Deadpulse Posted December 15, 2017 Share Posted December 15, 2017 Discuss the movie here in all its spoilerly details. If you are reading this and HAVENT seen The Last Jedi yet, avert your eyes young one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
titansNvolsR#1 Posted December 15, 2017 Share Posted December 15, 2017 I enjoyed that they went away from the generic following of the episodes that TFA had. Thought all of Luke's scenes were great. Visuals were incredible. Hated the meaningless and useless side mission of Rose and Fin, wasn't a fan of Admiral Holdo, Leia's use of the force to pull herself back onto the ship, and most of the forced humor. So much speculation on Snoke the last few years and we get no answers and he's killed off in his second scene in such a cringey manner (not word for word but the "yes, I can feel him turn the light saber to you for the killing blow" was so dumb). Not much in the way of lightsaber action and the Luke vs Kylo battle was such a crock. With all that said, I'll watch it again on TV when it comes out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunnygsm Posted December 15, 2017 Share Posted December 15, 2017 I'm so conflicted about this film. I left the theatre as mixed as I was going in. Some parts were great, some parts were ok, and some bits I just didn't like. The overall plot of the new trilogy sucks. Rebels vs Empire has been replaced with Resistance vs First Order. It's really as simple as that. They had chances to do interesting things with the plot and just haven't. It just feels like we've had two films and gotten back to where ROTJ starts. I wish they explored Rey/Luke + Kylo/Snoke a bit more. I wish they'd explored the balance between light and dark with Rey/Kylo, instead it's back to good vs evil. I don't understand Kylo's motivations which is what makes his character a bit thin for me. The subplot with Finn, Rose, and Poe was ok, but just detracted from potentially more interesting moments. General Hux seemed like a clown. Rey somehow feels underdeveloped and her progression accelerated. I was ok with her being a nobody. Knights of Ren seemed to have gotten canned silently. Visually it was great. They added new elements unlike TFA which was great. Luke's final stand was an elegant way of dealing with things as opposed to having him wreck stuff like some people wanted. OT Yoda making a reappearance was great. Lightspeed through Snoke's ship was an amazing scene as was the battle on the salt planet. Luke's arc was one of the strengths of the film. His flawed character, his mistakes, and his ultimate reconciliation. His departure left me kind of empty. I'm not sure how I feel about it. The new trilogy's biggest flaw is a lack of imagination. Hate George Lucas all you want, but his vision in that department is lacking. My biggest concern is that this is just what Star Wars is now. Quality films that lack the uniqueness that made the OT so special. In case you didn't realize. I like Star Wars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunnygsm Posted December 15, 2017 Share Posted December 15, 2017 Oh and the shot on Snoke's face after he was dead was stupid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deadpulse Posted December 15, 2017 Author Share Posted December 15, 2017 47 minutes ago, titansNvolsR#1 said: Hated the meaningless and useless side mission of Rose and Fin It was crucial to Finn's character development. When TFA started he was selfish and just trying to escape the First Order. When TFA ended, all he wanted was to save ray, which is where we begin with him in this film. He is still scared of the First Order and believes so fully that the Resistance has no chance he tries to leave preemptively so Rey doesnt come back to it. Rose and his mission see him grow to learn what there is to fight for and not just run from. Defeating Phasma was also extremely symbolic of him finally facing and overcoming his past with the First Order. His line in the base that convinces everyone to fight is proof of this change in him and Rose saving him is the final push to get him to where he needs to be, part of the spark of hope that starts the flame of a new Rebellion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ET80 Posted December 15, 2017 Share Posted December 15, 2017 - Visually stunning. If you watched it in 2D, I would suggest watching it again in 3D. The escape scene with the freighter going lightspeed right into the First Order? I almost felt as if my eyes and brain couldn't process that. Beautifully done. (Semi-related: Infinity War trailer in 3D is orgasmic). - Humor was slightly forced, but I chuckled nonetheless. It Star Wars, not War and Peace; can't take it too seriously. - Really loved the "vulnerable" side of Luke. Despite everything he was during the defeat of Vader/Palpatine, he