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I could see a OL to start the season as Jenkins LT, Taylor LG, Patrick C, Runyan RG, Turner RT.  Once Bak comes back to man LT, then Jenkins slides to which ever spot is the weakest.  Drafting a player like Vera-Tucker LG/LT or Mayfield RT would help.

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If GB really offered Jones a contract in the neighborhood of top 5 RB money, I don't see why they wouldn't be willing to use the tag on him for 2021.  I have to think that even if the total guarantees offered by GB weren't what Jones was looking for, they would have easily topped the 8M being reported for the expected tag number.  Spending 8M for a year of Jones at his peak value is not a bad investment. 

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3 minutes ago, Mazrimiv said:

If GB really offered Jones a contract in the neighborhood of top 5 RB money, I don't see why they wouldn't be willing to use the tag on him for 2021.  I have to think that even if the total guarantees offered by GB weren't what Jones was looking for, they would have easily topped the 8M being reported for the expected tag number.  Spending 8M for a year of Jones at his peak value is not a bad investment. 

Because there's a big differerence between guaranteed and non-guaranteed money. Jones rejected the offer due to the lack of guarantees, and taging him is using a completely different strategy that makes no senses, as besides to the guaranteed part you also have to take into account his cap hit.

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5 minutes ago, VonKarman said:

Because there's a big differerence between guaranteed and non-guaranteed money. Jones rejected the offer due to the lack of guarantees, and taging him is using a completely different strategy that makes no senses, as besides to the guaranteed part you also have to take into account his cap hit.

Makes no sense... why?

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34 minutes ago, Mazrimiv said:

If GB really offered Jones a contract in the neighborhood of top 5 RB money, I don't see why they wouldn't be willing to use the tag on him for 2021.  I have to think that even if the total guarantees offered by GB weren't what Jones was looking for, they would have easily topped the 8M being reported for the expected tag number.  Spending 8M for a year of Jones at his peak value is not a bad investment. 

Tag is a set value, full guarantee.  Let's say is it $8M for Jones. 

GB takes an $8M cap hit in a cap tight year, so that is not a great deal for GB.

A longer term deal might have been $40M over 4 years with like $10 -12M guaranteed....and a 2021 cap hit more like $4M.  Better for the team but Jones wanted more in guaranteed money.

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I am not confused about the implications of long term deals vs the tag.  I understand why Jones would reject a long term deal with low guarantees.  I also understand why GB would not want to offer Jones a long term deal with large guarantees.  I don't necessarily understand why GB would balk at tagging Jones at 8M for 2021. 

Edited by Mazrimiv
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7 minutes ago, Mazrimiv said:

I am not confused about the implications of long term deals vs the tag.  I understand why Jones would reject a long term deal with low guarantees.  I also understand why GB would not want to offer Jones a long term deal with large guarantees.  I don't necessarily understand why GB would balk at tagging Jones at 8M for 2021. 

Because it binds GB to an $8M cap hit ( or whatever the RB tag value is) in a year where they need to get under a reduced salary cap.

Who does GB move to free up that $8M?

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2 hours ago, jleisher said:

I could see a OL to start the season as Jenkins LT, Taylor LG, Patrick C, Runyan RG, Turner RT.  Once Bak comes back to man LT, then Jenkins slides to which ever spot is the weakest.  Drafting a player like Vera-Tucker LG/LT or Mayfield RT would help.

That’s the possibility I’m envisioning. Jenkins went to LT in season when Wagner went down at RT and Turner was at LT.  the idea being Turner more “ambidextrous “ and able to switch sides easier. Of course, they’ll have plenty of time to train for their position so our OLine coaching group that has been getting its praises sung will have to pull off more with less.  
 

The return of 69 will factor heavily into how well they do but I hope we bring in a young tackle to develop because they are so important to executing the plan as we witnessed in the SB. 

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54 minutes ago, Mazrimiv said:

I am not confused about the implications of long term deals vs the tag.  I understand why Jones would reject a long term deal with low guarantees.  I also understand why GB would not want to offer Jones a long term deal with large guarantees.  I don't necessarily understand why GB would balk at tagging Jones at 8M for 2021. 

