AnAngryAmerican Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 15 minutes ago, champ11 said: My list at 5 right now - seems like Darnold and Allen are locks as of now to go top 3: 1. Rosen (no way he's there, tbh) 2. Chubb 3. Barkley 4. Nelson (gap - would truthfully be very happy with any of 2-4) 5. Mayfield 6. Roquan Smith (preferably on a trade down) I agree about Darnold a lock to go before us but I'm not convinced yet that Allen will. Thus, my list for No. 5 overall looks as follows. Josh Rosen Bradley Chubb Saquaon Barkley Josh Allen Quenton Nelson Really I'd be happy with any of those five, I applaud the pick if any of them were taken. I wouldn't draft Mayfield period. If we don't land one of those five we better be trading down as anyone else at No. 5 would be a reach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul-mac Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 I need to watch some tape on Chubb, because the PFF podcast doesn’t love him. Not that they don’t think he’s good, but they think he’s more of a 4-3 DE that slides inside on 3rd down to a pure edge rusher. They liken him to Solomon Thomas last year. That’s not to say that we shouldn’t take him if he’s the Best Player Available, but I’m not sure he’s the slam dunk top 5 pass rusher that Von Miller was. Once I’ve watched tape I’ll come back on here and report my findings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
germ-x Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 8 minutes ago, paul-mac said: I need to watch some tape on Chubb, because the PFF podcast doesn’t love him. Not that they don’t think he’s good, but they think he’s more of a 4-3 DE that slides inside on 3rd down to a pure edge rusher. They liken him to Solomon Thomas last year. That’s not to say that we shouldn’t take him if he’s the Best Player Available, but I’m not sure he’s the slam dunk top 5 pass rusher that Von Miller was. Once I’ve watched tape I’ll come back on here and report my findings. He’s not an elite pass rusher, like a Von Miller. But he’s still damn good capable of 8-10+ sacks a season while being elite vs the run. He’s a good enough player to fit any scheme and comes with versatility. Joey Bosa had the same knock (he’s a 4/3 LE) the Chargers took him because he was the BPA while they were still running a 3/4 and it worked out fine. Chubb’s has identical size to Bosa and is a better run defender and has elite effort. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnAngryAmerican Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 Mike Klis lays out the argument against taking a QB, any of the QBs, at No. 5 overall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul-mac Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 6 minutes ago, AnAngryAmerican said: Mike Klis lays out the argument against taking a QB, any of the QBs, at No. 5 overall. Mike Klis is a good reporter on “factual” Broncos stuff. He’s a mouthpiece for the franchise and is usually decent at reporting Free Agency pickups etc. But my God, when he starts throwing his own opinions into the fire he is an absolute train wreck. He seems to genuinely think Keenum is the second coming of Peyton Manning. Not to mention the fact he was ripping the Bears for re-signing Kyle Fuller (for some reason) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Broncofan Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 7 minutes ago, paul-mac said: Mike Klis is a good reporter on “factual” Broncos stuff. He’s a mouthpiece for the franchise and is usually decent at reporting Free Agency pickups etc. But my God, when he starts throwing his own opinions into the fire he is an absolute train wreck. He seems to genuinely think Keenum is the second coming of Peyton Manning. Not to mention the fact he was ripping the Bears for re-signing Kyle Fuller (for some reason) I just don’t know when he’s separating org mouthpiece work from his own opinions. The opinion pieces are garbage but the scary part is they might be the org getting their takes out there. I can stomach the former but the latter is a potential disaster for our organization’s future direction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Broncofan Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 49 minutes ago, germ-x said: He’s not an elite pass rusher, like a Von Miller. But he’s still damn good capable of 8-10+ sacks a season while being elite vs the run. He’s a good enough player to fit any scheme and comes with versatility. Joey Bosa had the same knock (he’s a 4/3 LE) the Chargers took him because he was the BPA while they were still running a 3/4 and it worked out fine. Chubb’s has identical size to Bosa and is a better run defender and has elite effort. Bosa though has insane short area quickness and explosion and perhaps the best hand fighting skills in the NFL. That’s a huge difference IMO. That’s how Bosa beats guys not just consistently but also quickly. There is no peer in his group now. A better comp IMO is NFL version of Jadaveon Clowney without the injury or motor Q’s. Skill wise that’s the identical comp. Clowney lost almost 2 years to injury but now he’s a dominant DE. Not elite in pass rush but combined with a great pass rusher (not just Watt but Mercilus after Watt went down), the duo are a terror. Like Clowney they aren’t at the elite Bosa / Von level in pass rush but deadly when paired with another great pass rusher. And total disrupters in the run game on their own. Complete players like that paired with a Von are how you create an elite trench D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
