. I also look at fit and I just think this is a good fit. I see what he did with Carson Wentz in Indy and that is what the Steelers need with Pickett and Mason. I am not huge Bienemy fan because he ultimately wants to be a HC more than an OC. Nothing wrong with that because if you hire one of the young guns or a former HC, some of them may want to go back in that direction example: Kliff Kingberry. I am not against Byron Leftwich. He worked under BA who was a successful coach and mentor. I am not saying he is a1A candidate, but he should at least get a conversation and or interview. He would not be my top candidate, but worth listening and doing due diligence. If they do move on from Austin one year after having had Brian Flores in the build though, I am gonna scream. I don't know. Unless there is more news sometime I am expecting him back. Why? Especially if we can get an upgrade and solve some of the previous issues. I get needing some stability. IMO, you get that with the HC. They need to build good people around the Head Coach. I am also not opposed to increasing the staff. Man, re-reading that list I just have zero trust of this team making a good hire. I definitely understand that. Many have lost confidence in the organization to do some things. In their defense I like what and how they did the GM search and ultimately the hires of Khan and Weidl as GM and AGM. Interview, talk football, solicit ideas, and make an informed decision. I think Austin did a solid job of dealing with a M.A.S.H. unit at ILB and safety. However, while I wouldn't necessarily fire him, it doesn't mean that I have to extend his contract. I certainly would be talking to some other really good football minds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steeler Hitman Posted January 22 Share Posted January 22 2 minutes ago, 3rivers said: where is Vrabel? I loved Vrabel as a Steeler and when I posted on another website suggested the Steelers use him as the Patriots did inside. They had Jason Gildon and Mike Vrabel was a player who disrupted and was a big play-maker. As far as DC, I think he is someone who is like Brian Flores who really wants to be a HC. That is where his heart is, Flores is very good, but he ultimately wants to be a HC and I hope he gets his shot. I would take the A list guys before Vrabel. He would be on my next tier and not necessarily at the top. My reason and I will use Mike Munchak whom I always reference as someone who was a HC that I want back in the Black N Gold. Munchak has no aspirations to be a HC again (especially right now). Most of us wanted Flores to stay and perhaps if Austin's contract was up last year, that may have happened. Frazier is a good one, and his CB skills could help Porter as well, lets not forget that Frazier was a really good CB for the Bears. He is an A list guy and he has HC experience and is just the kind of guy who commands respect as Ryan does with his football knowledge and IQ. Rex would be good after he got a DL with players suitable for the scheme. For what he has brought in Baltimore and New York, Rex's record speaks for itself. Anyone who is hired at DC is going to need a better DL. In Austin's defense he was not working with the cream of the crop. A. Watts Loudermilk and Leal are no good. Cam is about done if not able to get 100% healthy , while Benton and Ogunjobi are decent. Improving the DL is a huge part of improving the defense. Leal is probably gone in 2024. Watts and Loudermilk are not bad as back-ups and in the proper situations/scenarios. Loudermilk took some steps forward in 2023 and I expect him to be better and at least salvageable as a back-up in year three. Benton has star potential if he can get paired with a healthy Cam or someone else. I loved the Ogunjobi signing and re-signing, but in 2023, he regressed and I would look to move on or improve the spot there. As far as Cam, he came back six weeks after a 12 week healing injury. Like TJ last year when he came back, he was playing at 75% or so. I don't expect Cam to be prime Cam, but he will be better healthy and with someone who can rotate with him and keep him fresh. tomlins idea of a DL rotation is a failure that Rex would better abolish as top priority. Get a DC, let him run the defence and don't let tomlin get involved . I don't think Mike Tomlin has a bad defensive mind or scheme. Part of his problem is that he has never had "his guys or system" there. I agree that I would prefer Coach Tomlin scouting, doing other HC duties, and acting as a CEO type of HC. Getting a Rex Ryan would allow that. However, Rex, Leslie, or whoever would be the DC, needs to have players to rotate on the DL. Especially with how bad the offense was. The defense was on the field way too much for most of the season. That contributed to a lot of the injuries. You can't get hurt on defense watching the offense from the sideline. Well typically unless you are Danny Smith. 😁 Leal should try doing a few curls now and then instead of covering up those pythons with a shirt. 17 reps on the bench, who drafts a DL this weak. Colbert strikes again, another jarvis but a few rounds later. Leal has been misused and put out of position. He is a natural 4-3 DE. Let him play in that type of scheme, and he would have grown and developed much better. He tried putting on weight, taking it off, etc. Just not a good fit for what the Steelers do. Tomlin was kind of hard on him at his presser. What another waste of a RD3 pick! Yep! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dcash4 Posted January 22 Share Posted January 22 18 minutes ago, Steeler Hitman said: I hear that all the time. There is no salary cap on coaches salaries. There is not limit on how many coaches on staff that you can have. Here's where you push back somewhat. Mr. Rooney, the team, fans, etc. want to win. There is nothing except thought/philosophy stopping them from getting both. I believe the fan concept of the owner is largely misconstrued, but there is a limit on his abilities to spend. He just isn't *that* rich in terms of being an NFL owner. He ranks in the 30's of wealth against his peers (out of 32 teams). So there is a limit to what he can do in terms of throwing cash around even without a coaching salary cap. What that limit is - I do not know, but that's where my initial comment of making Tomlin the HC/DC comes from. Put that money elsewhere, if it truly is a hindrance. You are gonna have to spend so much more than normal to get Rex Ryan out of a chair and onto the sidelines. He comes from an NFL ownership family. The money isn't in owning the teams, it's in selling them. There are NFL ownership groups cracking the $10's of billions in net worth because of what they did before football ownership. Rooney just cracks the tres commas club. He can't cut blank checks like some can. So that's why I suggest Tomlin as the HC/DC. If money is a problem (which I believe it could be), you need to find a creative answer to the problem. Eliminating a coordinator position opens up funds for either more coaches, a more expensive OC, or a combination of both. 21 minutes ago, Steeler Hitman said: Why? I view Flores as a superior coach to Austin. And while his one year agreement worked out, I'm going to guess that it wasn't thought to continue working with him because they already had a DC in Austin. If that relationship with Austin only lasts one additional year, then I think it's tough to have let the superior coach leave because the inferior one was in the way. