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110 N.F.L brains found to have CTE out of 111


candyman93

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Played full contact football 7th, 8th, 9th, 10th, 11th, and 12th grade and a year in college (the 1 year in college was during a study abroad and it was like a club sport, not legit college lol). I also tore my ACL my senior year so I played half that season.

I've probably had more than a hundred concussions if we're counting really really minor ones. This was back when we still had two practices a day (which are banned now) and our coaches literally made us line up across from each other with 15 yards and run full speed at each other, and did other gnarly stuff like Oklahoma Drills. Those collisions where you get a few seconds of blurry vision and some ringing in my ears? Hell if those are considered minor concussions I might have had a hundred in a single year. I remember in 7th grade the coaches used us as dummies for the 9th graders to just slaughter. Yeah, lots of headaches from that. And after games I'd go to sleep with headaches, neckaches, and ringing in my ears.

And that's just the average nobody. I can't imagine what an NFL player goes through.

When CTE scans become widely available and affordable, I really wonder if this sport can survive. What happens if every kid who played some degree of football growing up shows up with some positive results? The entire nation would light up like a Christmas tree, that should spark some debate.

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Yeah this really mostly shows that players suspected of having CTE had CTE.

 

There are risks with many jobs, join the military and your going to have a higher percentage of being shot at than an athlete.

 

Be a mailman and you are more likely to be bit by a dog than a beautician.

 

Be a prostitute and you are more likely to contract an STD than a politician.

 

There are risks to go along with the rewards in just about any job. Everything possible should be done to limit the damage but it will always exist and people will have to make the choice for themselves if the risk is worth the reward.

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I'm curious about sports like MMA, Boxing, WWE, and Rugby as well. I agree about the sample size and it's good that they are having other trials. Hopefully, it is something teams/doctors can scan and monitor throughout a season, eventually.

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Assuming the study's numbers are accurate, there is going to need to be some change. Forcing the safest helmets on players would be a good start. While complete removal of helmets seems asinine to me, a more absorbent, non-solid exterior helmet seems like the way to go.

The Vicis Zero1 helmet that is starting to be used this season on a volunteer basis. Looks pretty promising:
https://shop.vicis.co/products/zero1

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18 hours ago, mse326 said:

I certainly don't deny that CTE is a problem, but I have yet to see a proper study that comes close to providing even reasonably reliable percentages.

This is by design. The cost to design, recruit for, and execute a true blinded study on brain pathology of deceased players and a viable control group will run in the tens of millions of dollars and take years. It's far more cost-effective both in terms of dollars and time to perform exploratory studies that look at a subset of populations to determine if a link may exist or rule out that possibility.

This study is concluding "we need to throw money at this".

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19 hours ago, cddolphin said:

The bigger question is whether these players experienced CTE-related side effects while they were living.

This, too. 

That was noted in the article.

"Data on informants were collected beginning in 2014. The median number of participating informants was 2 (IQR, 1-3) per participant. Among all of the interviews, 71 (64%) included a spouse/partner, 56 (51%) included an adult child, 27 (24%) included a sibling, 16 (14%) included a parent, 13 (12%) included a non–first-degree relative, 8 (7.2%) included a neighbor or friend, and 4 included other informants. Among the informants who knew the participant the longest, the mean relationship length was 45.8 years (SD, 1.5 years).

Among the 111 CTE cases with standardized informant reports on clinical symptoms, a reported progressive clinical course was common in participants with both mild and severe CTE pathology, occurring in 23 (85%) mild cases and 84 (100%) severe cases (Table 3). Behavioral or mood symptoms were common in participants with both mild and severe CTE pathology, with symptoms occurring in 26 (96%) mild cases and 75 (89%) severe cases. Impulsivity, depressive symptoms, apathy, and anxiety occurred in 23 (89%), 18 (67%), 13 (50%), and 14 (52%) mild cases and 65 (80%), 46 (56%), 43 (52%), and 41 (50%) severe cases, respectively. Additionally, hopelessness, explosivity, being verbally violent, being physically violent, and suicidality (including ideation, attempts, or completions) occurred in 18 (69%), 18 (67%), 17 (63%), 14 (52%), and 15 (56%) mild cases, respectively. Substance use disorders were also common in participants with mild CTE, occurring in 18 (67%) mild cases. Symptoms of posttraumatic stress disorder were uncommon in both groups, occurring in 3 (11%) mild cases and 9 (11%) severe cases.

Cognitive symptoms were common in participants with both mild and severe CTE pathology, with symptoms occurring in 23 (85%) mild cases and 80 (95%) severe cases. Memory, executive function, and attention symptoms occurred in 19 (73%), 19 (73%), and 18 (69%) mild cases and 76 (92%), 67 (81%), and 67 (81%) severe cases, respectively. Additionally, language and visuospatial symptoms occurred in 54 (66%) and 44 (54%) severe cases, respectively. A premortem diagnosis of AD and a postmortem (but blinded to pathology) consensus diagnosis of dementia were common in severe cases, occurring in 21 (25%) and 71 (85%), respectively. There were no asymptomatic (ie, no mood/behavior or cognitive symptoms) CTE cases. Motor symptoms were common in severe cases, occurring in 63 (75%). Gait instability and slowness of movement occurred in 55 (66%) and 42 (50%) severe cases, respectively. Symptom frequencies remained similar when only pure CTE cases (ie, those with no neuropathological evidence of comorbid neurodegenerative disease) were considered (eTable in the Supplement).