GB not tagging Jones is a favor out of respect to him. If GB tags him, and Jones nukes his knee, game over for Jones. The last player GB tagged was Ryan Pickett, but a long term deal was worked out shortly thereafter. I'm sure any deal offered to Jones included relief for this cap strapped year.  The amount of guarantees offered is unknown and the amount of guarantees expected by Jones is unknown.  At the end of the day, an $8m one year hit is not favorable to GB or Jones. GB has every right, but that doesn't mean it wouldn't be somewhat of a dikk move

Edited by cannondale
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9 hours ago, cannondale said:

It's pretty common knowledge since forever. The only thing that has changed is that RT is almost as important as LT. The salaries reflect this. The draft shows this. The measurables show this. Height, arm length, movement skills. If Linsley were 6'-5" with 34" arms instead of 6'-3" with 32" arms, he would have been a tackle

You don't play a guy at S if he can play CB. You don't play a guy at C if he can play OT

And that's precisely why guys like Ndamukong Suh, Aaron Donald, etc. have destroyed opposing OLs, right?

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8 hours ago, HighCalebR said:

Theres not much that tells me Runyan is better than Lane Taylor at this point? I think you're denigrating what Lane made himself into as well with this comp.

I know people love to say this and with the passing game, where its about gelling and communication, Id agree, when it comes to pulling and getting to the 2nd level the talent levels start to really expound. Lucas Patrick vs Jenkins in space are completely different animals. 

Correlatingly the DL and ILB are a sum of the parts in the run game, so Lowry *should* be fine between Clark Preston and a OTLB. It's fairly equal.

When we're not rushing for an easy average like we had this year with basically any back that stepped in it'll be easy to point to Jones being gone. I'll be pointing to how our line has been downgraded. Going from a 2nd round pick in his 2nd year and a 10 year vet to "hopefully some combo of of that 3rd year player in a new position full time and a 5th round pick seeing their first full time action" isnt going to be as good.

Im not saying its going to be a disaster, I'm saying I doubt it'll look as easy as it has.

You're probably misunderstanding my argument here.  I'm arguing that a JAG at LG isn't going to hold back the Packers' offense.  I would argue that Runyan is better than Lane Taylor right now.

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9 hours ago, AlexGreen#20 said:

The average OT salary is 50% higher than the average C. 

Tackles are drafted in the first round at an almost 4:1 ratio compared to C.

LT 2-6 are paid an average of $17M/year, RT 2-6 are paid an average of $12.5M/year, and C 2-6 are paid an average of $10.8M.  I'm not a statistician, but I believe C's are paid closer to RTs than they are LTs.  And you know as well as I that LTs =/= RTs.

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9 hours ago, cannondale said:

It's pretty common knowledge since forever. The only thing that has changed is that RT is almost as important as LT. The salaries reflect this. The draft shows this. The measurables show this. Height, arm length, movement skills. If Linsley were 6'-5" with 34" arms instead of 6'-3" with 32" arms, he would have been a tackle

You don't play a guy at S if he can play CB. You don't play a guy at C if he can play OT

Except they don't.  Your best pass protector plays on the left side because it's the blind side of the QB.  RT isn't nearly as valuable as the LT, and salaries support that.  The top 10 LTs in terms of AAV are no lower than $13.75M/year.  The 10th RT in terms of AAV is Morgan Moses/Bobby Massie at $7.7M/year.  IF RTs were valued even close to LTs, they would be paid similarly.

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14 minutes ago, CWood21 said:

Except they don't.  Your best pass protector plays on the left side because it's the blind side of the QB.  RT isn't nearly as valuable as the LT, and salaries support that.  The top 10 LTs in terms of AAV are no lower than $13.75M/year.  The 10th RT in terms of AAV is Morgan Moses/Bobby Massie at $7.7M/year.  IF RTs were valued even close to LTs, they would be paid similarly.

and center are not as highly paid as RT

 

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