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Donald Lee 2010 - 6.1 yards per target
Driver 2010 - 6.6 yards per target
Brandon Jackson 2010 - 6.8 yards per target
Aaron Jones 2019 - 7.0 yards per target
Quarless 2010 - 7.2 yards per target
Graham 2019 - 7.5 yards per target
Jones 2010 - 7.8 yards per target
Adams 2019 - 7.9 yards per target
MVS 2019 - 8.1 yards per target
Nelson 2010 - 9.1 yards per target
Lazard 2019 - 9.2 Yards Per Target
Jennings 2010 - 10.1 Yards Per Target

The only receiver in 2010 with a better target to catch ratio was Jordy Nelson. 

Even Greg Jennings had a catch percentage of 60.8% in 2010. 

Rodgers just targeted him a lot.  Looking back, we can see that Jordy had a very strong season in 2010 with a VERY high catch percentage, and that was a good future indicator.  We didn't know that at the time, but that's why you can't look at receivers when comparing a year. 

I'm not saying our 2019 receiving corps is better or even was better that year compared to 2010.
CLEARLY 2010 was better.  Both on the year and in their careers, but when you look at the YEAR, they weren't SIGNIFICANTLY better than what we had in 2019.

And I'd go so far as to suggest that we currently have more promise at the position than we did then.

Especially if we draft a receiver. 

 

 

Edited by Outpost31
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I don't so much hate the Tweet, I hate how people are using it.  They're acting like you need receivers for a QB to have a great year or get to the Super Bowl.  It's just sickening. 

Sanders had 28 catches and 2 touchdowns as a rookie in 2010.
Antonio Brown had 16 catches and 0 touchdowns as a rookie in 2010.
Antwaan Randle El had 22 catches and 0 touchdowns in his final season in 2010.
Hines Ward had 59 receptions for 755 yards and 5 touchdowns in his second to last year in 2010.

Mike Wallace as a legitimately terrifying deep threat and Greg Jennings were the only receivers in 2010 that were any good at all in that actual year. 

It's almost like what should be taken from that Tweet is that you don't know what you've got at WR until you've given them time to develop.

Antonio Brown - 4th year breakout.
Emmanuel Sanders - 4th year breakout.
Hines Ward - 4th year breakout.
Mike Wallace - 2nd year breakout. 

Yeah, Brown had a great second year as a deep threat, but this Tweet is like a lecture of patience for receivers when we've got two, possibly three if ESB comes back healthy, and everyone is acting like we need to go out and do this and do that and they're pointing to the 2010 Super Bowl as proof when that Super Bowl roster had not one, not two, not three, not four, but FIVE RECEIVERS WHO TOOK UNTIL THEIR FOURTH YEAR TO BREAK OUT.

Hell, James Jones was nothing more than JAG until his 6th year. 

 

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21 minutes ago, Outpost31 said:

Driver 2010 - 85 targets, 51 receptions, 11.1 YPC, 60% TGT/CATCH
Jones 2010 - 87 targets, 50 receptions, 13.6 YPC, 57.5% TGT/CATCH
Nelson 2010 - 64 targets, 45 receptions, 12.9 YPC, 71% TGT/CATCH
Lazard 2019 - 52 targets, 35 receptions, 13.6 YPC, 67.3 TGT/CATCH

The only receiver in 2010 with a better target to catch ratio was Jordy Nelson. 

Even Greg Jennings had a catch percentage of 60.8% in 2010. 

Rodgers just targeted him a lot.  Looking back, we can see that Jordy had a very strong season in 2010 with a VERY high catch percentage, and that was a good future indicator.  We didn't know that at the time, but that's why you can't look at receivers when comparing a year. 

I'm not saying our 2019 receiving corps is better or even was better that year compared to 2010.
CLEARLY 2010 was better.  Both on the year and in their careers, but when you look at the YEAR, they weren't SIGNIFICANTLY better than what we had in 2019.

And I'd go so far as to suggest that we currently have more promise at the position than we did then.

Especially if we draft a receiver. 

 

the stat you are searching for here is yards/target.

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Great, now I'm really interested to see how well YARDS PER TARGET correlates to future success.  Very interesting. 

Donald Lee 2010 - 6.1 yards per target
Driver 2010 - 6.6 yards per target
Brandon Jackson 2010 - 6.8 yards per target
Aaron Jones 2019 - 7.0 yards per target
Quarless 2010 - 7.2 yards per target
Graham 2019 - 7.5 yards per target
Jones 2010 - 7.8 yards per target
Adams 2019 - 7.9 yards per target
MVS 2019 - 8.1 yards per target
Nelson 2010 - 9.1 yards per target
Lazard 2019 - 9.2 Yards Per Target
Jennings 2010 - 10.1 Yards Per Target

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1 minute ago, Outpost31 said:

9.1 for Jordy.
9.2 for Lazard.

