$18M Left In Cap Space - How To Spend?

[CWood21]

5 hours ago, vegas492 said:

Great way to spend money.  I"m happy he didn't ask for and get Gabe Jackson money.  That would have hurt big time.  This was a nice deal for the club.

Hoping Adams is next.

He wasn't getting crazy money.  He's only been a starting guard for a year, and not even a high level one at that.  Could he have gotten more money on the open market?  Probably, but he's still being paid top-25 OG money which isn't bad.

[CWood21]

3 hours ago, HorizontoZenith said:

Why though?  If we re-sign him, we're not going to be looking at getting somebody else in the second-ish round next year's draft, and I'd rather go that route.  Other than his quickness/route running, I just don't love Adams long term.  I felt the same way about Cobb.  I wouldn't have been upset if Cobb stayed or left, but I leaned towards being more okay with him leaving, and I'm even less high on Adams returning. 

I'd rather take a chance on getting a more complete receiver in the second round of this draft than re-sign Adams and have Adams, Nelson and Cobb. 

To me, this train of logic is screwy.  We've spent three years developing Davante Adams, only to let him walk as a FA and then turn around and invest a 2nd round pick into another WR who probably need a year (or two) of development before being a starting-caliber WR?  I feel like that asset (2nd round pick) would be better utilized elsewhere.  This is assuming the Packers can re-sign Davante Adams to a reasonable deal.

[spilltray]

6 hours ago, CWood21 said:

To me, this train of logic is screwy.  We've spent three years developing Davante Adams, only to let him walk as a FA and then turn around and invest a 2nd round pick into another WR who probably need a year (or two) of development before being a starting-caliber WR?  I feel like that asset (2nd round pick) would be better utilized elsewhere.  This is assuming the Packers can re-sign Davante Adams to a reasonable deal.

It's even more ridiculous when you consider Nelson and Cobb are both FA after 2018.

 

Adams is the guy going forward. They may add to that, and I hope they can work out a team friendly deal with Nelson, but you are propbably going to want to invest in the WR position anticipating one or both of those two being gone after 2018. No need to let Adams walk as well.

[BlondeonBlonde]

29 minutes ago, spilltray said:

It's even more ridiculous when you consider Nelson and Cobb are both FA after 2018.

 

Adams is the guy going forward. They may add to that, and I hope they can work out a team friendly deal with Nelson, but you are propbably going to want to invest in the WR position anticipating one or both of those two being gone after 2018. No need to let Adams walk as well.

Exactly. Adams isn't going anywhere. 

[deltarich87]

I don't think Adams is THE guy...they'd still need to draft a true #1 WR imo, but yes, he's not going anywhere. Cobb would likely be the one to move on and perhaps Jordy sticks around as WR3 as his career winds down

[MacReady]

Funny, I got the same treatment when I suggested I didn't want to re-sign Cobb and when I was one of a small handful who wanted to re-sign Bakhtiari.

[MacReady]

8 hours ago, CWood21 said:

To me, this train of logic is screwy.  We've spent three years developing Davante Adams, only to let him walk as a FA and then turn around and invest a 2nd round pick into another WR who probably need a year (or two) of development before being a starting-caliber WR?  I feel like that asset (2nd round pick) would be better utilized elsewhere.  This is assuming the Packers can re-sign Davante Adams to a reasonable deal.

We used a second round pick on Adams hoping he could be more than he is.  He isn't.  He goes through high and low confidence swings and he's going to have 1-2 drops a game.  Sometimes in big situations.  You can live with that if he's prime Terrell Owens, but he's not.  He's got quickness and a good jump and that's about all you've got with Adams.  Re-signing him for Cobb money (which will have been inflated by the time Adams signs) for a quick high jumper with questionable bouts of confidence/poor hands is not something I want to do, and I really don't care what the mass opinion is on that opinion, just like I didn't care when I was one of the only people who was very okay with the notion of Cobb leaving (I wanted him, not going to lie, but I wouldn't have felt a thing if he left).  Turns out I had every right to feel that way because once Cobb's role expanded, his production diminished. 

I'm also the only one here expecting a second and fourth year jump from Davis/Janis, but that's also absurd around here.

Davante Adams isn't going to be the number one receiver here, but he's going to get paid like a #1 either here or somewhere else, and I'm crazy for not wanting to pay 10-12 million a year for a receiver with #2 receiver talent and overall game. 

I'm not opposed to re-signing him to a 1/2 year extension at those numbers, but I definitely see a 3rd/4th round compensatory pick as more valuable to us than carrying an 11-12 million contract for four to five years on a #2 receiver. 

Also, I was one of the crazy ones for not wanting to cut Adams heading into 2016.  So I guess I'll just be the crazy one. 

 

[JBURGE]

11 minutes ago, HorizontoZenith said:

So I guess I'll just be the crazy one. 

Well we agree on one thing at least. 

11 minutes ago, HorizontoZenith said:

and I really don't care what the mass opinion is on that opinion,

So we have to accept your opinion but you don't care about others? 

11 minutes ago, HorizontoZenith said:

I'm also the only one here expecting a second and fourth year jump from Davis/Janis, but that's also absurd around here.

False.

11 minutes ago, HorizontoZenith said:

Turns out I had every right to feel that way because once Cobb's role expanded, his production diminished.

You have every right to feel however you want. Just stop arguing and belittling other people's opinions because they don't fall in line with your messiah like attitude. 

[Shanedorf]

HZ - Your assessment of Davante Adams sucks, ergo everything you wrote after that isn't worth squat.

