Should 49ers have received first in OT?

[Manny/Patrick]

Last thread I’m making till the 9ers win the SB 😞, Kyle stands by Warners decision, but I thought it was a mistake, you want to know what you have to do, if Mahomes had scored a TD than you can match, but by giving Mahomes the ball last your letting him define the outcome, thoughtS?

[Jameson_Neat]

I'd defer. Chiefs score a TD and you match, it opens up the option to end the game right there by going for two. 

[ET80]

24 minutes ago, Manny/Patrick said:

Last thread I’m making till the 9ers win the SB

Oh man... I forgot about that other thread.

[TecmoSuperJoe]

REDACTED. 

But yeah, maybe they should have kicked off first in OT. Defense was gassed though. 

I get the feeling the staff didn't think too much of it, and just won the toss, got the ball, and assumed they could score a TD/FG, and stop the Chiefs from at worst get a FG, and stop the Chiefs from at worst getting a TD. 

Edited February 12 by TecmoSuperJoe

[WheatieMan]

Kyle was right for the wrong reasons, which is worse.

I want to get the ball back the second time? Well, did you know you were going to keep them out of the endzone? They had the TD to RR at the end of regulation. Why did Kyle think his defense could hold them to a FG? Would they have even gone for the FG barring some negative play in the red zone? 

The right reason was to put the pressure right back on Mahomes by scoring a TD. I am not saying FG was the wrong answer there the first possession in OT, but again, I understand the logic of receiving. But getting the ball back on the ensuing to win on a FG is not an acceptable logic.

Again, these are things you can debate at the margins. They just couldn't score TDs when it came down to it. Two TDs was not enough.  

[Jakuvious]

This was absolutely a mistake. This was one of two things I do take issue with how Shanahan managed the game. This decision, and the clock management not taking timeouts and trying to get points at the end of the first half.

With new playoff OT rules, 100% you want the ball second. I can kind of sympathize with the idea that the defense was tired. But the other rationale I've seen is you want the ball on drive #3 if it goes to sudden death, but there's no guarantee the game ever gets that far (and it didn't.) We know the first two possessions will occur, so you should go with what gives you the best shot in those, and that's deferring. KC had the benefit of knowing exactly what we needed, and it dictated how we played the drive. I don't know if we go for it on 4th if we don't have to. Our defense was money, Reid gets conservative sometimes, if it was a tie game, we may have punted. On the flip side, if San Fran knew we would score a TD, they wouldn't have settled for a FG. But they didn't know, and we did, and it fully dictated the pace and urgency of both drives.

[Jameson_Neat]

20 minutes ago, Jakuvious said:

This was absolutely a mistake. This was one of two things I do take issue with how Shanahan managed the game. This decision, and the clock management not taking timeouts and trying to get points at the end of the first half.

With new playoff OT rules, 100% you want the ball second. I can kind of sympathize with the idea that the defense was tired. But the other rationale I've seen is you want the ball on drive #3 if it goes to sudden death, but there's no guarantee the game ever gets that far (and it didn't.) We know the first two possessions will occur, so you should go with what gives you the best shot in those, and that's deferring. KC had the benefit of knowing exactly what we needed, and it dictated how we played the drive. I don't know if we go for it on 4th if we don't have to. Our defense was money, Reid gets conservative sometimes, if it was a tie game, we may have punted. On the flip side, if San Fran knew we would score a TD, they wouldn't have settled for a FG. But they didn't know, and we did, and it fully dictated the pace and urgency of both drives.

Five more minutes of rest isn't going to rejuvenate your defense. Guy wanted the ball again and the Chiefs were never going to give it back to him. 

The end of half time management shouldn't still be this bad. Its like he's waiting for his "I told you so!" moment. Smartest guy in the room vibes. 

Edited February 12 by Jameson_Neat

[LeotheLion]

One of the dumber coaching decisions I've seen. The 49ers were never getting a 2nd possession if they scored a TD as the Chiefs would just go for 2 to win the game. 