Thanks. 

for reference, for high usage starting receivers, 8 yards/target is like your floor.  When you go below that it's not too good of a sign, in my personal opinion.  That can mean the guy is possibly over-used, or that he is lacking in some other area (e.g. not catching enough of his targets, or not enough of a big play threat).

 

Davante dipped below that barely last year.  Julio jones is kind of the gold standard here at a high usage 9.7 Y/T for his career.

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37 minutes ago, Outpost31 said:

Maybe you should read and find out for yourself.

In 2010, the Packers had a single elite receiver.
In 2010, the Packers had a veteran WR who was not what he was and was clearly limited by his age.
In 2010, the Packers had two promising receivers who had not shown much.
In 2010, the Packers had NOTHING at RB.
In 2010, the Packers had NOTHING at TE. 

In 2019, the Packers had a single elite receiver.
In 2019, the Packers had a veteran TE who was not what he was and was clearly limited by his age.
In 2019, the Packers had two promising rookie/second year receivers.
In 2019, the Packers had an elite RB.

The only edge you can give to the 2010 Packers was a veteran WR.  Driver was great and if he'd been able to make the jump earlier in his career or had two more years, he might have snuck into the HOF, but he was not anything close to elite in 2010. 

And James Jones was no better in 2010 than Lazard was in 2019.  In fact, if Lazard had been given an opportunity earlier this year, he would have had a significantly better season than Jones had in 2010.

Jordy Nelson was worse in 2010 than MVS was in 2019. 

There is so much crap here i dont know where to begin. The 2010 receiving group was talented and deep. The 2019 group was Davante and a bunch of jags.

You saying 2019 MVS was better than 2010 Jordy is poo. Funny, laughable poo. You are just reading football stats and passing them off as player evaluations. Jordy was the #4 receiver behind 3 productive receivers that were well entrenched in their spots. Outside of Davante, MVS came into the season as our top WR and nobody out performing him. Guys like Lazard had to get snaps over him midway through the season because he was nowhere near the player that Jordy was in 2010.  Jordy was a big part of the playoff run because we knew he could beat the crap out of other teams’ 4th CB.

 

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4 minutes ago, skibrett15 said:

for reference, for high usage starting receivers, 8 yards/target is like your floor.  When you go below that it's not too good of a sign, in my personal opinion.  That can mean the guy is possibly over-used, or that he is lacking in some other area (e.g. not catching enough of his targets, or not enough of a big play threat).

 

Davante dipped below that barely last year.  Julio jones is kind of the gold standard here at a high usage 9.7 Y/T for his career.

Yeah, but Davante wasn’t quite 100% this year, and he also chucked a bunch of uncatchable passes that were more like throwaways to Davante this year.

The proof really is in the YPT for 2010.  Jennings was insanely good that year, Jordy was better than anyone thought he was, Driver was cooked.  
 

Gives me even more faith that Lazard is slightly above JAG territory.  I feel like Lazard could very easily have a James Jones type career.

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1 minute ago, snackattack said:

There is so much crap here i dont know where to begin. The 2010 receiving group was talented and deep. The 2019 group was Davante and a bunch of jags.

You saying 2019 MVS was better than 2010 Jordy is poo. Funny, laughable poo. You are just reading football stats and passing them off as player evaluations. Jordy was the #4 receiver behind 3 productive receivers that were well entrenched in their spots. Outside of Davante, MVS came into the season as our top WR and nobody out performing him. Guys like Lazard had to get snaps over him midway through the season because he was nowhere near the player that Jordy was in 2010.  Jordy was a big part of the playoff run because we knew he could beat the crap out of other teams’ 4th CB.

 

How about you take your poo and shove it back from where it came.

Gamepass is still free.  Look at the “targets” he had in 2019 in the first half of the year compared to the second half.

Sick of this BS.  Maybe instead of saying “Der the evidence you provide sucks,” provide some evidence to support your argument.

That or STFU and leave me alone.  I’ll have a conversation with anyone who wants to have a conversation on it, but you’ve provided precisely **** to the conversation.

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Just now, Outpost31 said:

Yeah, but Davante wasn’t quite 100% this year, and he also chucked a bunch of uncatchable passes that were more like throwaways to Davante this year.

The proof really is in the YPT for 2010.  Jennings was insanely good that year, Jordy was better than anyone thought he was, Driver was cooked.  
 

