Mitchell/Wilcox likely gone, Davis maybe to FS

[CKSteeler]

I've been saying for two years now that they have Davis out of position. Mitchell to FS was always dumb. The Steelers forced Davis into a role that really didn't suit his abilities out of desperation. He's big and kind of fast, and Mitchell really can't run or play the run so let's just throw this guy into the box and ask him to man up on people and support the run. While we're at it, we'll throw Golden back there as a deep safety. Because teams really fear that.

This draft has some guys who seem pretty well suited to be SS's. Ronnie Harrison in round 1 - how many guys are you going to pick their with more talent?

[steelcurtain29]

Mitchell on a football field was always dumb. Nothing more than an athletic headhunter. Davis in general I don't trust. Nothing about him this past year shows me he's NFL starting quality.

[Dcash4]

I don't know that Davis is any better as a FS. I could see him being worse. In space is not his strength and his tackling is already laughably bad in the open field at times. More of that might not be a good thing. 

Having said that, it may improve our passing defense in the third portion of the field. Seems to have a little more range and playmaking ability, so what we may be giving up with his weakness in space maybe we gain enough to make the change worth it.

Ultimately, I think Davis is best suited for a third safety role as a guy who could play a hybrid corner/safety in certain packages and be a solid backup at both safety spots. But I think he gets one more shot as a starter due to our desperation at the position and him being a guy coming into his third year with starter experience. 

I am for the change (basically because I'm for any changes right now at safety), but not sure how much it changes. Davis's issues are with consistency, not playing in a position that's not suited for him. 

[Armsteeld2]

Range is useless if you lack the ability to see the play’s scheme. Davis was a SS at Maryland for a reason.  This move screams desperation but can Davis handle it?  We’ll find out but hopefully a true FS is drafted.

[43M]

Watching Davis this year, I have no faith in him regardless of what position he plays.    Seriously, what does he do well?    I mean, perhaps Bradley can get more out of him than Lake did, but even when Davis is at his best, nothing about him stands out to me.    His peak IMO is painfully average, and given the overall quality of safeties around the league, that might be serviceable if a) he always played at that level and b) we had an actually GOOD safety next too him.   However, he usually doesnt even play at that average level, and for his first few years, the safety next to him was one of the worst starting safeties in the entire league.

Best realistic (although not necessarily probable) scenario IMO, we find a good safety this offseason and with the addition of Bradley, Davis can be at least average for us until we can find a replacement in the coming years.    

[VigilantZombie]

It would not surprise me if our first four picks in the draft or some combination of linebackers and safeties that's how I feel about Davis

[Steeler Hitman]

Very good and true comments posted. I am a bit of a fan and homer when it comes to Davis.  I think he has more potential and abilities than he displayed in 2017.  What I really don't know is why his play regressed in 2017 from his rookie season of 2016.  He is a very intelligent kid and a versatile player which has at times hurt him with being moved around. The questions are:

1. What is his best position?

2. What is his ceiling?

3. Where does he best help the team?

4. Was his regressed play because of a lack of growth, poor coaching, or playing in the wrong position?

Personally, I could see Davis at FS, but I am not sure that is the best spot for him with his skills.  He does have the intelligence, speed, quickness and range to play the FS position.  However, he seems much better playing and tackling in the box rather than in space at SS. He sometimes takes bad angles to make tackles and seems to misplay passes in the air. Are these things correctable? I think so....Others think his ceiling is lower and he is relegated to being a SS.  The excue of blaming coaching is now gone and this will be a pivotal year  for both Davis and Burns.  Both showed promise in 2016 as rookies and both seemed to take a step back in 2017 as did Hargraves.  I think that a lot had to do with coaching and scheme. I will go on record as saying that I believe that Davis, Burns, Hargraves and Dupree bounce back in 2018 and help improve the Steelers defense in 2018.

 

[Armsteeld2]

5 minutes ago, Steeler Hitman said:

Very good and true comments posted. I am a bit of a fan and homer when it comes to Davis.  I think he has more potential and abilities than he displayed in 2017.  What I really don't know is why his play regressed in 2017 from his rookie season of 2016.  He is a very intelligent kid and a versatile player which has at times hurt him with being moved around. The questions are:

1. What is his best position?

2. What is his ceiling?

3. Where does he best help the team?

4. Was his regressed play because of a lack of growth, poor coaching, or playing in the wrong position?

Personally, I could see Davis at FS, but I am not sure that is the best spot for him with his skills.  He does have the intelligence, speed, quickness and range to play the FS position.  However, he seems much better playing and tackling in the box rather than in space at SS. He sometimes takes bad angles to make tackles and seems to misplay passes in the air. Are these things correctable? I think so....Others think his ceiling is lower and he is relegated to being a SS.  The excue of blaming coaching is now gone and this will be a pivotal year  for both Davis and Burns.  Both showed promise in 2016 as rookies and both seemed to take a step back in 2017 as did Hargraves.  I think that a lot had to do with coaching and scheme. I will go on record as saying that I believe that Davis, Burns, Hargraves and Dupree bounce back in 2018 and help improve the Steelers defense in 2018.

