Players may boycott spring training?

[GSUeagles14]

9 hours ago, Thelonebillsfan said:

They signed it with the understanding that the league would enforce some level of competitive balance.

The Rangers are starting Eric Goeddel in their rotation. Over half the league is basically tanking. There are no markets anymore wherein these guys are getting their market value. They shouldn't have to take less than they are worth because the league has figured out how to game the system.

what do you mean by market value? Every big fa is reseting the market and some good but not great players are also aiming to reset the market. Top end salaries were getting out of control and this is teams trying to make a stand and create new expectations on what players will earn. That is what they should be doing. Its already been mentioned but Eric flipping Hosmer should not be getting or expecting 9 figure offers.

 

If youre concerned that owners are getting to keep to much money (not sure why that would be your concern), fight for a higher minimum salary, revamp the team control thing and let guys get paid sooner, etc. In return, set some kind of salary contract max like we see in basketball. Both sides get something back this way.

 

 

[Thelonebillsfan]

2 minutes ago, mission27 said:

To what end?

Building your brand, securing your franchise value, playoff revenue, additional seasonal revenue from increased attendance. All of which bullwarks against the inevitable labor stoppage that will occur AND bulwarks against the far more serious looming threat that is now an inevitability.

The cable bubble.

[mission27]

41 minutes ago, Thelonebillsfan said:

Building your brand, securing your franchise value, playoff revenue, additional seasonal revenue from increased attendance. All of which bullwarks against the inevitable labor stoppage that will occur AND bulwarks against the far more serious looming threat that is now an inevitability.

The cable bubble.

The labor stoppage and cable bubble are league wide issues.  They require collective action by the owners.  The right place to deal with that would've been the CBA.

As far as the other things, I'm just not convinced a team can perpetually compete in a meaningful way without a large payroll or periodic rebuilds.  There's no magic bullet.  Yeah trying to compete could give you a short term attendance boost, but that's assuming it works and the fans care about a 85 win team.  If you want to see what a full rebuild and World Series contender can do for fan interest and attendance, look at Cleveland.  The payoff is much bigger.

[NewAge]

The point is a mediocre team could blow their whole roster right now and move up like 3-5 spots in the draft. 

In 2011, when the Astros and Cubs were doing it, you'd move up a dozen. 

[mission27]

2 hours ago, NewAge said:

The point is a mediocre team could blow their whole roster right now and move up like 3-5 spots in the draft. 

In 2011, when the Astros and Cubs were doing it, you'd move up a dozen. 

Not just about the draft though.  Also about trading MLB talent for MiLB depth. 

I'm not advocating a full tank for #1 pick... like a Suck for Luck type of thing... but I don't think many teams are really purposefully doing that.  I think teams are just willing to trade MLB assets and not concerned about competing, because they realize its not the best way to win long term.  Which imo is fine.  Its not great for baseball, but until someone comes up with a genius solution, it is what it is. 

[redsoxsuck05]

You could be like Cash and rebuild without actually rebuilding

[NewAge]

When do the Cardinals ever rebuild?

[N4L]

7 hours ago, Thelonebillsfan said:

 

And Beane's issue isn't that he never tanked, it's that he is stuck in the AL in a division wherein there are just unfortunately too many quality teams ahead of the A's, despite the A's being everything they should be. Young, cost effective, with their two best projected players being long term cost controlled.

Why should the As be so cost effective though? They have one of the richest owners in baseball, even if their revenue isn't massive there isn't a reason they should always be at the bottom of the league in payroll 

[ramssuperbowl99]

12 hours ago, mission27 said:

And rams, I'm not sure what your source is, but some quick Googling dug up the above.

http://www.chroniclet.com/national-news/2016/03/21/AP-study-players-share-of-Major-League-Baseball-revenues-remain-stable-over-past-decade.html

I'm sure there's more than one way to cut it, but I have hard time believing players are getting screwed when fleas like Eric Hosmer are turning down $150 million contracts and Rick ******* Porcello is making $20 million plus a year to give up home runs. 

That's including everything - draft signings (which are now capped), IFA signings (which are now capped), penalties (which actually go back to MLB and don't end up in a players pocket), and I'm guessing, luxury taxes, which again don't go to the players.

If you want to include the combined ~$300M that teams spend yearly on the MLB draft and IFA markets, go ahead. The revenues are ~$9B, so nominally add 3%, which takes us to 40%. That is substantially less than every other major sport. You can keep saying Eric Hosmer's name all you like, but the players as a whole, are getting screwed, and you know it.

13 hours ago, mission27 said:

Salary as a % of revenue has fallen because:

 

[ramssuperbowl99]

10 hours ago, NewAge said:

The point is a mediocre team could blow their whole roster right now and move up like 3-5 spots in the draft. 

In 2011, when the Astros and Cubs were doing it, you'd move up a dozen. 

And by extension league average free agents are stuck with the overwhelming majority of teams either having a better option, running up against the luxury tax, or playing a prospect and totally unwilling to sign them. This whole model was set up on free agents, even average ones, getting paid in exchange for the discounted labor they gave. So the system is broken, and teams broke it.

Of course the players should be responding.

[mission27]

1 hour ago, ramssuperbowl99 said:

the players as a whole, are getting screwed, and you know it.

I completely 100% disagree. 

This may be true for MiLB and pre-arb players but veteran MLB players are grossly overpaid compared to veterans in other sports.  Lebron and Durant and Curry are each worth 10x or 100x or whatever more to the NBA than any baseball player is worth to MLB, but get paid less than a guy like Clayton Kerhsaw, who is a great pitcher but no casual fan really gives a **** about.

The players are big boys and need to negotiate for themselves and define their priorities.  If their priority is to get more money into the hands of veteran players and free agents, I'm going to give you my honest opinion, which is those guys grossly overpaid already.  

And the idea that MLB players, who have guaranteed contracts and generally do not develop traumatic brain diseases, are getting screwed relative to the NFL, where guys do not have guaranteed contracts, play much shorter careers, can barely function post career, and where Tom Brady makes less than an MLB closer... that's just silly.

[hrubes20]

17 hours ago, Thelonebillsfan said:

Building your brand, securing your franchise value, playoff revenue, additional seasonal revenue from increased attendance. All of which bullwarks against the inevitable labor stoppage that will occur AND bulwarks against the far more serious looming threat that is now an inevitability.

The cable bubble.

I'm pretty excited about what the Cubs have cooking in this regard.  They will have their own network like the Yankees, for sure, but they supposedly are drawing up plans that nobody has seen before.  Obviously no details are being leaked, but some theories are that it would pertain to streaming content.

[NewAge]

If there’s not a collusion lawsuit on Manfred’s desk in the next 24 hours, every single person at the MLBPA should be fired. 

[mission27]

8 minutes ago, NewAge said:

If there’s not a collusion lawsuit on Manfred’s desk in the next 24 hours, every single person at the MLBPA should be fired. 

Yes they are definitely colluding... to not give out bad contracts 

[mission27]

13 hours ago, NewAge said:

When do the Cardinals ever rebuild?

The Cardinals are the best run orginization in baseball over the past 20 years and play in an upper mid market with a die hard fan base.  You cant just choose to be the Cardinals.  That’s like saying everyone should model themselves after the Spurs and Patriots.  Ok in theory but more complicated in practice.  Same thing with the Braves from the early 90s to late 00s.

And even the Cards can’t compete with the Cubs, etc anymore.  What hope is there for an average front office?