MacReady Posted August 12, 2019 Share Posted August 12, 2019 Just now, Fl0nkerton said: Yeah trading a fifth for a kicker seems....steep, right? It's the Game of Kickers. Once you start that game, you either win or you spend the next five years catching up. Think of all the times a team has cut a perfectly capable kicker in order to save money only for them to be in perpetual kicker purgatory. I caught extreme flack for calling out the Bears decision to cut whatever his name was. It was a terrible decision. He wasn't all that bad and he missed a high profile kick, then his team completely crucified him. They've been scrambling ever since, and the Vikings probably had to trade a 5th for that Ravens kicker because there was a bidding war. Vikings did the same thing and they've been scrambling ever since. You cut a kicker for a high profile miss and you are asking to be cursed at that position. How many kickers have the Vikings cut since that missed field goal by Walsh? If you have a kicker, keep the kicker. Crosby's contract is up at the end of this year and you don't re-sign him. That's fine, but trying to get a head start on the next one when you don't have the next one and in order to save 3 million dollars at this point in the season... You're asking for trouble. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fl0nkerton Posted August 12, 2019 Share Posted August 12, 2019 1 minute ago, Outpost31 said: It's the Game of Kickers. Once you start that game, you either win or you spend the next five years catching up. Think of all the times a team has cut a perfectly capable kicker in order to save money only for them to be in perpetual kicker purgatory. I caught extreme flack for calling out the Bears decision to cut whatever his name was. It was a terrible decision. He wasn't all that bad and he missed a high profile kick, then his team completely crucified him. They've been scrambling ever since, and the Vikings probably had to trade a 5th for that Ravens kicker because there was a bidding war. Vikings did the same thing and they've been scrambling ever since. You cut a kicker for a high profile miss and you are asking to be cursed at that position. How many kickers have the Vikings cut since that missed field goal by Walsh? If you have a kicker, keep the kicker. Crosby's contract is up at the end of this year and you don't re-sign him. That's fine, but trying to get a head start on the next one when you don't have the next one and in order to save 3 million dollars at this point in the season... You're asking for trouble. Fair points. I guess I'm just glad Chicago didn't get him if he turns out to be as good as advertised. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThatJerkDave Posted August 12, 2019 Share Posted August 12, 2019 I don't think a 5th for a kicker is necessarily an overspend. Don't most drafted kickers go 4th-6th round? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Krauser Posted August 12, 2019 Share Posted August 12, 2019 6 minutes ago, Outpost31 said: Vikings did the same thing and they've been scrambling ever since. You cut a kicker for a high profile miss and you are asking to be cursed at that position. How many kickers have the Vikings cut since that missed field goal by Walsh? Walsh wasn’t cut just because of the one high profile miss (in the 2015 playoffs vs Seattle). The Vikings didn’t even try to replace him that offseason. There’d been some concern about Walsh even leading up to that game. His FG% dropped off considerably in 2014. He rallied to a solid 87% in 2015, but he struggled with the new XP distance (89.2%, 5th worst in the league). Then came the shanked 27 yarder that cost the team a playoff win. And afterward, Walsh seemed to have the yips. He was only 12/16 with 4 more missed XPs when they released him halfway though 2016. Walsh went to Seattle, where the dropoff in his performance continued in 2017 (72% FG, another missed XP). The Seahawks released him after that year, and he hasn’t kicked in the NFL since, still only 29 years old. The Vikings kicker saga post-Walsh has consisted of: Kai Forbath, FA who’d washed out with Washington. Forbath was decent on FGs but missed a ton of XPs (worst XP% in the league in both 2016 and 2017) Daniel Carlson, 5th round pick 2018. Carlson was an excellent college kicker. He started out well in his rookie preseason but picked up a technical flaw that led to him missing a few kicks late that preseason. The Vikings ST coach (Priefer) and Zimmer apparently believed the best way to get a young guy with a technical flaw to improve was to glower at him and make threats, so the flaw (his steps in his approach were too long, supposedly) wasn’t picked up. Carlson then famously went 0/3 at Lambeau including missing a 35 yarder that would’ve won the game in OT. The Vikings stupidly released him the next day, after which he went to Oakland and was one of the best kickers in the league last year. Dan Bailey, FA released by Dallas after 2017. Bailey had been one of the best kickers in the league for several years, but after a groin injury in 2017, his accuracy and range dropped off completely, leading to his release. He was little better with Minnesota last year. They brought him back for 2018, but he struggled again in camp (under 75% FGs in drills) and was atrocious on kickoffs in their opening preseason game (short of the end zone a couple of times, including one to the 13). He’s clearly lost his fastball. The only bad decision there was letting Carlson go after the Lambeau debacle. He should be an excellent kicker for a decade plus, and the Vikings let him go rather than help him reach his obvious potential. Now they’ve traded a 5th for Kaare Vedvik, a UDFA originally from Norway who mostly punted in college, and learned to PK for the Ravens. Vedvik has a huge leg, was excellent in preseason last year and in week one this year. The Vikings were reportedly interested in him around roster cutdowns last year, but Vedvik got assaulted and was placed on IR. This year, the Bears and a few other teams were looking to trade for Vedvik once he showed last week that he’d fully recovered from his injuries. So the trade price likely reflects a bidding war. The Vikings thankfully have replaced their special teams coach and brought in a kicking coach (as the Ravens have). So hopefully they won’t both Vedvik’s talent the way they did Carlson’s. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HighCalebR Posted August 12, 2019 Share Posted August 12, 2019 11 minutes ago, Krauser said: kicker stuff. That was unreasonably fast. I applaud your dedication to defending your squad and their ST woes. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leader Posted August 12, 2019 Author Share Posted August 12, 2019 15 minutes ago, Krauser said: The Vikings thankfully have replaced their special teams coach and brought in a kicking coach (as the Ravens have). So hopefully they won’t both Vedvik’s talent the way they did Carlson’s. Good luck to your new kicker wanna be. I wish him nothing but the best - except of course - in any game circumstance involving the GBPs - or - in any other game circumstance that would have critical effect on the standings between the two teams. Sorry - but I cant be more forthcoming than that. The Vikings simply must always draw the short end of the stick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fl0nkerton Posted August 12, 2019 Share Posted August 12, 2019 I'm also gonna call him Aardvark because I like Anagrams Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OneTwoSixFive Posted August 12, 2019 Share Posted August 12, 2019 3 hours ago, Outpost31 said: Crosby's contract is up at the end of this year and you don't re-sign him. That's fine, but trying to get a head start on the next one when you don't have the next one and in order to save 3 million dollars at this point in the season... You're asking for trouble. Eminently sensible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWood21 Posted August 12, 2019 Share Posted August 12, 2019 3 hours ago, Fl0nkerton said: Yeah trading a fifth for a kicker seems....steep, right? If they're able to get him punting and kicking, the extra roster spot would be worth it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norm Posted August 12, 2019 Share Posted August 12, 2019 1 minute ago, CWood21 said: If they're able to get him punting and kicking, the extra roster spot would be worth it. I'd like to see this work just for curiosity's sake. Sadly he went to the Vikings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skibrett15 Posted August 12, 2019 Share Posted August 12, 2019 5 hours ago, Outpost31 said: Vikings just traded a fifth round pick for a kicker who has never had any regular season attempts. @skibrett15, never even had a regular season attempt. And people will still wonder why I say it's stupid to cut Crosby without a tested replacement. I believe it was last year when everybody was saying we should cut Crosby for Dan Bailey when Crosby had a higher percentage than Bailey both in 2018 and 2017. Now, after signing Bailey, the Vikings have just traded a 5th round pick for a kicker with zero regular season experience. @Norm, that name recognition syndrome is at its worst with the kicker position. wtf is a tested replacement? by this logic no one should ever start a QB who hasn't played an NFL down. They should only play veterans bc they are tested. The argument against crosby is entirely his bloated contract and the cap savings. If you aren't going to use the money, well, just keep the tested mediocre NFL player in Crosby. Basically all NFL kickers are the same. It's a position like RB where you can get by with almost anyone. There are a few who are slightly better on a career basis. And then there are normal average kickers like crosby who have good years and bad years and there is no way to predict which will be which based on past results. Trading a 5th round pick for a kicker is the same as drafting a kicker. Is there some reason you don't think this kicker is worth a 5th round pick or something? He's playing for the best ST coach of all time in Harbaugh, playing behind the best kicker of all time in justin tucker. I would definitely trade crosby and his bloated contract for him in a heartbeat just based on that. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norm Posted August 12, 2019 Share Posted August 12, 2019 22 minutes ago, skibrett15 said: Basically all NFL kickers are the same. It's a position like RB where you can get by with almost anyone. I disagree with both of these. The RB thing is getting over done. Yeah you don't want to pay them a ton and I don't ever suggest we take one round one or anything. RBs can win you games AT TIMES as much a WR or whatever. A kicker can always have a bad game but teams move on from a decent guy and go through a few like toilet paper that never play again before they can find what you think every kicker is by what you just described. A top 5 starting kicker is a pretty big disparity between a bottom 5 in that same season. But I'm not articulating what I want for **** here so I'll stop. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Packer_ESP Posted August 12, 2019 Share Posted August 12, 2019 3 hours ago, Norm said: I'd like to see this work just for curiosity's sake. Sadly he went to the Vikings. As you said, you better hope he never gets injured though. Saving one spot and having to find one or two position players that can kick and/or punt... Dunno if it's worth it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
packfanfb Posted August 12, 2019 Share Posted August 12, 2019 LMAO. I wouldn't pay Prescott $20 million a year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norm Posted August 12, 2019 Share Posted August 12, 2019 (edited) He wouldn't get 40 mil if he was purely on the open market today would he? by today, I meant as FA started. Edited August 12, 2019 by Norm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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