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Week 15 GDT: Jacksonville Jaguars (9-4) vs. Houston Texans (4-9) - Potential Clinching Game

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Where’s the new thread, buzz? We got a division clinching game to talk about.

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13 minutes ago, iPwn said:

Where’s the new thread, buzz? We got a division clinching game to talk about.

Been without WiFi and relegated to mobile last couple days. Probably will be up later this afternoon.

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Corey Grant needs more touches over Yeldon and Ivory btw. 

He moves way better east and west than he use to. I was impressed by him late in the game. 

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5 hours ago, KhanYouDigIt said:

Corey Grant needs more touches over Yeldon and Ivory btw. 

He moves way better east and west than he use to. I was impressed by him late in the game. 

I disagree i think.

I like what Grant does, but it's such a niche thing.  Discussed it a bit during the blowout stages of the game.  His skillset is the sort of thing that works best as a change of pace, more than as a regular fixture in an offense like this.

Ivory is useful because he basically gives us a poor-man's Fournette to pound away and grind out those tough yards inside to keep things honest.

Yeldon is honestly growing into a very solid 3rd down back.  He's a legit threat catching the ball out of the backfield as a checkdown or as a designed screen.  He's got a real patient style that makes him good at sifting through things and waiting for blocks to develop when he gets the ball in his hands with a bit of time, like on 3rd down.  Sort of a poor man's Lev Bell.

I just don't really know how many more touches you can hand to Grant and have him maintain that effectiveness level.  It seems to me they've actually got his touches dialed in pretty perfectly, to where he's always fresh and when he does get those touches, he usually makes something big of them.  It's probably a bit of a mirage in the sense that i doubt his success scales up all that well.  Have to separate the result from the process.

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23 hours ago, Tugboat said:

I disagree i think.

I like what Grant does, but it's such a niche thing.  Discussed it a bit during the blowout stages of the game.  His skillset is the sort of thing that works best as a change of pace, more than as a regular fixture in an offense like this.

Ivory is useful because he basically gives us a poor-man's Fournette to pound away and grind out those tough yards inside to keep things honest.

Yeldon is honestly growing into a very solid 3rd down back.  He's a legit threat catching the ball out of the backfield as a checkdown or as a designed screen.  He's got a real patient style that makes him good at sifting through things and waiting for blocks to develop when he gets the ball in his hands with a bit of time, like on 3rd down.  Sort of a poor man's Lev Bell.

I just don't really know how many more touches you can hand to Grant and have him maintain that effectiveness level.  It seems to me they've actually got his touches dialed in pretty perfectly, to where he's always fresh and when he does get those touches, he usually makes something big of them.  It's probably a bit of a mirage in the sense that i doubt his success scales up all that well.  Have to separate the result from the process.

he looked pretty good last year in a Rare Start

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On 12/20/2017 at 3:35 PM, KhanYouDigIt said:

Corey Grant needs more touches over Yeldon and Ivory btw. 

He moves way better east and west than he use to. I was impressed by him late in the game. 

He does have a rare gear on the team. Would love to see him get more looks but he wont see much if LF is healthy 

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1 hour ago, JaguarCrazy2832 said:

He does have a rare gear on the team. Would love to see him get more looks but he wont see much if LF is healthy 

I think 5 touches would be solid for grant especially getting him on that edge. 

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32 minutes ago, LinderFournette said:

I think 5 touches would be solid for grant especially getting him on that edge. 

I guess. There are too many mouths to feed right now

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On 12/22/2017 at 7:51 PM, LinderFournette said:

I think 5 touches would be solid for grant especially getting him on that edge. 

Transparent though.  Because everyone in the building is going to read those 5 touches from a mile away, as trying to get him the ball on the edge.

A lot of his success has come on gimmicky stuff, or in garbage time where opposing DCs are going vanilla to just get the game over with.

 

You have to work a guy like Grant more from a snap count perspective, and scheme in ways to keep defenses on their toes where it's not just a dead giveaway that these 5 plays are Grant getting on the edge.  And it's harder to keep a defense honest with that...unless you're gonna scheme your whole offense around that type of player like the Pats or something (which we're not, because it doesn't suit what our team is built to do).  You've gotta run him out there for a lot more than just those 5 snaps to make it credible.  Snaps where you're getting less versatility and a less automatic array of credible threats than the more versatile backs ahead of him.

Or, you just keep it highly limited and leave it as an ace up your sleeve when you need it most.

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21 minutes ago, Tugboat said:

You have to work a guy like Grant more from a snap count perspective, and scheme in ways to keep defenses on their toes where it's not just a dead giveaway that these 5 plays are Grant getting on the edge.

Which was the same problem they had with Fournette early on. Basically every time he was on the field, he was getting the ball. So teams were loading up the box with him, and then not doing so when he wasn’t in, because they knew those were likely passes. So yeah - like you said, it’s just not a good idea to only put in a guy only in situations that he’s getting the ball or is supposed to be an active diversion.

 

I think some 2 back pistol looks with Fournette and Grant would be nice though. But that’s probably not in the playbook at this point.

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19 minutes ago, iPwn said:

Which was the same problem they had with Fournette early on. Basically every time he was on the field, he was getting the ball. So teams were loading up the box with him, and then not doing so when he wasn’t in, because they knew those were likely passes. So yeah - like you said, it’s just not a good idea to only put in a guy only in situations that he’s getting the ball or is supposed to be an active diversion.

 

I think some 2 back pistol looks with Fournette and Grant would be nice though. But that’s probably not in the playbook at this point.

Yeah.  Exactly.  It's early-season Fournette...on the opposite end of the spectrum.  Which is even more difficult to disguise.  At least with early-season obvious Fournette...even when it was clear he'd be getting the ball, he still showed the talent and power to ram it down their throats anyway.  And to do it 20 times a game.  That doesn't work so well with the whole 5 touches to a scat back trying to bounce it outside concept.  Getting backs like that running in space on the edge is an art, and part of setting that up is the ugly stuff...like banging bodies around inside and establishing dominance in those trenches.  It's Doug Marrone football 101.

And of course...we've now seen them expand Fournette's roles to the point where he could do pretty much anything on any given snap.  Which isn't something i think you can ever genuinely expand Grant's role into.  He has a particular niche where he's a pretty special player, but he has a lot of areas where he's really not.  It is what it is.

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