Job of OLB's changing

[warfelg]

2 minutes ago, Armsteeld2 said:

@Alex Deebo made QBs sweat and wet themselves because he obliterated their OL and put them in a hell of hurt!  If anything the secondary benfits from a good pass rush.

As @Chieferific said it was very much a symbiotic relationship.  QB's knowing James was coming means why had to point out TP.  TP being out there mean they had to find a way to deceive him giving Debo more time.  They both would have still been very good but they helped make each other great.  I would verge on TP helped Debo more than Debo helped TP though.

[warfelg]

1 minute ago, Chieferific said:

Sure they both benefitted from each other. But again, no matter what Troy did pre-snap the job of the LT was still to block James and James only. If the idea is that Troy made the QB hold to the ball longer than sure, that helped. But James had to win his matchup.  

Oh I was talking more about his downfall.  Had to do with both SS and age.

[Alex]

James Harrison was a top-5 player in his prime, rightfully a really good player, but yes, Polamalu helped him more than Harrison did for Polamalu.

It's for the same reason our defense fell apart without Shazier. Teams look out for Shazier. If we have a similar impact player at the safety position, I'm pretty sure more quarterbacks will respect our defense. 

[Armsteeld2]

I'd rather have a great pass rusher than a great Safety.  A great Safety can be manipulated by QBs if the pass rush isn't there.  A great pass rusher can make a below average Safety look good.  Dexter Jackson benefited hugely with that ferocious Tampa Bay defense.  He got a huge contract and the team didn't have a pass rush and people say he regressed or became lazy.  No.  You must know who the player you're getting.  

Derwin James is a SS who is closer insize and skills to Reshad Jones and not Kam Chancellor, as has been stated way too much.  I would not trade for him.

[warfelg]

3 minutes ago, Alex said:

James Harrison was a top-5 player in his prime, rightfully a really good player, but yes, Polamalu helped him more than Harrison did for Polamalu.

It's for the same reason our defense fell apart without Shazier. Teams look out for Shazier. If we have a similar impact player at the safety position, I'm pretty sure more quarterbacks will respect our defense. 

You just need one that isn't a CB or DL.  ILB/SS/FS.  Just one guy that you have to account for.  In fact even if it's a OLB that can rush from all 4 spots or drop and play man and zone.  But every great defense has that 1 x-factor guy you have to account for.

[Chieferific]

Put me on the Pass Rusher>Safety list. If you have an OLB that can get to a QB consistently despite SS play you have the KEY cog to the Defense.  Think of it this way. Who is the best SS ever in you mind? Now whom would you rather have? That Safety or Lawrence Taylor?

[warfelg]

6 minutes ago, Armsteeld2 said:

I'd rather have a great pass rusher than a great Safety.  A great Safety can be manipulated by QBs if the pass rush isn't there.  A great pass rusher can make a below average Safety look good.  Dexter Jackson benefited hugely with that ferocious Tampa Bay defense.  He got a huge contract and the team didn't have a pass rush and people say he regressed or became lazy.  No.  You must know who the player you're getting.  

Derwin James is a SS who is closer insize and skills to Reshad Jones and not Kam Chancellor, as has been stated way too much.  I would not trade for him.

In a way I agree.  But like I said above, you need that one x-factor guy.  A strong pass rush is always great, but if there isn't that one guy that can pop up anywhere the pass rush isn't great.  See: Dallas.

To me it's great and all to talk about Dexter Jackson, but the back end of that defense also had Ronde Barber, John Lynch, and Derrick Brooks.  3 guys you always had to account for.

[warfelg]

4 minutes ago, Chieferific said:

Put me on the Pass Rusher>Safety list. If you have an OLB that can get to a QB consistently despite SS play you have the KEY cog to the Defense.  Think of it this way. Who is the best SS ever in you mind? Now whom would you rather have? That Safety or Lawrence Taylor?

Not saying that I would put SS first.  More that every great defense has that back end x-factor guy.  Can't have a crap secondary and great pass rush.

 

Yea LT was great, but Harry Carson was just as good, and Terry Kinard (FS) was no slouch.  I know we're talking a lot of "greats" here but I think it goes to show that every time you think of a great defense, there's going to be a back end of the defense guy that was still really good.

[3rivers]

On 2018-03-03 at 11:31 AM, warfelg said:

Rewatch his last year of college tape, then watch this you and you see a guy that's developed.  He's added a dip under and an inside swim.  There's plenty of GIFs of him close but because the secondary sprung a leak he couldn't get home.

hope you are right, and effort, conditioning etc is not to blame. Maybe the secondary is more to blame, but I just don't  notice the RD1 skillset etc. Other issue to consider is that if he finally plays close to a RD1 pick, it took 4 years The FO can't make a habit out of this