 

He never did anything period.  It is easy to get sacks that are washed to you.  Dupree is worse than Jarvis Jones. 

[Steeler Hitman]

1 minute ago, Armsteeld2 said:

He never did anything period.  It is easy to get sacks that are washed to you.  Dupree is worse than Jarvis Jones. 

I can't argue with you here. Especially that he is much more than Double J was as a Steeler. For some reason I see more in Bud than I do Double J. I know he busted his butt working out last off season to get better.  He has the physical tools and he seemed pretty stout against the run when he got back from IR in 2016. I don't know why that didn't translate on the field with a big, strong, fast athletic 260 lb OLB.

Early in 2017 the Steelers defense had a pretty ferocious pass rush.  I watched some games early when the Steelers were getting pressure with just rushing four and not blitzing very much at all.  They did a decent job of harassing Case Keenum in the Vikings game.  Then they all sort of tapered off with the exception of Cam.  Bud, Chickello and even Watt's sack totals went down to virtually zero the second half of the season. 

My questions are: Is Bud just a bad prospect? Did our coaches do a poor job of developing Bud? Or a combination of both? I try to do my best to be objective (especially with players that I like).  It is make or break for Bud in 2018.

[Armsteeld2]

@Steeler Hitman

1)yes.  He was a horrible prospect.

2)no.  Can’t always blame coaches for guys not developing.  Some guys just don’t have it.

 

[Steeler Hitman]

Just now, Armsteeld2 said:

@Steeler Hitman

1)yes.  He was a horrible prospect.

2)no.  Can’t always blame coaches for guys not developing.  Some guys just don’t have it.

 

I can't argue with your opinion buddy. You are correct that you can't always blame coaching. He was ranked higher than we actually drafted him. Like many of the prospects from that class that fell due to various reasons, the production hasn't been what we hoped. I hope he bounces back and can put up double digit sacks. Maybe I am dreaming, but if he does it, don't wake me up. (LOL)

[Armsteeld2]

5 minutes ago, Steeler Hitman said:

I can't argue with your opinion buddy. You are correct that you can't always blame coaching. He was ranked higher than we actually drafted him. Like many of the prospects from that class that fell due to various reasons, the production hasn't been what we hoped. I hope he bounces back and can put up double digit sacks. Maybe I am dreaming, but if he does it, don't wake me up. (LOL)

Landon Collins, Preston Smith, and Senquez Golson were my favorite prospects.  Making things worse is I never got to see Golson play in a professional game.

[warfelg]

4 minutes ago, Armsteeld2 said:

Landon Collins, Preston Smith, and Senquez Golson were my favorite prospects.  Making things worse is I never got to see Golson play in a professional game.

I really wanted Byron Jones....he's turned into such a valuable SS/FS/CB for Dallas.  Erik Kendricks was another draft crush that year.  David Johnson....who went one pick in front of us.

 

[43M]

14 hours ago, warfelg said:

I really wanted Byron Jones....he's turned into such a valuable SS/FS/CB for Dallas.  Erik Kendricks was another draft crush that year.  David Johnson....who went one pick in front of us.

 

Byron Jones would absolutely be better than Dupree....but he isnt that good  IMO.      And given the lack of coaching Ive seen under Lake, he mightve been pretty bad here had we drafted him.

Obviously, all we can do is speculate on that, though.    

I just remember pleading with my TV screen to see us trade up for Marcus Peters once he fell past 15.     He was the only corner I was remotely high on that year.

[warfelg]

3 hours ago, FourThreeMafia said:

Byron Jones would absolutely be better than Dupree....but he isnt that good  IMO.      And given the lack of coaching Ive seen under Lake, he mightve been pretty bad here had we drafted him.

Obviously, all we can do is speculate on that, though.    

I just remember pleading with my TV screen to see us trade up for Marcus Peters once he fell past 15.     He was the only corner I was remotely high on that year.

If you think Jones isn't that good you are seriously underrating him.

 

Peters is on the block.  For 2 reasons:

1 - He has been a lockerroom cancer.  Been  benched a few times now for discipline reasons.

2 - He hasn't been that good.  He is a magnet for flags.  Make Ike Taylor look like a stud at defending double moves.  Gambles too much.  Leaves assignments.  Doesn't listen to coaching, leading to issue #1.