was completely broken over what he presided over. His final scene was an amazing callback to the beginning of his journey, looking over the horizon and watching the two sunsets. A wonderful send off to Luke, IMO. (And he mockingly called it a laser sword. Classic!) - I felt like they were building a love story between Rey and Ren, which I really liked at first. Those two teaming up against the Red Guard was FILTHY, got goosebumps (and let out an audible "Oh, he got a WHIP!" mid fight scene). Would have been a really interesting Romeo and Juliet-like story, but then the story swung in a different direction. - The casino scene? Felt like I was watching Episode I. Was expecting to see some pod racing or some crap like that. I get the overarching theme of that spot as well as the character development behind it, but I didn't like it. I did like Benecio del Toro, however. - Wasn't a fan of the chicken-pugs. - Or the milkmaids. - But especially the chicken-pugs. - I guess she had to go, but I wanted to see more Captain Phasma in the final chapter. I feel we didn't know anything about her outside of the silver armor and that one time she beat the crap out of The Hound. - When holo-Luke was staring down the AT-ATs, I was so scared the movie would flash to credits, I really thought that's how'd they end it. So glad they didn't cliffhanger us on that. I would have flipped out. - So. Snoke is Darth Maul with scars and no cool dual lightsabers. A bad guy, but someone with literally no depth. A machina to prop up the bad guys for a spell. Welp, so much for Plaegus... really was hoping for that. Red Guard was flipping awesome, though. If I ever cosplay, I'm going as those dudes. (The one with the WHIP - changed my life). - Overall, it was such a far cry from Empire, which makes me so happy. I was half expecting much more of what we got with TFA, a skeletal remake of ANH with new people filling old roles. First few minutes of the movie with the escape from a Resistance hideout made me think of Hoth all over again. But - in unsuspecting fashion - the movie took a hard left and created a bond between two enemies, drew up a beloved character as a remorseful and shamed hero, saw the backstory of the real antagonist fleshed out, and leaves the stage set for the final movie. I can't wait. Seriously can't wait. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
INbengalfan Posted December 15, 2017 Share Posted December 15, 2017 5 hours ago, Deadpulse said: It was crucial to Finn's character development. When TFA started he was selfish and just trying to escape the First Order. When TFA ended, all he wanted was to save ray, which is where we begin with him in this film. He is still scared of the First Order and believes so fully that the Resistance has no chance he tries to leave preemptively so Rey doesnt come back to it. Rose and his mission see him grow to learn what there is to fight for and not just run from. Defeating Phasma was also extremely symbolic of him finally facing and overcoming his past with the First Order. His line in the base that convinces everyone to fight is proof of this change in him and Rose saving him is the final push to get him to where he needs to be, part of the spark of hope that starts the flame of a new Rebellion. His attempt at the suicide run also showed his priorities and vision had changed. He became a true leader. Was it me or do we have our first character for the next triology also being introduced with the help of a force-pulled broomstick? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunnygsm Posted December 15, 2017 Share Posted December 15, 2017 1 hour ago, INbengalfan said: His attempt at the suicide run also showed his priorities and vision had changed. He became a true leader. Was it me or do we have our first character for the next triology also being introduced with the help of a force-pulled broomstick? I got the feeling that kid at the end was more to reiterate that anyone, no matter their background, can be special/can fight. Felt like it was a message for the kids. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunnygsm Posted December 15, 2017 Share Posted December 15, 2017 I wish they just ran with the idea of Rey and Kylo taking off together. Not necessarily running the first order, but something. They're two confused kids, it could have been interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coffee & Contemplation Posted December 15, 2017 Share Posted December 15, 2017 <3 - Adam Driver was amazing. I thought he did a fine job in TFA but really stepped it up here. He delivered an outstanding performance and really became a great villain. One you hate, but still kind of cheer for. Dude got jacked too. - Laura Dern as Admiral Holdo was a great addition, and I really liked her character. Knowing what we know now, with