Among the 111 CTE cases with standardized informant reports on clinical symptoms, 47 (42.3%; median age at death, 76 years [IQR, 63-81 years]) initially presented with cognitive symptoms, 48 (43.2%; median age at death, 66 years [IQR, 54-73 years]) initially presented with behavior or mood symptoms, and 16 (14.4%; median age at death, 65.5 years [IQR, 39-78]) initially presented with both cognitive symptoms and behavior or mood symptoms. Forty (85%) of those initially presenting with only cognitive symptoms were reported to have behavior or mood symptoms at the time of death and 43 (90%) of those initially presenting with only behavior or mood symptoms were reported to have cognitive symptoms at the time of death. Dementia was present at the time of death in 36 (77%) of those initially presenting with cognitive symptoms, 33 (69%) of those initially presenting with behavior or mood symptoms, and 11 (69%) of those initially presenting with both cognitive and behavior or mood symptoms.

The most common primary cause of death was neurodegenerative for all 3 groups (cognitive, 26 [55%]; behavior or mood, 16 [33%]; both cognitive and behavior or mood, 6 [38%]). Substance use disorders, suicidality, and family history of psychiatric illness were common among those who initially presented with behavior or mood symptoms, occurring in 32 (67%), 22 (47%), and 23 (49%) cases, respectively."

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15 minutes ago, ramssuperbowl99 said:

Behavioral or mood symptoms were common in participants with both mild and severe CTE pathology, with symptoms occurring in 26 (96%) mild cases and 75 (89%) severe cases. Impulsivity, depressive symptoms, apathy, and anxiety occurred in 23 (89%), 18 (67%), 13 (50%), and 14 (52%) mild cases and 65 (80%), 46 (56%), 43 (52%), and 41 (50%) severe cases, respectively. Additionally, hopelessness, explosivity, being verbally violent, being physically violent, and suicidality (including ideation, attempts, or completions) occurred in 18 (69%), 18 (67%), 17 (63%), 14 (52%), and 15 (56%) mild cases, respectively. Substance use disorders were also common in participants with mild CTE, occurring in 18 (67%) mild cases. Symptoms of posttraumatic stress disorder were uncommon in both groups, occurring in 3 (11%) mild cases and 9 (11%) severe cases.

Not to go full NFL shill, but none of this means CTE caused these behaviors. I don't think that would be a reasonable position at this point. Being anxious or verbally violent aren't exactly rare behaviors limited to those with brain damage.

It's good to have the data though. 

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1 minute ago, cddolphin said:

Not to go full NFL shill, but none of this means CTE caused these behaviors. I don't think that would be a reasonable position at this point. Being anxious or verbally violent aren't exactly rare behaviors limited to those with brain damage.

It's good to have the data though. 

Yes - determining a statistically significant link to CTE versus a control and determining that CTE leads to these types of behaviors was outside the scope of this study.

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On 7/25/2017 at 2:29 PM, mse326 said:

They are but they are still donated not randomly selected. There has shown, in this area, to be a strong correlation between those that choose to donate and those that also show some of the symptoms.

Without a truly random sample these numbers need to be taken with a grain of salt. They don't neccessarily represent truth.

The also rarely look per position. And frankly all of them are too small a sample size to get meaningul information.

I certainly don't deny that CTE is a problem, but I have yet to see a proper study that comes close to providing even reasonably reliable percentages.

 

23 hours ago, Shanedorf said:

Here's a little illumination : The study PI noted it in her comments:

About 1,300 former players have died since the B.U. group began examining brains. So even if every one of the other 1,200 players would have tested negative — which even the heartiest skeptics would agree could not possibly be the case — the minimum C.T.E. prevalence would be close to 9 percent, vastly higher than in the general population."

That tells us that the incidence is somewhere between 9 and 99% for football players and that either end of that spectrum is still vastly higher than in the general population. She also published her results in JAMA, one of the most prestigious journals in medical research and her work was peer reviewed.

And yes, they did look at it by position....They know the slings & arrows that will come their way and have done as much as possible to bullet -proof their work against the skeptics. And they've also gone out of their way to not over-state the results.

"The strengths of this study are that this is the largest CTE case series ever described to our knowledge, more than doubling the size of the 2013 report,6 and that all participants were exposed to a relatively similar type of repetitive head trauma while playing the same sport. In addition, the comprehensive neuropathological evaluation and retrospective clinical data collection were independently performed while blinded to the findings of the other investigators. "

Kudos to them for tackling a very difficult project and for doing such great work on it. This also offers a hint as to why the NFL is hell-bent on expanding in the EU and other countries. They know they are going to lose some fans / players from the US, so they will find new revenue and new players elsewhere

I'm with @mse326 here in no way am I a CTE denier but there are more things that need to be taken into account. First and foremost is that the median age of death for these samples is 66 years old. That means that the vast majority of these samples have been out of the NFL for over 25-30 years. The advancements that have been made in player safety haven't really been in effect for more than the last 10 years or so.

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I am not really sure what can be done about this.  People have suggested newer or updated helmets, teaching different tackling techniques and a bevy of other potential solutions, but the game of football is just naturally violent.  A defender could hit a wide receiver with a text book tackle where neither of their helmets contact each other, but on the way down, the receivers head can potentially bounce off of the grass/turf and cause a concussion.

As sad as this sounds, these reports and more attention to this topic really help the sport of baseball.  Baseball has been losing young American athletes to football for so long that over the next ten to fifteen years, we may start to see a shift when more and more parents refuse to let their kids play football.

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  • 3 weeks later...

One of my coworkers sons just started youth football. He's in 2nd grade. I mentioned this study and she said "My husband said it's only college and pro players that get concussions."

ok.

How long before major legislation involving youth football? What could they do to improve the game?

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