Joe Flacco has a back injury - Unclear how long out

[paraven]

21 minutes ago, Danand said:

We have heard the same story again and again about how Perriman needs chemistry with Flacco. The same could be said about basically every player on the offense not named Mike Wallace.

 

Maybe its just because back injuries worries me a lot, but having injuries linger like that usually isn't a good thing

Well perriman is sitting out of practice already, so there is really no rush in bringing him back. So we got that going for us 

[Danand]

32 minutes ago, paraven said:

Well perriman is sitting out of practice already, so there is really no rush in bringing him back. So we got that going for us 

I thought about adding that point as well, but no need to beat the dead horse (injuries to perriman). But Maclin, Watson, Williams, Moore have a combined, what, 25 catches from Flacco - that's not a recipe for succes. A brand new receiving corps and a questionable oline could be a recipe for disaster in the first half of the season.

[wackywabbit]

1 hour ago, Danand said:

I thought about adding that point as well, but no need to beat the dead horse (injuries to perriman). But Maclin, Watson, Williams, Moore have a combined, what, 25 catches from Flacco - that's not a recipe for succes. A brand new receiving corps and a questionable oline could be a recipe for disaster in the first half of the season.

Well our offense was an unmitigated disaster for the first half of last season (literally 32nd in DVOA halfway through) and we still just barely missed the playoffs. I was never even hoping for a great offense off the bat this year. I expect another rough break-in. The sooner we can get to an average level on that side of the ball, the better. 

But, this season is going to go as far as the defense can take us. If the pass rushers can come through and everyone in the secondary doesn't drop like flies. then I'm still pretty optimistic for the season.

[Danand]

Our defense had a huge part in us not reaching anything last year. Just as well they played in some games, they just came up inept and not capable of making stops to close the game.

Thats why my confidence hasn't been high, and I have my doubts we will do much this season.

[wackywabbit]

8 hours ago, Danand said:

Our defense had a huge part in us not reaching anything last year. Just as well they played in some games, they just came up inept and not capable of making stops to close the game.

Thats why my confidence hasn't been high, and I have my doubts we will do much this season.

Whatever it was, the points that we were atrocious on offense for half a season and that we still were very close to making the playoffs, those are facts. The specific instances of what happened last year are history at this point. The ability to close on defense should be boosted an improved secondary and pass rush, which I believe we have. 

[Danand]

3 hours ago, wackywabbit said:

Whatever it was, the points that we were atrocious on offense for half a season and that we still were very close to making the playoffs, those are facts. The specific instances of what happened last year are history at this point. The ability to close on defense should be boosted an improved secondary and pass rush, which I believe we have. 

I really hope we see something more regarding the pass rush. I think the Cowboys pretty much showed, that we didn't have enough talent on defense to play both the run and the pass. When we played to stop Dak, Zeke and their oline dominated, when we wanted to stuff the run, a rookie QB killed us.

We had a few games where either side dominated enough to get us a W, but the two sides rarely where able to put together a balanced game. Especially the Raiders game and Steelers game are examples of games where our defense led us down in the end. While we had 10 rushing yards against the Jets, thats no excuse for letting their offense score 24 points on us (we had some awful tackling in that game).

So far, I haven't seen us make the moves to correct what we saw last season. We DO have brought in the talent to be great, but thats 1-2 years from now.

[sp6488]

9 hours ago, wackywabbit said:

Whatever it was, the points that we were atrocious on offense for half a season and that we still were very close to making the playoffs, those are facts. The specific instances of what happened last year are history at this point. The ability to close on defense should be boosted an improved secondary and pass rush, which I believe we have. 

Agreed completely.  

On defense, I really like what our secondary looks like with Smith-Carr-Humphrey-Boykin at CB, Wilson-Weddle at S and Webb as a jack-of-all-trades supplement.  Seems very improved to me, as does the pass rush with the injection of Williams and Bowser.

I really like what Woodhead gives us out of the backfield, by the way.  I think the WR group we have should leave A TON of space in the underneath area of the field for Woodhead to have huge receiving numbers.

Like you said, we were close last year (had that Pitt game gone the other way, we would have been in it to the end, who knows at that point what happens in the CIN game).  I like where we stand, despite the injuries.