germ-x Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 4 minutes ago, Broncofan said: Bosa though has insane short area quickness and explosion and perhaps the best hand fighting skills in the NFL. That’s a huge difference IMO. That’s how Bosa beats guys not just consistently but also quickly. There is no peer in his group now. A better comp IMO is NFL version of Jadaveon Clowney without the injury or motor Q’s. Skill wise that’s the identical comp. Clowney lost almost 2 years to injury but now he’s a dominant DE. Not elite in pass rush but combined with a great pass rusher (not just Watt but Mercilus after Watt went down), the duo are a terror. Like Clowney they aren’t at the elite Bosa / Von level in pass rush but deadly when paired with another great pass rusher. And total disrupters in the run game on their own. Complete players like that paired with a Von are how you create an elite trench D. Yeah or Clowney. Point being, Chubb has the size, run defense, and athleticism to fit any scheme. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsthomp2007 Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 I agree with Klis...there is no need to take a QB at No. 5 at this point for the Broncos. If they hadn't signed Keenum, I'd say there was a chance. But, now we have a year or two to reassess what the Broncos have in Lynch, and it gives them time to assess what they have in Kelly....and it gives them time to see if Keenum's last year wasn't a fluke. Honestly, I am not expecting fireworks from the Broncos next year....so, to see what they have as a coach and as a QB is crucial next year. Along with the fact that as long as they keep that defense intact...that covers up a lot of flaws...come on to Denver Chubb! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Broncofan Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 6 minutes ago, germ-x said: Yeah or Clowney. Point being, Chubb has the size, run defense, and athleticism to fit any scheme. It’s funny that Clowney pick was hugely criticized for 2.5 years then stopped once ppl saw the elite skills come through once the whole Lisfranc saga resolved. I think ppl still projected elite pass rush chops which Clowney wasn’t ever going to provide given his short area quickness wasn’t elite. His case opened my eyes to how important this skill is in the NFL for DL’s (not just EDGE’s) and how college film can be insufficient in projecting short area explosion / quickness to NFL success or failure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsthomp2007 Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 12 minutes ago, Broncofan said: Bosa though has insane short area quickness and explosion and perhaps the best hand fighting skills in the NFL. That’s a huge difference IMO. That’s how Bosa beats guys not just consistently but also quickly. There is no peer in his group now. A better comp IMO is NFL version of Jadaveon Clowney without the injury or motor Q’s. Skill wise that’s the identical comp. Clowney lost almost 2 years to injury but now he’s a dominant DE. Not elite in pass rush but combined with a great pass rusher (not just Watt but Mercilus after Watt went down), the duo are a terror. Like Clowney they aren’t at the elite Bosa / Von level in pass rush but deadly when paired with another great pass rusher. And total disrupters in the run game on their own. Complete players like that paired with a Von are how you create an elite trench D. I think with Von on the other side, that would ease Chubb's job a bit...there is no way a team would dial in on Chubb with Von on the other side. Von is scarier to me, in my opinion, than Bosa, Watt, Clowney...Von is a lot to handle...and dun't get hurt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnAngryAmerican Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 I think both @paul-mac and @Broncofan are missing the point of that Klis article I linked to. He is laying out the argument against taking a QB at No. 5. Tomorrow, or sometime soon, he's going to lay out the argument for taking a QB. If I can defend him here for a second, which of these arguments that he makes against taking a QB early is not accurate? It's questionable whether it's wise to double-down on QBs; spending the biggest chunk of your available cap money on one and then turning around and spending your rarely-held premium draft pick on another one. Why draft a QB when we have an announced starter, who we're paying starter's money, when we can get an elite prospect - Chubb, Barkley, Nelson - at No. 5 who helps us compete right away next year. Will Case, and for that matter the other veterans on the team, want another QB "controversy?" Vance proved is not exactly Gary Kubiak when it comes to managing the QB position in-season. How will the team deal with the calls "to play the kid" after Case has a bad game or two? Elway has proven he is adept at landing QBs in free agency - Peyton and now Case - but has not proven the ability to identify good QB prospects in the draft as both he has taken with premium picks - Brock and Paxton - haven't exactly worked out. Our coaching staffs do not have a good track record developing young QBs. All four of the top QB prospects in this year's class have red flags, be it system, size, personality, production, etc. I don't think you can quibble with any of those points. They might not add up to enough to stay away from taking a QB at No. 5, but all are valid arguments against doing so. For the record, I have said several times that I would take Rosen or Darnold at No. 5, and could live with taking Allen at No. 5, but if we opted for Chubb, Nelson or Barkley, I would be fine with that as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AKRNA Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 59 minutes ago, AnAngryAmerican said: Mike Klis lays out the argument against taking a QB, any of the QBs, at No. 5 overall. he also had the second part of the article, why we should take a QB, tucked in there. Personally, I'm much more aligned with the reasoning behind not taking a QB at that spot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnAngryAmerican Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 6 minutes ago, AKRNA said: he also had the second part of the article, why we should take a QB, tucked in there. Personally, I'm much more aligned with the reasoning behind not taking a QB at that spot. Yep. Here's Part II. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsthomp2007 Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 8 minutes ago, AKRNA said: he also had the second part of the article, why we should take a QB, tucked in there. Personally, I'm much more aligned with the reasoning behind not taking a QB at that spot. I think the day they signed Keenum, QB isn't even a question now...not until next year if Keenum is bad. But, I think Keenum is going to be good...just my gut. I actually like the way the Broncos are being built right now. I signing and trades are not big time...but, they seem effective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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