Random Packer News & Notes

[Leader]

Bob McGinn -  ICYMI: Grading Packers-Lions. One thing Jimmy Graham has done pretty well is catch the ball. His three drops, however, have stood out.
A first-play seamer vs Det. and end-zone drops vs. Phila and Det in Oct.

• Ben Fennell -  As far as offensive skilled players, Jimmy Graham has been the worst Packer over the last 2 seasons and I’m not sure it’s even remotely close.
• Route Running
• Contested Catches
• YAC
• Blocking Effort

• What does Jimmy Graham do well? What’s his redeeming quality?

[Mazrimiv]

2 minutes ago, AlexGreen#20 said:

If Rodgers hits half of his missed throws last season that offense looked pretty darn good. 

I feel like last year Rodgers had a bigger issue with choosing the wrong target vs outright bad throws.  Especially the misses on "easy" throws.

[Golfman]

1 hour ago, AlexGreen#20 said:

How many years in a row are we expected to accept statistical production outside of the top 10 and still act like he's still there?

I really don't want to hear about his lack of talent three days after he just tied the record for most overthrows in an NFL game. 

The last two he was injured so there is that. This one, new coach and offense and challenged at skilled positions. He's clearly not the Rodgers circa, 2016, but he's still a lot better than 22 of the starting QBs for sure, IMO. 

I"ve voiced my negative thoughts on Rodgers pretty often. He frustrates the heck out of me on game day. As a pass rusher I'd watch the play clock and when it's clicking to 00 get a jump. I think he's a victim of his own press and he believes it too much. 

Just my two cents. 

[Leader]

Andy Herman -  Fun story lines from 2019 we can put to bed to start 2020:

Matt LaFleur’s not ready to be an NFL coach.
Aaron Rodgers & Matt LaFleur won’t be able to coexist.
The power structure of Ball, LaFleur, & Gutekunst reporting to Murphy can’t work.
Aaron Jones can’t be an every down back

/////////////////////

Anything worth discussing?

[AlexGreen#20]

1 minute ago, Golfman said:

The last two he was injured so there is that. This one, new coach and offense and challenged at skilled positions. He's clearly not the Rodgers circa, 2016, but he's still a lot better than 22 of the starting QBs for sure, IMO. 

I"ve voiced my negative thoughts on Rodgers pretty often. He frustrates the heck out of me on game day. As a pass rusher I'd watch the play clock and when it's clicking to 00 get a jump. I think he's a victim of his own press and he believes it too much. 

Just my two cents. 

Is he A LOT better than 22 other starting QBs?

There's 18 QBs within 5 points of his passer rating.

There's 16 QBs within .5 yards of his Adjusted Net Yards/Attempt

There's 14 offenses within .1 points per drive. 

 

[AlexGreen#20]

2 minutes ago, Leader said:

Andy Herman -  Fun story lines from 2019 we can put to bed to start 2020:

Matt LaFleur’s not ready to be an NFL coach.
Aaron Rodgers & Matt LaFleur won’t be able to coexist.
The power structure of Ball, LaFleur, & Gutekunst reporting to Murphy can’t work.
Aaron Jones can’t be an every down back

/////////////////////

Anything worth discussing?

Aaron Jones has only played 61% of snaps this year. Admittedly that's good for 9th in the league, but still

There's 4 every down backs in the league: McCaffrey (93.4), Elliott (83.3), Fournette (82.9), and Bell (77.1).

Jones is only at 15th in carries. 

[Golfman]

Just now, AlexGreen#20 said:

Is he A LOT better than 22 other starting QBs?

There's 18 QBs within 5 points of his passer rating.

There's 16 QBs within .5 yards of his Adjusted Net Yards/Attempt

There's 14 offenses within .1 points per drive. 

 

How many of them have 13 wins with the lack of talent he is strapped with at the skilled positions? He's got 1 + guy in Adams. The rest are, at this point of their career, JAGs in every since of the word. OK, if you want to throw in A. Jones catching passes out of the backfield, I'll give you that, but he's had a few crucial drops. Though, for a RB out of the backfield he's a + as well. 

