110 N.F.L brains found to have CTE out of 111

[candyman93]

Quote

Dr. Ann McKee, a neuropathologist, has examined the brains of 202 deceased football players. A broad survey of her findings was published on Tuesday in The Journal of the American Medical Association. 

Of the 202 players, 111 of them played in the N.F.L. — and 110 of those were found to have chronic traumatic encephalopathy, or C.T.E., the degenerative disease believed to be caused by repeated blows to the head. 

C.T.E. causes myriad symptoms, including memory loss, confusion, depression and dementia. The problems can arise years after the blows to the head have stopped.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2017/07/25/sports/football/nfl-cte.html?smid=tw-nytimes&smtyp=cur&_r=0

[UKTexans]

Must say I'm not really surprised. 

[Dome]

10 minutes ago, texans_uk said:

Must say I'm not really surprised. 

This. I wonder how any of them were linemen.

[UKTexans]

Who were the 91 non-NFL players? College? 

[Adrenaline_Flux]

14 minutes ago, texans_uk said:

Who were the 91 non-NFL players? College? 

College or high school.

This is definitely concerning, but keep in mind that like most of these studies, they're studying the brains of people who already believe (when they elect to donate their brain) they might have it. I would also still like to see a study comparing rates with the general public.

[cddolphin]

The bigger question is whether these players experienced CTE-related side effects while they were living.

19 minutes ago, Adrenaline_Flux said:

I would also still like to see a study comparing rates with the general public.

This, too. 

[Shanedorf]

29 minutes ago, Adrenaline_Flux said:

This is definitely concerning, but keep in mind that like most of these studies, they're studying the brains of people who already believe (when they elect to donate their brain) they might have it. I would also still like to see a study comparing rates with the general public.

They talk about the study bias you mentioned above- the people who agree to have the brains assessed have seen symptoms that suggest CTE- so the numbers are definitely skewed. However...

"About 1,300 former players have died since the B.U. group began examining brains. So even if every one of the other 1,200 players would have tested negative — which even the heartiest skeptics would agree could not possibly be the case — the minimum C.T.E. prevalence would be close to 9 percent, vastly higher than in the general population."

These teams at BU are doing "good science" and following Good Clinical Practice Guidelines.

They are not some sham operation like the crew the NFL assembled to say " everything is fine...nothing to see here"

[UKTexans]

38 minutes ago, Adrenaline_Flux said:

College or high school.

This is definitely concerning, but keep in mind that like most of these studies, they're studying the brains of people who already believe (when they elect to donate their brain) they might have it. I would also still like to see a study comparing rates with the general public.

So did none of them suffer from CTE at all? 

[drd23]

9 minutes ago, texans_uk said:

So did none of them suffer from CTE at all? 

From the abstract of the actual journal article:

Quote

Among 202 deceased former football players (median age at death, 66 years [interquartile range, 47-76 years]), CTE was neuropathologically diagnosed in 177 players (87%; median age at death, 67 years [interquartile range, 52-77 years]; mean years of football participation, 15.1 [SD, 5.2]), including
0 of 2 pre–high school,
3 of 14 high school (21%),
48 of 53 college (91%),
9 of 14 semiprofessional (64%),
7 of 8 Canadian Football League (88%), and
110 of 111 National Football League (99%) players.

 

[UKTexans]

Those are some scary high numbers.

[mse326]

6 minutes ago, texans_uk said:

Those are some scary high numbers.

They are but they are still donated not randomly selected. There has shown, in this area, to be a strong correlation between those that choose to donate and those that also show some of the symptoms.

Without a truly random sample these numbers need to be taken with a grain of salt. They don't neccessarily represent truth.

The also rarely look per position. And frankly all of them are too small a sample size to get meaningul information.

I certainly don't deny that CTE is a problem, but I have yet to see a proper study that comes close to providing even reasonably reliable percentages.

[Shanedorf]

Yes they are some scary numbers.

One bit of good news is that there is a team at UCLA who is developing a diagnostic test that works in living patients, its currently in clinical trials to assess its validity in Alzheimer's patients and is being adapted to assess CTE and other diseases.

http://newsroom.ucla.edu/releases/ucla-study-finds-characteristic-pattern-of-protein-deposits-in-brains-of-retired-nfl-players-who-suffered-concussions

“These results suggest that this brain scan may also be helpful as a test to differentiate trauma-related cognitive issues from those caused by Alzheimer’s disease.”

The PET scans revealed that the imaging patterns of the retired football players showed tau deposit patterns consistent with those that have been observed in autopsy studies of people with CTE.

In addition, the areas in the brain where the patterns occurred were also consistent with the types of symptoms experienced by some of the study participants.

[Shanedorf]

4 minutes ago, mse326 said:

Without a truly random sample these numbers need to be taken with a grain of salt. They don't neccessarily represent truth.

The also rarely look per position. And frankly all of them are too small a sample size to get meaningul information.

I certainly don't deny that CTE is a problem, but I have yet to see a proper study that comes close to providing even reasonably reliable percentages.

Here's a little illumination : The study PI noted it in her comments:

About 1,300 former players have died since the B.U. group began examining brains. So even if every one of the other 1,200 players would have tested negative — which even the heartiest skeptics would agree could not possibly be the case — the minimum C.T.E. prevalence would be close to 9 percent, vastly higher than in the general population."

That tells us that the incidence is somewhere between 9 and 99% for football players and that either end of that spectrum is still vastly higher than in the general population. She also published her results in JAMA, one of the most prestigious journals in medical research and her work was peer reviewed.

And yes, they did look at it by position....They know the slings & arrows that will come their way and have done as much as possible to bullet -proof their work against the skeptics. And they've also gone out of their way to not over-state the results.

"The strengths of this study are that this is the largest CTE case series ever described to our knowledge, more than doubling the size of the 2013 report,⁶ and that all participants were exposed to a relatively similar type of repetitive head trauma while playing the same sport. In addition, the comprehensive neuropathological evaluation and retrospective clinical data collection were independently performed while blinded to the findings of the other investigators. "

Kudos to them for tackling a very difficult project and for doing such great work on it. This also offers a hint as to why the NFL is hell-bent on expanding in the EU and other countries. They know they are going to lose some fans / players from the US, so they will find new revenue and new players elsewhere

[amazingandre]

How do those numbers compare to the general public?

[WizardHawk]

I get the concerns over CTE, not something I'd wish on anyone, but I don't find any of it surprising. People aren't meant to crash into each other over and over. Something is bound to give.