Gives me even more faith that Lazard is slightly above JAG territory.  I feel like Lazard could very easily have a James Jones type career.

Anecdotally, I agree with the Davante getting a lot of crap uncatchable stuff.  Y/T is a qb-WR stat, not a WR stat.  Impossible to remove the qb from the equation.

Personally, Davante's low Y/T last year to me means that he's facing too much attention and slightly over-targeted.  Which we would all agree with I think.  In an ideal world, Jimmy Graham, MVS, Lazard, Jones and others would've taken on more of the load.  But that just didn't happen.  We also didn't see Davante break too many huge plays.  There were overthrows, and a lot of sideline routes.  Not quite as many 30-40 yard chunk plays which juice up the numbers.

 

Lazard at high Y/T is def encouraging.  He started to develop into that guy who could at least take something that was given to him and take some of the pressure off of Davante.

 

Team needs another guy at the wide receiver position, the position Rodgers has had the most career success throwing the ball to.

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Just now, snackattack said:

There is so much crap here i dont know where to begin. The 2010 receiving group was talented and deep. The 2019 group was Davante and a bunch of jags.

You saying 2019 MVS was better than 2010 Jordy is poo. Funny, laughable poo. You are just reading football stats and passing them off as player evaluations. Jordy was the #4 receiver behind 3 productive receivers that were well entrenched in their spots. Outside of Davante, MVS came into the season as our top WR and nobody out performing him. Guys like Lazard had to get snaps over him midway through the season because he was nowhere near the player that Jordy was in 2010.  Jordy was a big part of the playoff run because we knew he could beat the crap out of other teams’ 4th CB.

 

To add to this,

MVS had 37 targets, 416 yards and 2 touchdowns over the first 7 weeks of the season.  That's 11.2 yards per target, which blows literally EVERY receiver out of the water from 2010. 

You can't do much if your QB doesn't throw you the ****ing ball. 

But yeah you stick to your stupid Skip Bayless level opinions that you get from watching not a Goddamn thing other than the national broadcast where all you can see is Rodgers acting like nobody is open when they are. 

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5 minutes ago, Outpost31 said:

How about you take your poo and shove it back from where it came.

Gamepass is still free.  Look at the “targets” he had in 2019 in the first half of the year compared to the second half.

Sick of this BS.  Maybe instead of saying “Der the evidence you provide sucks,” provide some evidence to support your argument.

That or STFU and leave me alone.  I’ll have a conversation with anyone who wants to have a conversation on it, but you’ve provided precisely **** to the conversation.

There's that nasty if you don't agree with me mentality.  Virus confinement is really getting to you.  

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Just now, coachbuns said:

There's that nasty if you don't agree with me mentality.  Virus confinement is really getting to you.  

No that's that nasty, "The evidence you presented is **** and I'm not going to provide any kind of counterargument because I don't want to believe in it," mentality.  The quickest way to set me off I admit is to look at evidence and then discount it without providing any counter argument.  "This concrete wall is hard.  See how I hit against it with a hammer and the hammer does nothing to it?"  "I don't think it's hard."  That's what I feel like trying to get through to some people here.  Do you notice how civil I act when people respond to it without outright calling the evidence I provide crap?  Literally the only person I reacted to was the one who LITERALLY said,

Quote

You saying 2019 MVS was better than 2010 Jordy is poo. Funny, laughable poo.

I never even said MVS in 2019 was better than Jordy.  I said that MVS at this point in his career was better than Nelson at the same point.  And that's true.  MVS' first two years were absolutely, irrefutably better than Jordy's first two years. 

You acting like I'm just quick to temper is typical for you. 

My opinion literally gets called poo without a shred of evidence to support calling it poo, but I'm the one that's nasty purely because you don't want to believe me and purely because you don't like my opinion. 

I have ZERO problem discussing football with the MAJORITY of people on this site.  Guys like Ray and Incog and Norm and AG I have never had an issue with because they RESPOND TO THE EVIDENCE with COUNTER ARGUMENTS instead of crapping on the evidence without providing anything useful to their own point.

That's not how the world works.  I have admitted I was wrong and granted good points so many ****ing times on this site I can't even list them all, but when people have things pointed out for them, when people are shown LITERAL VIDEO VISUAL PROOF of something and then just say it's not true they don't want to believe it, yeah, that drives me a little crazy. 

Edited by Outpost31
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2 hours ago, Gopackgonerd said:

I remember him playing well without any pro bowl WRs early in the year last year ;)

Yeah, everyone keeps forgetting that last year was Year 1 of a brand new offense...

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