Carrie Fisher and all, I do sort of wish they could have had Leia make that move with going to light speed into the Star Destroyer. I think it would have been in character, it would have fit in with the story just fine, and would have set up Laura Dern to take over her position in the IX. However, I know they were setting up Carrie to have a much larger role in IX and the VIII was too close to done when Carrie died and it wouldn't have been respectful or make sense to massively rewrite VIII to accommodate for that. - Porgs were nice comedic relief. This movie had to find comedy from other sources since BB8 couldn't be with everyone at once. Star Wars is a family friendly movie and it doesn't have to be serious all the time. Though I will expand on this point a bit in my "Didn't <3" section. - Puppet Yoda was a great choice. That was 100% the kooky, senile Yoda we meet in ESB. I do think he looked too CG at first, but once they zoomed in and you could see him move you could see that was, more or less, the same old Yoda. - Luke's end was totally appropriate, and I'm absolutely sure we'll see him as a Force ghost in IX. - Domhnall Gleeson is wonderful as Hux, and I love the pissing contest that goes on between him and Ben. It's a great power struggle and I hope they conflict a lot in IX. - I loved the theme of killing the past and really moving on. I think that theme is necessary if the sequels are to survive. It's a good thing they didn't push that theme much in TFA, because I think it would have been too much of "this is the new cast of Saved by the Bell, the old cast is dead, forget about Zach and Slater." TFA was a great transition from the old to the new, and this movie helped complete that transition. - Loved the turn of killing Snoke and letting Ben take control of the First Order. Snoke was far too much of an Emperor clone and this helps tell a different story. It does leave a lot of questions about Snoke unanswered, but I'm sure they'll write a Snoke book to fill in the now needless details. Didn't <3 - The first half hour of the movie feels jumpy. They're trying to tell so much story so quickly and catch you up on everyone that it's just jumping from one really short scene to another. It's just a bit jarring and I think it's an issue with the script and editing. I would have liked them to slow things down just a hair and consolidate some of those scenes so you're not being thrown around to so many characters so quickly. - It's fine for Star Wars to be funny, it's appropriate and absolutely necessary. It's in line with the OT as well. However, I did feel some of the humor at some points was a little forced feeling. It's hard to pinpoint, but it's a feeling I got a few times. It wasn't a constant problem, but I felt sometimes they jumped to the humor too quickly and robbed some of the emotion away from a scene. Again, smallish complaint there. - Didn't love Leia's Force power save. I mean, I get why it happened and I think it was important to show Ben struggle with the idea of killing her. However, we've never really known Leia to be able to use the Force, though we know she's especially sensitive to it. It was just a bit jarring to see such such a significant use of the Force from someone we've never really seen use it aside from a brief connection with Luke in the OT. MIXED I love Rian Johnson. His past work is outstanding in so many ways and I was really pumped to see what he could do with Star Wars. I left mostly really happy. I think visually he exceeded every other director who has touched these films. Dialogue was a little "eh" at times though. Not prequel level bad, but there were some lines that just felt lazy or unnecessary. I'm always a fan of letting visuals dominate and using dialogue as a necessity and I think he could have done a better job there. I'm still really excited to see what he does with a brand new untethered trilogy and yeah, overall great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeeEvans Posted December 15, 2017 Share Posted December 15, 2017 8 hours ago, sunnygsm said: I'm so conflicted about this film. I left the theatre as mixed as I was going in. Some parts were great, some parts were ok, and some bits I just didn't like. The overall plot of the new trilogy sucks. Rebels vs Empire has been replaced with Resistance vs First Order. It's really as simple as that. They had chances to do interesting things with the plot and just haven't. It just feels like we've had two films and gotten back to where ROTJ starts. I wish they explored Rey/Luke + Kylo/Snoke a bit more. I wish they'd explored the balance between light and dark with Rey/Kylo, instead it's back to good vs evil. I don't understand Kylo's motivations which is what makes his character a bit thin for me. The subplot with Finn, Rose, and Poe was ok, but just detracted