[sp6488]

6 hours ago, Danand said:

I really hope we see something more regarding the pass rush. I think the Cowboys pretty much showed, that we didn't have enough talent on defense to play both the run and the pass. When we played to stop Dak, Zeke and their oline dominated, when we wanted to stuff the run, a rookie QB killed us.

We had a few games where either side dominated enough to get us a W, but the two sides rarely where able to put together a balanced game. Especially the Raiders game and Steelers game are examples of games where our defense led us down in the end. While we had 10 rushing yards against the Jets, thats no excuse for letting their offense score 24 points on us (we had some awful tackling in that game).

So far, I haven't seen us make the moves to correct what we saw last season. We DO have brought in the talent to be great, but thats 1-2 years from now.

Whhat would have corrected it, on the defensive side, in your opinion?  We got another corner and a safety.  Both are vets, why are they 1-2 year guys.  Also got a first round corner from a big program.

For the pass rush, we lost Doom who did almost nothing last season and added two high potential rushers in Williams and Bowser.  If anything, we've seen that situational rushers can contribute right away against the pass (its other parts of game that take some fine-tuning).  Z. Smith and Judon come back with an additional year under their belts as well.

Not saying anything is guaranteed, but I don't see why the moves made won't show benefits this season.

[Danand]

6 hours ago, sp6488 said:

Whhat would have corrected it, on the defensive side, in your opinion?  We got another corner and a safety.  Both are vets, why are they 1-2 year guys.  Also got a first round corner from a big program.

For the pass rush, we lost Doom who did almost nothing last season and added two high potential rushers in Williams and Bowser.  If anything, we've seen that situational rushers can contribute right away against the pass (its other parts of game that take some fine-tuning).  Z. Smith and Judon come back with an additional year under their belts as well.

Not saying anything is guaranteed, but I don't see why the moves made won't show benefits this season.

I have high hopes for Tim Williams as a situational pass rusher. Humphrey was not my favorite pick, but he do has a physical talent and comes with upside. The reason I see us being much better in 1-2 years is because we have to give our young talents reps and time to develop. Pass rush and coverage killed us last year, I don't think Brandon Carr and a couple of rookies will fix that immediately. What move we could have made on the defensive side? We had limited options and while Carr might be durable, he is more serviceable than actually good.

I would have preferred that we had focused more on solidifying the oline so we could run the ball, use the playaction fake, keep our defense fresh that way.

[sp6488]

7 hours ago, Danand said:

I have high hopes for Tim Williams as a situational pass rusher. Humphrey was not my favorite pick, but he do has a physical talent and comes with upside. The reason I see us being much better in 1-2 years is because we have to give our young talents reps and time to develop. Pass rush and coverage killed us last year, I don't think Brandon Carr and a couple of rookies will fix that immediately. What move we could have made on the defensive side? We had limited options and while Carr might be durable, he is more serviceable than actually good.

I would have preferred that we had focused more on solidifying the oline so we could run the ball, use the playaction fake, keep our defense fresh that way.

Why do you continue to ignore the addition of tony Jefferson to the secondary?

[coordinator0]

1 hour ago, sp6488 said:

Why do you continue to ignore the addition of tony Jefferson to the secondary?

Going from Weddle at SS and Webb at FS to Jefferson at SS and Weddle at FS could very well be a downgrade to the pass defense. I'm not saying it definitely is yet, not until the regular season is underway and games are in the books, but I'm leaning that way. I'm not a big fan of Webb but he was solid at FS. Weddle's best spot is at SS in a role he roves around the field, not so much carrying the deep responsibility by himself. And that's exactly what has to happen with Jefferson next to him. This isn't a great thing and the big reason I wasn't too enthused about signing Tony.

Now if Pees actually implements the dime package where Jefferson is up near the LoS with Webb deep and Weddle between then that's great. But it would have to be used often and given his history that has almost no chance of happening. 