I think there are a few of those guys who could make a pretty good leap next year. Not to mention we'll be in year two of MLF's offense. 

You go ahead and keep hating though! 

 

[Golfman]

1 minute ago, AlexGreen#20 said:

Aaron Jones has only played 61% of snaps this year. Admittedly that's good for 9th in the league, but still

There's 4 every down backs in the league: McCaffrey (93.4), Elliott (83.3), Fournette (82.9), and Bell (77.1).

Jones is only at 15th in carries. 

So what you are saying is there is no such thing as an every down back? I read that more that he can be in on passing situations, which McCarthy didn't really allow much of because of his pass protection. Now, he got steamrolled a few times and missed one or two, but he had improved and was useful in third down situations. 

[AlexGreen#20]

1 minute ago, Golfman said:

How many of them have 13 wins with the lack of talent he is strapped with at the skilled positions? He's got 1 + guy in Adams. The rest are, at this point of their career, JAGs in every since of the word. OK, if you want to throw in A. Jones catching passes out of the backfield, I'll give you that, but he's had a few crucial drops. Though, for a RB out of the backfield he's a + as well. 

I think there are a few of those guys who could make a pretty good leap next year. Not to mention we'll be in year two of MLF's offense. 

You go ahead and keep hating though! 

 

WINS ISN'T A QB STAT. 

We're 15th in PPG. We're 9th in PPG Allowed. If we're evaluating teams purely on their offense, this isn't a playoff caliber team. 

For as much of a pass as Rodgers gets for having supposedly terrible skill players, he doesn't seem to take any flack for having a great offensive line?

 

 

The 49ers are 2nd in points scored. They've got Kittle as their starting TE, but after him they've got Deebo Samuel (a rookie) and Emmanuel Sanders (32 years old).

 The Saints are 3rd in pints scored. Their #2 receiver has 421 yards. 

The Cowboys are 6th in points scored. Adams is better than Cooper. They've managed to turn Gallup into something. Randall Cobb (magically) became good again? Graham is better than Witten.

The Patriots are 7th in points scored. Adams is better than Edelman. Jones is better than James White. Lazard and MVS are every bit as good as Phillip Dorsett and Jakobi Meyers.

The Seahawks are 9th in pionts scored. Adams is better than Lockett. Metcalf is a 900 yard receiver as a rookie apparently. Graham is better than Hollister. David Moore sucks.

The Titans are 10th in points scored. Are you telling me that Ryan Tannehill with a top 3 of AJ Brown (rookie), Corey Davis (601 yards), and Jonnu Smith (439 yards) is just blowing us out of the water?

The Eagles are 12th in points scored. They don't have a WR with 500 yards or a skill player that cracked 1000.

The Texans are 14th in points scored. Adams is as good as Hopkins. Will Fuller has a total of 670 yards this year. Still is at 561. Their TE is at 418.

+++

Not having an elite set of WRs isn't killing your offense. 

 

[Sasquatch]

31 minutes ago, Golfman said:

The last two he was injured so there is that. This one, new coach and offense and challenged at skilled positions. He's clearly not the Rodgers circa, 2016, but he's still a lot better than 22 of the starting QBs for sure, IMO. 

I"ve voiced my negative thoughts on Rodgers pretty often. He frustrates the heck out of me on game day. As a pass rusher I'd watch the play clock and when it's clicking to 00 get a jump. I think he's a victim of his own press and he believes it too much. 

Just my two cents. 

The running the clock down used to bug me also - not so much anymore.  He runs the clock down because of disguised defensive looks. It’s a chess match - he’s waiting for them to show their hand, and the closer the clock gets to zero, the more confident he is that the position they’re in is the one they’ll attack with.

[AlexGreen#20]

1 minute ago, Sasquatch said:

The running the clock down used to bug me also - not so much anymore.  He runs the clock down because of disguised defensive looks. It’s a chess match - he’s waiting for them to show their hand, and the closer the clock gets to zero, the more confident he is that the position they’re in is the one they’ll attack with.

