TENINCH Posted January 18, 2018 Share Posted January 18, 2018 5 minutes ago, Jlowe22 said: Fair enough, and I don't blame someone for being mad at bad calls. But my only point is that there is literally a game every week some fan base is going to claim was the worst reffed game in history. If you go back in history and eliminate every single bad call ever, maybe Saints and Vikings would have several Super Bowls, or maybe they would have none, but bad reffing is part of the game, sometimes you benefit, sometimes you don't. The final drive in OT is what bothers me the most. Yeah we kicked ourselves in the foot but not enough to lose. We had a chance and then the refs took over. The PI is one of the worst calls I've ever seen a group of refs make. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jlowe22 Posted January 18, 2018 Share Posted January 18, 2018 1 minute ago, TENINCH said: The final drive in OT is what bothers me the most. Yeah we kicked ourselves in the foot but not enough to lose. We had a chance and then the refs took over. The PI is one of the worst calls I've ever seen a group of refs make. Well, I mean, I see a lot of bad PIs not called, or phantom PI called all the time. It must be a hard call to get 100% right every single time. The bottom line is, Vikings could have scored 40+ on a bad Saints defense and the game would never had went to overtime and came down to a possible bad call to begin with, but instead, they decided to fumble 7 or 8 times. Many times in the red zone, and once, right after a Reggie Bush muffed punt inside like the 10. And after all the fumbles, they put themselves at the edge of field goal range and get the dumbest 12 man penalty I've ever seen, then immediately afterwards Brett Favre throws the dumbest pick imaginable. The Vikings had PLENTY of opportunity to take care of business before overtime, and couldn't get it done. The overtime rules were garbage, every fan knew that, but that's the way it was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TENINCH Posted January 18, 2018 Share Posted January 18, 2018 8 minutes ago, Jlowe22 said: Well, I mean, I see a lot of bad PIs not called, or phantom PI called all the time. It must be a hard call to get 100% right every single time. The bottom line is, Vikings could have scored 40+ on a bad Saints defense and the game would never had went to overtime and came down to a possible bad call to begin with, but instead, they decided to fumble 7 or 8 times. Many times in the red zone, and once, right after a Reggie Bush muffed punt inside like the 10. And after all the fumbles, they put themselves at the edge of field goal range and get the dumbest 12 man penalty I've ever seen, then immediately afterwards Brett Favre throws the dumbest pick imaginable. The Vikings had PLENTY of opportunity to take care of business before overtime, and couldn't get it done. The overtime rules were garbage, every fan knew that, but that's the way it was. Very true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spartica4Real Posted January 18, 2018 Share Posted January 18, 2018 9 minutes ago, Jlowe22 said: Well, I mean, I see a lot of bad PIs not called, or phantom PI called all the time. It must be a hard call to get 100% right every single time. The bottom line is, Vikings could have scored 40+ on a bad Saints defense and the game would never had went to overtime and came down to a possible bad call to begin with, but instead, they decided to fumble 7 or 8 times. Many times in the red zone, and once, right after a Reggie Bush muffed punt inside like the 10. And after all the fumbles, they put themselves at the edge of field goal range and get the dumbest 12 man penalty I've ever seen, then immediately afterwards Brett Favre throws the dumbest pick imaginable. The Vikings had PLENTY of opportunity to take care of business before overtime, and couldn't get it done. The overtime rules were garbage, every fan knew that, but that's the way it was. One of the more underrated aspects of that game (people talk about it, but not as much as the turnovers) is the 12 man penalty. On the most important play of your season, how the hell do you not make sure you specifically have 11 players? It speaks to how talented that Vikings team was that they got so far with such a terrible head coach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SWATcha Posted January 18, 2018 Share Posted January 18, 2018 5 hours ago, ILoveTheVikings said: Except you know, the bountygate scandal was proven to be true and the Saints were punished for it. Dismissing everything that happened to Favre and thinking no one was trying to hurt him is ridiculous. And did you see the pictures of Favre's leg after the game? His entire upper leg was purple and so was his ankle. He himself, Brett Favre (the ironman), said it was the most violent game he has ever played. Considering that the NFL found irrefutable evidence, we saw the game tape, and Favre saying he was beat up more then any game in his career it's pretty obvious. If you want to argue if it affected the game, that's a completely different argument. But saying it never happened and Bountygate wasn't real is ludicrous. 4 Nobody said it wasn't true, except you know, what you're thinking it was and what it actually was aren't the same. Saints were punished for having a system in place for awarding players monetarily for big plays, which circumvents the salary cap. Again, ZERO proof players were purposefully trying to injure other players. Plenty of proof that they were awarded for sacks and such. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ILoveTheVikings Posted January 19, 2018 Share Posted January 19, 2018 5 hours ago, SWATcha said: Nobody said it wasn't true, except you know, what you're thinking it was and what it actually was aren't the same. Saints were punished for having a system in place for awarding players monetarily for big plays, which circumvents the salary cap. Again, ZERO proof players were purposefully trying to injure other players. Plenty of proof that they were awarded for sacks and such. Could have fooled the NFL Players usually earned $1,000 for "cart-offs" and $1,500 for "knockouts" during the regular season, though they were encouraged to put their winnings back into the pot in order to raise the stakes as the season went on. Payments were known to double or even triple during the playoffs.