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steeler Hitman Posted January 22 Share Posted January 22 1 minute ago, Dcash4 said: I believe the fan concept of the owner is largely misconstrued, but there is a limit on his abilities to spend. He just isn't *that* rich in terms of being an NFL owner. He's on the low end of being a billionaire? The average coordinator makes about a $1 million a year. The really good one more. He ranks in the 30's of wealth against his peers (out of 32 teams). So there is a limit to what he can do in terms of throwing cash around even without a coaching salary cap. What that limit is - I do not know, but that's where my initial comment of making Tomlin the HC/DC comes from. He's on the lower end of the overall worth, but the franchise is actually in the top 15. Without getting into the financial weeds, with the revue being passed around from contracts, etc., they can afford a decent coordinator, especially if it helps them win. Maybe if they get back to contention, the sales of merchandise and other will more than offset paying for good coaching. Maybe Coach Tomlin should use his scared money quote as an argument to get what he needs. 😁 Put that money elsewhere, if it truly is a hindrance. You are gonna have to spend so much more than normal to get Rex Ryan out of a chair and onto the sidelines. Really good guys like that cost. How much more $$$ comes to teams if they win a SB? It would pay for itself. I would even argue that the sales and everything else goes up as they become a real contender. He comes from an NFL ownership family. The money isn't in owning the teams, it's in selling them. There are NFL ownership groups cracking the $10's of billions in net worth because of what they did before football ownership. Rooney just cracks the tres commas club. He can't cut blank checks like some can. No doubt, but the Rooneys nad NFL owners are not paupers either. This isn't like the days of the AFL. He doesn't have money to throw away, but they have money to spend as they see fit. Neither of us can spend the Rooney's money, but I would like to have what they have annually to work with and live off of in my life. 😁 So that's why I suggest Tomlin as the HC/DC. If money is a problem (which I believe it could be), you need to find a creative answer to the problem. I don't believe money is the problem. I think the way they have been doing things is status quo. I think its time to shake that up. If Mike Tomlin is not being all he can be as a HC, take some things off his plate. Let him be a HC, which is a strength and get coordinators who can manage the offense and defense. Danny Smith seems to run special teams without interference. Why not get coach Tomlin guys on offense and defense who can manage those sides of the ball. If it costs, it is a cost of doing business. Eliminating a coordinator position opens up funds for either more coaches, a more expensive OC, or a combination of both. No need to eliminate a position that important and especially to save money. I just don't see it. You are setting the HC up for failure. he doesn't have enough time to run plays, and do all of the other responsibilities of a HC. That is just not how it is done in the NFL. The Steelers are unique in that they already have thee smallest coaching staff. It would be criminal not to have a coordinator in this day and time. Teams are already out coaching and out scheming the Steelers. This doesn't help change that. I view Flores as a superior coach to Austin. And while his one year agreement worked out, I'm going to guess that it wasn't thought to continue working with him because they already had a DC in Austin. I think it was loyalty to the contract. I would guess that if he was not under contract and they got to choose between he and Flores, Flores would have been strongly considered. If that relationship with Austin only lasts one additional year, then I think it's tough to have let the superior coach leave because the inferior one was in the way. I agree. And that is why I say they need to start doing some things differently, or every year we are sitting here in January looking forward to another year of the same thing. I understand why fans are frustrated and why they are tired of seeing Steelers go through this year end and year out. Get some A 1 coaches and minds to help improve the building blocks that they are added. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rlon Posted January 22 Share Posted January 22 Hire outside and let the coordinator run the defense...Tomlin is too much in control so an inside hire is bad idea/... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steeler Hitman Posted January 22 Share Posted January 22 23 minutes ago, rlon said: Hire outside and let the coordinator run the defense...Tomlin is too much in control so an inside hire is bad idea/... Yep, I agree. I don't know how much control is Coach Tomlin or Mr. Rooney. However, either way, I believe Coach Tomlin needs less on his plate and not more. Someone here used the term C.E.O. type of HC and I have been riding that. Do the overall HC management and let the coaches and coordinators coach. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rlon Posted January 22 Share Posted January 22 8 hours ago, Blitzburgh said: Not sure who is out there, but I’d be happy to see him replaced. I think he leaves a lot to be desired with the talent and $ spent on that side of the ball. I think his performance has gone under the radar bc of how bad the offense has been. Right, because everyone gives the defense a pass since they must be ‘so tired’. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mwalker Posted January 23 Share Posted January 23 My first choice would be Flores for sure. If he'd do it. (I'd bring back Munchak on the o-line too). Wink would be very solid, if not a bit dated. Or they'll keep Austin and get him a more dynamic front 7 blitz partner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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