from potentially more interesting moments. General Hux seemed like a clown. Rey somehow feels underdeveloped and her progression accelerated. I was ok with her being a nobody. Knights of Ren seemed to have gotten canned silently. Visually it was great. They added new elements unlike TFA which was great. Luke's final stand was an elegant way of dealing with things as opposed to having him wreck stuff like some people wanted. OT Yoda making a reappearance was great. Lightspeed through Snoke's ship was an amazing scene as was the battle on the salt planet. Luke's arc was one of the strengths of the film. His flawed character, his mistakes, and his ultimate reconciliation. His departure left me kind of empty. I'm not sure how I feel about it. The new trilogy's biggest flaw is a lack of imagination. Hate George Lucas all you want, but his vision in that department is lacking. My biggest concern is that this is just what Star Wars is now. Quality films that lack the uniqueness that made the OT so special. In case you didn't realize. I like Star Wars. I agree with with you on most of the comments. I love that they actually branched out and didn't just do the Empire Strikes Back V2 and I don't mind another bad force versus a good force although I wish it was a little bit more of a grey area rather than good versus evil. I'm also getting a little tired of a single Jedi appearing and saving the galaxy, I wish there was maybe several more so it didn't feel so much of a fairy tale. The biggest thing that you said is that Kylo's motivations are just completely missing. If anything it was the perfect moment for him to turn and not suddenly fully give into the dark side. Also, he just doesn't do it for me as the "big bad". I loved his conflicted character and thought it was done brilliantly by Driver but him as the Supreme Leader just doesn't feel right at all. I actually kinda liked the fact Snoke just kind of died and had no real impact and that he wasn't some all powerful force user. I'm disappointed Rey and Kylo didn't team up for some side because their chemistry was incredible and I want as much screen time between them as possible. I also think you're given the casino subplot more credit than it deserves, that whole story line with the hacker included was just garbage and a waste of time. Agreed on the visuals and on Luke's departure. I just don't understand why he force ghosted away, the Resistance needs him more than ever and I really wanted to see more of him either in a training way or combat. It sucked that he did the most baller force stuff ever and then just dips out to hang out with Yoda. Speaking of which, Yoda was the MVP. His scene with Luke was amazing and the fact that he was covering for Rey, who stole the texts from the tree, and gave Luke the push he needed was incredible. The guy is like thousands of years old and has been dead for decades and still has to do everything himself haha. Overall, I liked the movie but I didn't love it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeeEvans Posted December 15, 2017 Share Posted December 15, 2017 37 minutes ago, sunnygsm said: I wish they just ran with the idea of Rey and Kylo taking off together. Not necessarily running the first order, but something. They're two confused kids, it could have been interesting. Them running away from both sides and finding their own path, sort of like Kylo said, would have been incredible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ET80 Posted December 15, 2017 Share Posted December 15, 2017 2 hours ago, INbengalfan said: Was it me or do we have our first character for the next triology also being introduced with the help of a force-pulled broomstick? I read something on this, and really liked it - the boy is a symbol and/or reminder that the next great Jedi/Sith isn't going to be a Skywalker or a Solo or even a Kenobi. It's going to be anyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunnygsm Posted December 15, 2017 Share Posted December 15, 2017 The redeeming point about the Casino subplot was that it helped develop Finn's character. That said, I do agree that the execution was subpar and overly long at times. Poe's development felt like it could have been done a bit better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coffee & Contemplation Posted December 15, 2017 Share Posted December 15, 2017 Yeah, the Casino bit and all of Rose was necessary for Finn to have something to do. I think he's at his best when he's with Rey, but he naturally couldn't be with Rey during this story so they kind of just had to find something for him to do. I think they did as good of a job as could be expected without just awkwardly writing off one of the four main characters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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