[sp6488]

2 hours ago, coordinator0 said:

Going from Weddle at SS and Webb at FS to Jefferson at SS and Weddle at FS could very well be a downgrade to the pass defense. I'm not saying it definitely is yet, not until the regular season is underway and games are in the books, but I'm leaning that way. I'm not a big fan of Webb but he was solid at FS. Weddle's best spot is at SS in a role he roves around the field, not so much carrying the deep responsibility by himself. And that's exactly what has to happen with Jefferson next to him. This isn't a great thing and the big reason I wasn't too enthused about signing Tony.

Now if Pees actually implements the dime package where Jefferson is up near the LoS with Webb deep and Weddle between then that's great. But it would have to be used often and given his history that has almost no chance of happening. 

Articulating this POV is one thing.  Saying we added one vet corner and some rookies to the secondary, while ignoring Jefferson altogether, is another.

[Danand]

4 hours ago, sp6488 said:

Why do you continue to ignore the addition of tony Jefferson to the secondary?

Coordinator already mentioned it, but I can easily elaborate.

We added what I and most others see as a great safety against the run. That doesn't help much in the pass defense department. Why do you keep ignoring we added a 1. round cornerback who nobody really expected would start early? Why do you keep ignoring that we didn't add an inside linebacker who can cover? I could go on.

Edit: Sry I don't drink the purple cool aid constantly, but I see us making some of the same priorities which have cost us in previous years. We might overcome some of it, and we might struggle in some areas. I don't claim I have the perfect recipe for succes, but I think I have a point when I say, that we have some huge questionmarks going into the season - questionmarks which are a result of the way we prioritized building the roster.

[sp6488]

22 hours ago, Danand said:

Coordinator already mentioned it, but I can easily elaborate.

We added what I and most others see as a great safety against the run. That doesn't help much in the pass defense department. Why do you keep ignoring we added a 1. round cornerback who nobody really expected would start early? Why do you keep ignoring that we didn't add an inside linebacker who can cover? I could go on.

Edit: Sry I don't drink the purple cool aid constantly, but I see us making some of the same priorities which have cost us in previous years. We might overcome some of it, and we might struggle in some areas. I don't claim I have the perfect recipe for succes, but I think I have a point when I say, that we have some huge questionmarks going into the season - questionmarks which are a result of the way we prioritized building the roster.

To the bolded, you could make the points you're making without the weak internet tough guy posturing...

Anyway, if you think he's not an asset against the pass, then you could have simply said that.  You're writing/wording implied a collectively exhaustive list of secondary additions, of which he was not a part.  How am I ignoring that we added a first round corner?  He's certainly better than our 3/4 options last season, even if he's not expected to start right away.  I', not "ignoring" anything about ILB.  I never made a statement similar to yours that implied collective exhaustion of topics...  

It's fine for us to disagree on topics, all I took real issue with was your statement that, as written, was blatantly untrue.

[Danand]

19 minutes ago, sp6488 said:

To the bolded, you could make the points you're making without the weak internet tough guy posturing...

Anyway, if you think he's not an asset against the pass, then you could have simply said that.  You're writing/wording implied a collectively exhaustive list of secondary additions, of which he was not a part.  How am I ignoring that we added a first round corner?  He's certainly better than our 3/4 options last season, even if he's not expected to start right away.  I', not "ignoring" anything about ILB.  I never made a statement similar to yours that implied collective exhaustion of topics...  

It's fine for us to disagree on topics, all I took real issue with was your statement that, as written, was blatantly untrue.

Internet tough guy? You are reading the cool aid part wrong. I know I am more of a sceptic during preseason than most, and that is what I am referring to.

And from where I sit, I just didn't think it was necessary to account for every addition. My point was, that I didn't see us strengthen a part of the defense, and as I didn't see Jefferson playing a huge part in that argument, I left out his name. And the ignoring first round corner part was an example of, that we don't have to take every player or position into account when making an argument. Otherwise the posts will be looong.

I still can't figure out, what I wrote was untrue. We added potential to our pass rush and secondary, but I don't see us much stronger in the pass defense department than we was a year ago. Injuries plays a part, but we also prioritized to sign a NT to a huge contract and a run stopper at SS and most likely a run stopper at inside linebacker. The first round corner we picked isn't sledged in to start from day one and we moved a slower safety to the free safety spot. I think I have a very valid point. I hope I am wrong though.