[SkolMasterMN]

 

2 minutes ago, LeotheLion said:

One of the dumber coaching decisions I've seen. The 49ers were never getting a 2nd possession if they scored a TD as the Chiefs would just go for 2 to win the game. 

Shanahan's point did make sense to me, as I was thinking two straight scores could have led to a win with defensive stops, but yes, it's a possibility the Chiefs would have just gone for the win anyways. Probably should have deferred, but hindsight is 20/20 and I don't think the decision was that awful for Shanny to get a ton of criticism. 

[warfelg]

The Ringer is reporting that Chiefs players knew and have practiced the new playoff overtime rules going back to TC, and Niners players (Armstead among them) are saying they didn’t learn about the new OT rules until it happened.

I think one spot Reid needs continued praise on from his Philly days until now is that he’s really worked on being a better situational coach and has gotten better at knowing rules like this.  Shanahan has seemed overwhelmed by situational or interesting rules concepts at times where his teams just dodn’t know about it.

[MaddHatter]

34 minutes ago, Jameson_Neat said:

Five more minutes of rest isn't going to rejuvenate your defense. Guy wanted the ball again and the Chiefs were never going to give it back to him. 

The end of half time management shouldn't still be this bad. Its like he's waiting for his "I told you so!" moment. Smartest guy in the room vibes. 

The Chiefs had just run a 12-play 65yd drive and the D looked gassed.  You're not trying to "rejuvenate" your guys, you're trying to let them catch their breath and suck down some oxygen.  He then went on to compile a 7.5 min drive that probably really lasted 10-15 minutes in real time and if not for a huge play by Wharton and Pennel to stuff CMC and then another HUGE play by Cooks to get in Purdy's face to disrupt what would have been an easy TD, they're up 7 and have a "fresh" defense ready to go back out there.  One that up to that point had done a really good job of keeping KC out of the end zone all game.  I understand Game Theory says kick it, but you have to trust that a coach knows his players, that Kyle and Wilks discussed it, and felt like the D needed a breather.  I don't think Kyle was trying to get cute there, or was trying to play 3D Chess, I think he was being a leader and looking out for his guys.

[General Tso]

It's similar to college OT where you want the ball second now. You want to see what your offense needs to accomplish.

[lancerman]

I think it was a mistake. You know you will get at minimum a chance to match and both teams definitely get the ball. So you don't gain anything going first. Even if you score a TD, the other team has the luxury of knowing that going for it on 4th down is a must. If the possessions were reversed and went exactly the same, the Niners wouldn't settle for a field goal and would go for it.

[Jameson_Neat]

1 minute ago, MaddHatter said:

The Chiefs had just run a 12-play 65yd drive and the D looked gassed.  You're not trying to "rejuvenate" your guys, you're trying to let them catch their breath and suck down some oxygen.  He then went on to compile a 7.5 min drive that probably really lasted 10-15 minutes in real time and if not for a huge play by Wharton and Pennel to stuff CMC and then another HUGE play by Cooks to get in Purdy's face to disrupt what would have been an easy TD, they're up 7 and have a "fresh" defense ready to go back out there.  One that up to that point had done a really good job of keeping KC out of the end zone all game.  I understand Game Theory says kick it, but you have to trust that a coach knows his players, that Kyle and Wilks discussed it, and felt like the D needed a breather.  I don't think Kyle was trying to get cute there, or was trying to play 3D Chess, I think he was being a leader and looking out for his guys.

I thought Shanny said it was decided before the game. Regardless, the defense is spent either way, so why would you rely on that unit to be the one to win the game? What's the worst that happens, KC scores a TD? 

I think if you take the ball, you have to go for it on 4th and 4 inside the 10.

[WheatieMan]

There is no doubt a 2-pt conversion would have happened, like over 80%. But I think the fact the they picked him off earlier and in the second half, coupled with the Pacheco fumble, gave them confidence that they'd be able to turn Mahomes over. I think the long run Mahomes had up the middle could have easily been fumbled. Also MVS running backwards was almost stripped. I think the SF D had a turnover mentality there.