Scout Posted February 25, 2018 Share Posted February 25, 2018 *The results of this are derived from numerous combine articles/research papers available on the web, and my checking the #s versus top players at each position. I would properly cite each author, but it would take forever.* Top 60 interviews (teams are allowed to interview 60 prospects) and medicals are important, but what about the drills? Well first off, getting an invitation is huge. About 85% of players invited will be drafted. About 35 or so players not invited will be. Combine Predictability QB- No predictability RB- 40 most important (under 4.50). 3-cone and weight some predict. WR- No predictability TE- 40 is most important and a huge indicator. Followed by 3cone, bench, BJ, VJ also important OT- Weight, 40, BJ all important OG- 40 most important. Weight and bench also important OC- Weight and SS most important. DE- Weight is the strongest indicator of any drill for any positon. 40 is very important. 3 cone is significant as well. DT- 40 most important. Weight, bench and SS also very important OLB- 3-cone is most important. Weight, broad and 40 also significant ILB- 40 is one of the most significant predictors for any drill or position. Weight matters some. CB- 40 yard dash for corners are one of the most important predictors for any position or drill. Weight and bench have some significance. SAF- 40 most important. Then 3 cone. Overall Importance by Position QB- not at all RB- some importance WR- not at all TE- some importance OT- very important OG- some importance OC- minimal importance DE- extremely important DT- some importance ILB- some importance OLB- some importance CB- extremely important SAF- some importance Feel free to share any thoughts, or differing results or opinions, and enjoy combine week! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TJM217 Posted February 25, 2018 Share Posted February 25, 2018 You got any links to your sources? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozzy Posted February 26, 2018 Share Posted February 26, 2018 Yes at times a player will have a great combine and turn out to be nothing in the NFL. But it is just another level of study. One has tape and how a prospect played in college, then you get the measurements of their size and how physically gifted they are. Sure running a great 40 is not absolutely important but it does matter as do the other events. At times it makes one revisit a prospect just based on how they did at the combine in specific events. Helps prove and legitimize what one saw during the season and helps one compare and see if it is a match in what they did on the field and how they worked out physically. Sure it is not everything but I do not think anyone believes it is. It does have to be a combo though of having elite physical abilities and elite football playing skill. Ultimately though it helps solidify ones opinion on certain players especially if you liked the prospect a lot before the measurements came in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jebrick Posted February 26, 2018 Share Posted February 26, 2018 The combine allows scouts to compare the same tests to previous years. It is just a baseline. What we do not see are the medicals and the interviews which have even more of an impact. I would say the combine is important for Edge rushers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CalhounLambeau Posted February 26, 2018 Share Posted February 26, 2018 Every aspect of the combine is important to varying degrees. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goldfishwars Posted February 26, 2018 Share Posted February 26, 2018 I’d love to see the data behind this one: - RB- 40 most important (under 4.50) I think the combine is important in combination with the tape, the events results themselves are very important – but not in isolation. The drills are the underrated aspect, how receivers track the football for example. How any player can pluck a football. The way the ball comes out of a QB’s hand. The ease in which an offensive lineman bends and moves his body, the way a linebacker can shift his feet and change direction. The ease in which a defensive back can flip his hips and back pedal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CalhounLambeau Posted February 26, 2018 Share Posted February 26, 2018 It's always amazed me watching players in the 40-dash who go up and fail to start properly and have to re-set. Sometimes they do the same thing wrong 2-3 times with their arm after months of training, proper direction from the coach at the start line, etc. People can mock the combine. Any time you get with prospects doing anything can be valuable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MWil23 Posted February 26, 2018 Share Posted February 26, 2018 The combine is really nice for evaluating guys who are already good/great football players who also test really well, or guys from small schools who don't face elite competition. When people start over-valuing tests over what you see on film, that's where problems occur. See: The Al Davis Oakland Raiders in the early to mid 2000s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BleedTheClock Posted February 26, 2018 Share Posted February 26, 2018 I love the combine for this reason: There is no way any of us watch enough film to evaluate 300+ guys. The combine makes it apparent which guys we need to watch more of and which guys we can put on the "if there's time" list. I have scouted 116 guys in-depth so far this year and have a list of over 200. The combine will determine which maybe 50 or so guys I choose to evaluate. So the combine is great for us, but NFL teams already have their homework done on 99.9% of these guys. The combine means significantly less for them than it does for people that haven't seen every draftable prospect play. Oh, and the freak show numbers are important. I think if a dude comes in and runs a 4.2, you need to factor that in to his overall grade outside of the tape. But I think it's dumb to argue about a WR, for example, that "needs to hit a 4.45 mark. If he runs over a 4.49, he's going to drop a little." I hear this every year and I really don't get it. I don't think a WR that runs .05 seconds faster than other WR's is going to be the difference between beating a cornerback or being blanketed. If you run a 4.2, chances are nobody can cover you without a cushion. That's statistically significant, whereas the semantics of 4.45 vs. 4.50 seem silly to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iamcanadian Posted February 27, 2018 Share Posted February 27, 2018 On 2/25/2018 at 5:41 PM, Scout said: *The results of this are derived from numerous combine articles/research papers available on the web, and my checking the #s versus top players at each position. I would properly cite each author, but it would take forever.