And no, I am not interested in debating it with you, I'd rather eat glass.   (I've done both; the glass was less painful -  on both ends)

[MacReady]

Just now, JBURGE25 said:

Well we agree on one thing at least.

Give me a quick rundown of how frequently I'm wrong when people suggest I have a wrong opinion. 

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So we have to accept your opinion but you don't care about others? 

You want to know what the difference is between you and I?  When I disagree with someone, I provide multiple points, counterpoints, acknowledgments and disagreements with an aggressive tone, but an overall sound and thought out counterargument.  You respond with, "You want to re-sign Janis over Adams.  Wow"  That's literally not offering an ounce of an argument, that's just calling someone out because you disagree with them.  I'm not asking you to agree with my opinions, I never did.  I just find it flat out stupid that I'm literally always jumped on for being this arse or this insufferable **** when literally every single time I get into an argument, I provide evidence, points, counterpoints and historical context to prove I'm right, and people like you respond with, "Lol, you crazy."  How does that work? 

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False.

Don't give me this crap.  It's very insulting.  This was, of course, in response to me saying I'm the only one expecting a second/fourth year jump from Davis/Janis.  You know damn well that the vast majority of people here have given up on Janis.  You know damn well the vast majority here have given up on Davis.  It's why people were suggesting we'd cut one of them in favor of Allison/Yancey/Dupre/McCaffrey/take your pick.  And you know damn well the vast majority of people on the old site gave up on Davante Adams after his second year. 

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You have every right to feel however you want. Just stop arguing and belittling other people's opinions because they don't fall in line with your messiah like attitude. 

I don't belittle people's opinions.  Look back on this thread.  I got into this discussion when I asked, "Why though?"  And then I provided my point.  I didn't belittle an opinion, I provided a counter opinion.  There was no condescending tone, there was no belittlement, there was a question and reasons to back up my question. 

Look at how I responded to Packer_Esp.  He said he agreed with some, then disagreed with other parts of my argument.  He didn't say, "Your opinion sucks, this, that, you're crazy, wow."  Look at my response to him.  There was no condescending, there was no belittlement, there was me presenting my counter argument.

Then you've got people like you saying LITERALLY only, "You want Janis instead of Adams.  wow." 

Look at how Shanedorf JUST responded. 

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HZ - Your assessment of Davante Adams sucks, ergo everything you wrote after that isn't worth squat.

I've got this perception as being this **** when I literally never say crap like, "Wow," "Your opinion sucks,"

I provide an aggressive counter argument, and I get that distinction as being the **** just because I go in-depth and I point out obvious flaws in an argument.

It's frankly bull****.  I got called out by some new person here for being a **** when LITERALLY the only thing I said was, "Lol.  Yeah.  Right."  In an otherwise detailed and thought out response.

I'm gearing towards abandoning this crap and letting all of you have that circle "agreement" mentality where everybody agrees with everybody and the only actual discussion is trolls saying our defense sucks and Capers sucks.

It's literally been ticking me off and it's really not even worth it because the only reason there's this perception out there that I'm the **** is because I actually come out with opinions that aren't massively accepted while the rest of you are in a massage circle where you think the same damn thing. 

So how about don't tell me I'm being a condescending and belittling **** when the most you've contributed to this conversation is, "You want to re-sign Janis over Adams.  Wow." 

[ChaRisMa]

Like I said, we can afford him and Jordy and Cobb. Invest another pick on day two there next year and watch Rodgers continue to roll.

[Packerraymond]

Keep it civil guys. HZ I see nothing wrong with your posting style other than you constantly bring up the times you were right on things, which is fine, but you can't be surprised when it rubs people the wrong way.

I have no issues debating you as that sort of thing brushes right off me.

Adams has elite route running ability, great ball tracking and high pointing and RAC ability. His downsides are his long speed and concentration can be below average. I think he can cap out at a top 10-15 WR in the NFL, and I'm OK up to 11m a year for his return.

[CWood21]

1 hour ago, HorizontoZenith said:

Funny, I got the same treatment when I suggested I didn't want to re-sign Cobb and when I was one of a small handful who wanted to re-sign Bakhtiari.

Those are two mutually exclusive situations.  They aren't tied to each other.

[CWood21]

1 hour ago, HorizontoZenith said:

Also, I was one of the crazy ones for not wanting to cut Adams heading into 2016.  So I guess I'll just be the crazy one.

I'm legitimately not sure what you're expecting out of him.  After an injury-riddled sophomore year, he came up with 75 receptions, 995 receiving yards, and 12 TD receptions.  There's no reason to think that he can't outproduce those numbers this year.  Even if he gets ~$10M/year on a new deal, that puts him in the backend of the top 15 in terms of salary.  Which isn't crazy money by any means.

The problem I have is that the Packers have bigger issues than upgrading their WR corp, that letting Adams walk and reinvesting a 2nd round pick (still a semi-premium pick) into that position seems like a poor use of resources.

[{Family Ghost}]

3 hours ago, deltarich87 said:

I don't think Adams is THE guy...they'd still need to draft a true #1 WR imo, but yes, he's not going anywhere. Cobb would likely be the one to move on and perhaps Jordy sticks around as WR3 as his career winds down

I think he's a #1 in our offense ... he's just 24 years old as well and just scratching the surface.  He's not the fastest guy in the world, but he gets quite a bit of separation with his route running ability.  He can play every position .. knows the offense like the back of his hand.  We'd be fine with him as a #1 weapon two or three years down the road.