mission27 Posted December 18, 2017 Share Posted December 18, 2017 TLO and I were talking today about how absurd Barry Bonds being blackballed was. To review after the 2007 season, his last year of his contract with the Giants, Bonds expressed an interest in continuing to play but did not get any offers. Bond was 42 so a lot of teams and media that wanted him to go away made the excuse that he was washed up and not worth the headache. After winning 4 straight MVPs from 2001-2004 and being literally the best player in baseball history over that 4 year stretch, Bonds missed 2005 with an injury and then ... it is true ... was not quite the same player in 2006 and 2007. However the problem is that Barry Bonds was obvi still one of the best hitters in baseball. Compare these two players from 2006-2007: Player A: .273/.467/.554, 1.021 OPS, .418 wOBA Player B: .302/.407/.584, 0.991 OPS, .418 wOBA That off-season, Player A got no offers from any MLB team. Player B, ARod, signed the largest contract in pro-sports history. Bonds actually led the National League in OPS and wOBA in 2007 ahead of Albert Pujols, Chase Utley, Ryan Braun, Prince Fielder, Matt Holliday, Chipper Jones, Ryan Howard, Miguel Cabrera, and a million other great hitters. That's not to mention Bonds was doing all this in San Francisco, where he had to play the field every day and was dealing with the pressure of the home run chase and constant negative media attention. As a DH, focusing exclusively on staying healthy and hitting, does anyone honestly think he couldn't have continued to be a productive hitter? Here's a list of DH's who had a higher OPS in 2008 than Bonds' 1.045 in 2007: And here's a list of players at any position who did: Albert Pujols (1.114) Instead of any AL team doing the rational thing and signing arguably the best hitter in baseball to DH and OPS 1.000, baseball blackballed Bonds and robbed fans of seeing the greatest player in modern baseball history play another year or two. This is like if Tom Brady or Lebron James were a little banged up next year, had an off season (but were still among the best players in the league), and then couldn't find a job. So my question is, is this the worst injustice in the history of baseball, or just top-5? And should we view Bud Selig as the greatest disgrace in baseball history, or just top-5? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrry32 Posted December 18, 2017 Share Posted December 18, 2017 Yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramssuperbowl99 Posted December 18, 2017 Share Posted December 18, 2017 9 hours ago, mission27 said: So my question is, is this the worst injustice in the history of baseball, or just top-5? And should we view Bud Selig as the greatest disgrace in baseball history, or just top-5? Top 2. Banning Shoeless Joe Jackson for life is number 1. Lazily quoting wiki: Some news accounts quoted Jackson, during grand jury testimony on September 28, 1920, admitting that he agreed to participate in the fix" “ When a Cincinnati player would bat a ball out in my territory I'd muff it if I could—that is, fail to catch it. But if it would look too much like crooked work to do that I'd be slow and make a throw to the infield that would be short. My work netted the Cincinnati team several runs that they never would have had if we had been playing on the square. ” No such testimony appears in the actual stenographic record of Jackson's grand jury appearance. In 1921, a Chicago jury acquitted Jackson and his seven teammates of wrongdoing. Nevertheless, Kenesaw Mountain Landis, the newly appointed Commissioner of Baseball, imposed a lifetime ban on all eight players. "Regardless of the verdict of juries", Landis declared, "no player that throws a ballgame; no player that undertakes or promises to throw a ballgame; no player that sits in a conference with a bunch of crooked players and gamblers where the ways and means of throwing games are planned and discussed and does not promptly tell his club about it, will ever play professional baseball. Fair enough, except. Jackson spent most of the last 30 years of his life proclaiming his innocence, and evidence has surfaced that casts significant doubt on his involvement in the fix. Jackson reportedly refused the $5,000 bribe on two separate occasions — despite the fact that it would effectively double his salary — only to have teammate Lefty Williams toss the cash on the floor of his hotel room. Jackson then reportedly tried to tell White Sox owner Charles Comiskey about the fix, but Comiskey refused to meet with him. Unable to afford legal counsel, Jackson was represented by team attorney Alfred Austrian—a clear conflict of interest. Before Jackson's grand jury testimony, Austrian allegedly elicited Jackson's admission of his