* Top 60 interviews (teams are allowed to interview 60 prospects) and medicals are important, but what about the drills? Well first off, getting an invitation is huge. About 85% of players invited will be drafted. About 35 or so players not invited will be. Combine Predictability QB- No predictability RB- 40 most important (under 4.50). 3-cone and weight some predict. WR- No predictability TE- 40 is most important and a huge indicator. Followed by 3cone, bench, BJ, VJ also important OT- Weight, 40, BJ all important OG- 40 most important. Weight and bench also important OC- Weight and SS most important. DE- Weight is the strongest indicator of any drill for any positon. 40 is very important. 3 cone is significant as well. DT- 40 most important. Weight, bench and SS also very important OLB- 3-cone is most important. Weight, broad and 40 also significant ILB- 40 is one of the most significant predictors for any drill or position. Weight matters some. CB- 40 yard dash for corners are one of the most important predictors for any position or drill. Weight and bench have some significance. SAF- 40 most important. Then 3 cone. Overall Importance by Position QB- not at all - This is only true, because most of the top QB's avoid the Combine and it is thus, very difficult to compare them, but it is a huge mistake to think scouts, Hc's and GM's do not study their Combine performance! RB- some importance - The Combine is extremely important for RB's, first their 40 time is a crucial factor in deciding if they can go wide on a running play or will only be between the tackles types, then there is their ability to catch a pass, something they may have not done a whole lot in college, then there is their ability to block, again, something they may have never been asked to do in college, so the Combine can have a dramatic effect on where they are drafted. WR- not at all - Rubbish, the Scouts, HC's and GM's will look at a WR's hands to see if he body catches way too often, they will examine his breaks to see if he can be a solid route runner even if he wasn't asked to run a route tree in college and considering a tenth of a second in 40 time equates to 3 feet of seperation, his 40 time is crucial. They will also examine his willingness to block! TE- some importance - Speed is important in deciding whether he can stretch a defense or is simply a short receiver. Then of course, they will examine his ability to block or at least his willingness! They have to decide if he is a blocker or just a receiver? OT- very important - agree, they will examine his feet movement skills and sliding ability, to decide whether he can play LT or RT and watch to see how he bends to protect the passer against a strong pass rush. His 40 time is important, because it demonstrates his ability to set up quickly against pass rushers and his ability to get to the second level! They will be examined for hand use as well! OG- some importance - All OLmen are examined as to the feet movement skills, their overall strength re: a bull rush and their ability to slide with a DLmen, their 40 time is also a factor in where they get drafted! Ditto as far as hand use is concerned! OC- minimal importance - Extremely important as they must demonstrate the quickness/explosion to adjust while a play is going on, must also demonstrate the strength that they can handle a bull rush and have the quickness needed to assist the OG's in pass protection or on a running play. They will be thoroughly examined for their intellegence as the OC pretty well calls all the plays for the OL! Again ditto as far as hand use is concerned! DE- extremely important - First their is their overall speed and quickness, then there is strength and hand use, followed by their ability to bend the corner and of course, their 40 time and explosion off the LOS! Then there are the other intangibles, are they fooled easily by play action or are they intelligent enough to spot trouble? DT- some importance - First test is strength followed by speed and quickness out of their stance and the explosion they generate in either a pass rush or a bull rush. Can they bend the corner when defended one on one and how capable are they with their hands. How is their agility to get their hands up when all else fails. Can they tackle??? ILB- some importance - The Combine is absolutely crucial for LBers. In college, they never are asked to play like a pro LB and must demonstrate the ability to back pedal, cover in zones, cover in man to man and to have the speed to do so. How quick do they recognize what is happening? Are they easily fooled by WR's fakes? How strong are their hands and are they solid tacklers? Are they easily fooled by play action? 40 time is also crucial, because they will be asked to cover TE's man to man! OLB- some importance - See ILB and speed is even more of a factor! CB- extremely important - Since each tenth of a second equates to 3 feet of separation, speed is obviously an extremely important factor as well as balance and turning ability. Hand use to slow down WR's for at least 5 yards if not longer! Ability to catch a ball if the opportunity presents itself! The ability to tackle, ability to play zone or man to man and the ability to not be fooled by WR fakes or play action!!! SAF- some importance - A decision must be made about what type of Safety you are, a FS type or a SS type and if you are a FS, tackling is still quite important as well as CB skills although you can be a step slower than a CB. Are you a good passer rusher?? A SS usually falls into 2 categories, an in the box type of Safety, who is an excellent tackler and intimidator or a SS who plays more like a FS, but still must be a solid tackler! I am sure I have left out numerous other ways that the Combine is important for, but this clearly shows just how important it is for every position. Film alone cannot answer many of these questions, because college players rarely play against another pro prospect, so a lot of their film is useless and can only be used as a guide till all the facts are in and the Combine is designed to get all those facts, so a scout, HC or GM can make heads or tails of what he sees on film. It is especially true for juniors and small college prospects whose film is even less of importance, because they are still very raw players and need to be judged side by side against other prospects. Add in the interviews and the medical reports and the Combine is probably the greatest factor in deciding just where a player is drafted, even if it only confirms what you saw on film. It is the first time for most prospects, that they can be judged against all the other prospects who play the same position, nothing beats competition!!! Anybody who thinks the Combine is a complete waste of time, just hasn't a clue about how important a process it is for teams to decide who they will draft!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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