[7][15][17] The NFL sent a confidential and detailed memo to all 32 teams detailing its findings. It revealed that the Saints had not only targeted Warner and Favre during the 2009 playoffs, but had also targeted Green Bay Packersquarterback Aaron Rodgers and Carolina Panthers quarterback Cam Newton during the 2011 regular season.[18] According to that memo, Saints linebacker Jonathan Vilmaoffered $10,000 cash to any teammate who knocked Favre out of the NFC Championship Game.[14] In June 2012, the league revealed that it possessed a ledger detailing the weekly earnings of the players, which are earned for cart-offs ($1000) and "whacks" ($400) and deducted for "mental errors".[26][27] Shortly after the Saints' bounty system came to light, four former Washington Redskinsplayers, as well as a coach, told The Washington Post that Williams operated a similar system while he was the Redskins' defensive coordinator from 2004 to 2007. The players said that Williams paid his crew thousands of dollars for aggressive play, with the biggest payouts—as much as $8,000—coming for "kill shots" that knocked opposing players out of games.[31] Again, ZERO proof players were purposefully trying to injure other players So "cart offs" and "knockouts" don't count as trying to hurt people? LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jlowe22 Posted January 19, 2018 Share Posted January 19, 2018 58 minutes ago, ILoveTheVikings said: Again, ZERO proof players were purposefully trying to injure other players So "cart offs" and "knockouts" don't count as trying to hurt people? LOL http://www.aei.org/publication/the-saints-aint-sinners/ "To test whether the Saints injured more players than a typical team, one need only compare the number of players added to injury reports after a Saints game to the league-wide average. Did the New Orleans Saints injure more players? The data-driven answer is a resounding “no.” The Saints appear to have injured far fewer players over the 2009, 2010 and 2011 seasons. The numbers are striking. From 2009 to 2011, the Saints injured, on average, 3.2 opposing players each game. The rest of the teams in the league caused, on average, 3.8 injuries per game. This difference is highly statistically significant, or in other words, it would hold up in a court of law or a fancy academic journal. In each year of the bounty program, the Saints injured fewer players than the average for the league. In 2009, the Saints injured 2.8 players a game, and other teams injured on average 3.8. In 2010, it was 3.5 and 3.6, and in 2011 it was 3.3 and 3.8."... " Only one other team, the San Diego Chargers, injured fewer opponents per game over this entire time frame (3.1 injuries). Of the 32 teams, the Saints injured the third fewest in the 2009 season, the 15th fewest in 2010 and the third fewest in 2011."... "The evidence, then, suggests that the Saints’ story is consistent with a scenario in which the Saints players admirably ignored their coaches on bounty hits." We see late hits all the time, from players and teams not associated with any bounty system. The truth is though, to some extent, "bounties" have existed in the NFL for a long time. There have been players come out and admit to it, including Cris Carter, who admitted to putting out revenge bounties on other players. It's a violent sport, and has been for a long time. Lately there's been a lot done to try to make it safer, but we still see late hits and cheap shots from players all over the league, and will probably continue to as long as players with body armor are crashing into each other at full speed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMG5 Posted January 19, 2018 Share Posted January 19, 2018 1 hour ago, ILoveTheVikings said: Could have fooled the NFL Players usually earned $1,000 for "cart-offs" and $1,500 for "knockouts" during the regular season, though they were encouraged to put their winnings back into the pot in order to raise the stakes as the season went on. Payments were known to double or even triple during the playoffs.[7][15][17] The NFL sent a confidential and detailed memo to all 32 teams detailing its findings. It revealed that the Saints had not only targeted Warner and Favre during the 2009 playoffs, but had also targeted Green Bay Packersquarterback Aaron Rodgers and Carolina Panthers quarterback Cam Newton during the 2011 regular season.[18] According to that memo, Saints linebacker Jonathan Vilmaoffered $10,000 cash to any teammate who knocked Favre out of the NFC Championship Game.[14] In June 2012, the league revealed that it possessed a ledger detailing the weekly earnings of the players, which are earned for cart-offs ($1000) and "whacks" ($400) and deducted for "mental errors".[26][27] Shortly after the Saints' bounty system came to light, four former Washington Redskinsplayers, as well as a coach, told The Washington Post that Williams operated a similar system while he was the Redskins' defensive coordinator from 2004 to 2007. The players said that Williams paid his crew thousands of dollars for aggressive play, with the biggest payouts—as much as $8,000—coming for "kill shots" that knocked opposing players out of games.[31] Again, ZERO proof players were purposefully trying to injure other players So "cart offs" and "knockouts" don't count as trying to hurt people? LOL http://www.saintswin.com/2012/06/examining-flaws-of-bountygates-evidence.html?m=1 Just read this and tell me you don't think the NFL exaggerated their claims. Along with the article @Jlowe22 posted I think it finds a few issues with their claims. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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