He needs to start mixing it up after like 7 seconds. He gives the Defense an incredible jump. It's bit us in the *** a few times this year. Other QBs manage to read a defense without blowing it. 

[Sasquatch]

1 minute ago, AlexGreen#20 said:

He needs to start mixing it up after like 7 seconds. He gives the Defense an incredible jump. It's bit us in the *** a few times this year. Other QBs manage to read a defense without blowing it. 

I’ve watched so many snaps where the defense shifts late in the game-clock - regardless of if Rodgers audible or not.  He’s waiting for them to show their hand.  If he snaps between two seconds and zero, they’re not getting that much of a jump - they still have to wait for the ball to be snapped.

In the list of things to knit-pick about Rodgers, this has fallen to the bottom of my list.

[Golfman]

1 hour ago, Sasquatch said:

I’ve watched so many snaps where the defense shifts late in the game-clock - regardless of if Rodgers audible or not.  He’s waiting for them to show their hand.  If he snaps between two seconds and zero, they’re not getting that much of a jump - they still have to wait for the ball to be snapped.

In the list of things to knit-pick about Rodgers, this has fallen to the bottom of my list.

OK, this doesn't compute for me! Plenty of times he's gotten them to commit early and he changes the play. Then they adjust their defense. Snap the damn ball when they are changing their defense. 

I agree with @AlexGreen#20 on this one. Change it up a little bit. Also, they changed the rule and are stopping the play rather than give him a free shot. Let's get some tempo going once in a while too. It wears a defense out! 

[Golfman]

1 hour ago, AlexGreen#20 said:

WINS ISN'T A QB STAT. 

We're 15th in PPG. We're 9th in PPG Allowed. If we're evaluating teams purely on their offense, this isn't a playoff caliber team. 

For as much of a pass as Rodgers gets for having supposedly terrible skill players, he doesn't seem to take any flack for having a great offensive line?

 

 

The 49ers are 2nd in points scored. They've got Kittle as their starting TE, but after him they've got Deebo Samuel (a rookie) and Emmanuel Sanders (32 years old).

 The Saints are 3rd in pints scored. Their #2 receiver has 421 yards. 

The Cowboys are 6th in points scored. Adams is better than Cooper. They've managed to turn Gallup into something. Randall Cobb (magically) became good again? Graham is better than Witten.

The Patriots are 7th in points scored. Adams is better than Edelman. Jones is better than James White. Lazard and MVS are every bit as good as Phillip Dorsett and Jakobi Meyers.

The Seahawks are 9th in pionts scored. Adams is better than Lockett. Metcalf is a 900 yard receiver as a rookie apparently. Graham is better than Hollister. David Moore sucks.

The Titans are 10th in points scored. Are you telling me that Ryan Tannehill with a top 3 of AJ Brown (rookie), Corey Davis (601 yards), and Jonnu Smith (439 yards) is just blowing us out of the water?

The Eagles are 12th in points scored. They don't have a WR with 500 yards or a skill player that cracked 1000.

The Texans are 14th in points scored. Adams is as good as Hopkins. Will Fuller has a total of 670 yards this year. Still is at 561. Their TE is at 418.

+++

Not having an elite set of WRs isn't killing your offense. 

 

Actually it is and they speak of how many wins QB's have often. Even if it doesn't fit your narrative. 

As for a lack of talent at the skilled positions not affecting our offense adversely, we'll agree to disagree! No surprise! 

 

[Ragnar Danneskjold]

30 minutes ago, Golfman said:

Actually it is and they speak of how many wins QB's have often. Even if it doesn't fit your narrative. 

As for a lack of talent at the skilled positions not affecting our offense adversely, we'll agree to disagree! No surprise! 

 

While I think that Rodgers has not been playing as well as he used to, I have to feel that it is hard to argue that this offense would not be better if they had a legitimate #2 receiver to pair with Adams.  Lazard looks promising as a #3, MVS and Gmo are really a like 4 and 5 receivers.