supposed role in the fix by plying him with whiskey. Austrian was also able to persuade the nearly illiterate Jackson to sign a waiver of immunity from prosecution. Years later, the other seven players implicated in the scandal confirmed that Jackson was never at any of the meetings. Williams said that they only mentioned Jackson's name to give their plot more credibility. Jackson's performance during the series itself lends further credence to his assertions. A 1993 article in The American Statistician reported the results of a statistical analysis of Jackson's contribution during the 1919 World Series, and concluded that there was "substantial support to Jackson's subsequent claims of innocence". And even though we know he didn't throw the series (he bat .375 for crying out loud), Selig and Manfred still won't overturn his ban. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
devils1854 Posted December 18, 2017 Share Posted December 18, 2017 Bill Hall being blackballed by the HOF is a bigger travesty Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
playmaker8267 Posted December 19, 2017 Share Posted December 19, 2017 Tom Yawkey and Joe Cronin refusing to sign Willie Mays nor Jackie Robinson, when they had the first shot at both of them, is the biggest travesty of all time. The Bonds thing is the most willfully ignored potential instance of collusion that I can remember. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mission27 Posted December 19, 2017 Author Share Posted December 19, 2017 4 hours ago, devils1854 said: Bill Hall being blackballed by the HOF is a bigger travesty Thats fair tbh. Is he eligible stil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MWil23 Posted December 19, 2017 Share Posted December 19, 2017 Easily Shoeless Joe. He would have been the series MVP if the BlackSox won it, hitting .375 with at the time a World Series record 12 hits and didn't make an error. He was paid $5,000 before the series because gamblers refused to do "the fix" without Jackson. A confused Jackson took the cash straight to Comiskey before the series to return it, trying to tell him of the fix ahead of time. Comiskey completely blew him off. Additionally, the document that Joe signed was forced upon him by a team lawyer, and Joe was literally illiterate and trusted him at his/the team's word. WHAT A JOKE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danger Posted December 19, 2017 Share Posted December 19, 2017 Pete Rose Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mission27 Posted December 20, 2017 Author Share Posted December 20, 2017 7 hours ago, Danger said: Pete Rose Yeah but he was a flea tbf And what he did was arguably unethical Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thelonebillsfan Posted December 20, 2017 Share Posted December 20, 2017 I mean Pete Rose deserved to get tossed when he got tossed. He was told repeatedly to stop, he didn't, he got the boot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tom cody Posted December 20, 2017 Share Posted December 20, 2017 To me Rose, Bonds and Clemens are all Hall of Famers. Don't agree with what they did or are alleged to have done in some cases but time has past and these guys should be remembered for their talents. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramssuperbowl99 Posted December 20, 2017 Share Posted December 20, 2017 9 hours ago, mission27 said: Yeah but he was a flea tbf And what he did was arguably unethical Idea for the smug thread: Top 25 fleas in baseball history. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mission27 Posted December 20, 2017 Author Share Posted December 20, 2017 1 hour ago, ramssuperbowl99 said: Idea for the smug thread: Top 25 fleas in baseball history. Do we just want the biggest fleas ever or do we want to find some fleas who managed to eek out some smugness? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramssuperbowl99 Posted December 20, 2017 Share Posted December 20, 2017 4 minutes ago, mission27 said: Do we just want the biggest fleas ever or do we want to find some fleas who managed to eek out some smugness? Good question. I'm thinking 2 separate lists: 1. Best fleas in MLB history 2. Most smug moments in MLB history from fleas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MWil23 Posted December 20, 2017 Share Posted December 20, 2017 3 hours ago, Thelonebillsfan said: I mean Pete Rose deserved to get tossed when he got tossed. He was told repeatedly to stop, he didn't, he got the boot. ...AND he was the one who voluntarily signed his own death warrant knowing full well what it meant. To quote Vince McMahon on the Montreal Screwjob: "Pete screwed Pete" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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