Packers releasing WR Jordy Nelson

[skibrett15]

Just now, HighCalebR said:

I'm not going to argue cap too much.. but if you went to your boss and asked for a raise that you definitely deserve and he says no, do you go back to your desk and keep working or do you start sending out feelers to other companies? Players don't have that option, it's a bit silly because if they stop trying as hard they'll get cut. If they hold out they can be viewed as malcontents and make less money on their next contract. I've never seen a hold out be successful, but I definitely can understand why they're doing it.

If you want to have that kind of flexibility in the NFL, negotiate for player options or negotiate shorter deals with gtd money.  If you want more gtd money though, you're going to have to give that up in the form of team options or years with unguaranteed money at potentially lower valuations.  Teams, players and agents all know this.  It's the fans that don't understand it, so the perception is out of whack.

[HighCalebR]

Just now, skibrett15 said:

If you want to have that kind of flexibility in the NFL, negotiate for player options or negotiate shorter deals with gtd money.  If you want more gtd money though, you're going to have to give that up in the form of team options or years with unguaranteed money at potentially lower valuations.  Teams, players and agents all know this.  It's the fans that don't understand it, so the perception is out of whack.

But why do players like Le'veon and A.Donald hold out towards the end of their contracts?

[skibrett15]

Just now, HighCalebR said:

But why do players like Le'veon and A.Donald hold out towards the end of their contracts?

because they have the leverage to do so?  They weren't under contract and they were under the tag in the case of Bell.  Both wanted the security of the long term deal with slightly higher GTD money.  Both didn't have that from their teams, but their teams still heavily rely on them for success, so they have leverage to hold out and not risk injury in OTAs or other non-essential activities.

[HighCalebR]

3 minutes ago, skibrett15 said:

because they have the leverage to do so?  They weren't under contract and they were under the tag in the case of Bell.  Both wanted the security of the long term deal with slightly higher GTD money.  Both didn't have that from their teams, but their teams still heavily rely on them for success, so they have leverage to hold out and not risk injury in OTAs or other non-essential activities.

This is what I'm saying. Did the hold outs work for either of them? They have all the leverage and it still doesn't really work. 

I don't even know what I'm really trying to get at.  So it's useless arguing with me lulz. I just guess it's a tough spot to be in with such short careers.

[skibrett15]

1 minute ago, HighCalebR said:

This is what I'm saying. Did the hold outs work for either of them? They have all the leverage and it still doesn't really work. 

guess we will see.  Playing under the tag gives you the best possible chance to earn the most money the following year.  We saw that with cousins and trumaine johnson.

They really don't have a ton of leverage if the team is capable of paying them under the tag.

[SSG]

1 minute ago, Packerraymond said:

I hate to call your opinion wrong because technically they can't be, but it's as close to wrong as you can get. It's like you haven't been following along this off-season.

They literally asked Gute in his opening press conference if he would be different from Ted as far as being open with the fans go. The Sitton release was the exact example used because fans never got an answer. He responded that he hoped he would handle it differently.

The moment came and he came out and answered everyone's questions and thanked Jordy for his time. Calling it a joke shows me all I need.

It's unfortunate your Green Bay Jordy's cut Nelson. Maybe a new player will rise to the point where you can put them ahead of the team?

Show me where it is wrong? I've followed this offseason very closeley but I'm not a "the establishment is right in all circumstances" type of guy.  I'm not going to blindly back every decisison  regardless of the effect or outcome.  I'm not going to look at current Packers in a differant light than past Packers.  

We have a differant opinions on this, that's all.  Thanking Jordy Nelson in a press conferenca was to appease fans.  You said it yourself.  He was going to do it differant.  FANS never got their answer with the release of Sitton so he was going too appease them and handle it differantly.  Thanking Jordy Nelson had nothing to do with how he felt about Nelson and was done to appease a fan base.  He thought Jordy Nelson was a 10 year veteran minimum caliber of player with his contract offer.  

I'm not putting any player above a fan base.  I think the cuttting had a detrimental effect on the team.  Like it or not, Jordy Nelson lead this team in both yards and catches prior to the injury to AR12.  Unless we're planning on getting rid of Rodgers and running with Hundley this team absoluetely isn't better off without him.  Say what you want but with AR12 on the field, he's been our best and most consistant WR.  That's not an opinion, that's a fact based on pure numbers. teh fact that Randall Cobb or Adams were more productive with Hundley as QB matters little.  That's like the Steelers cutting Antonio Brown because  he had a huge drop off when Mike Vick was QBing them.  Or like Indy cutting TY Hilton because he had a MAJOR drop off in production without Andrew Luck.

[SSG]

4 hours ago, incognito_man said:

Who made way more than $31million from 2014 to 2017?

off the top of my head.... Mike Wallace and Dwayne Bowe who were guaranteed upwards of 25 million each in their contracts that they signed in 2013 (again, that's off the top of my head without looking).  There are probably upwards of 7 or 8 more as well.  Hell, Randall Cobb made more per season than Nelson despite a HUGE differance in production.

[skibrett15]

1 minute ago, SSG said:

I'm not putting any player above a fan base.  I think the cuttting had a detrimental effect on the team.  Like it or not, Jordy Nelson lead this team in both yards and catches prior to the injury to AR12.  Unless we're planning on getting rid of Rodgers and running with Hundley this team absoluetely isn't better off without him.  Say what you want but with AR12 on the field, he's been our best and most consistant WR.  That's not an opinion, that's a fact based on pure numbers. teh fact that Randall Cobb or Adams were more productive with Hundley as QB matters little.  That's like the Steelers cutting Antonio Brown because  he had a huge drop off when Mike Vick was QBing them.  Or like Indy cutting TY Hilton because he had a MAJOR drop off in production without Andrew Luck.

LOL

[Packerraymond]

2 minutes ago, SSG said:

Show me where it is wrong? I've followed this offseason very closeley but I'm not a "the establishment is right in all circumstances" type of guy.  I'm not going to blindly back every decisison  regardless of the effect or outcome.  I'm not going to look at current Packers in a differant light than past Packers.  

We have a differant opinions on this, that's all.  Thanking Jordy Nelson in a press conferenca was to appease fans.  You said it yourself.  He was going to do it differant.  FANS never got their answer with the release of Sitton so he was going too appease them and handle it differantly.  Thanking Jordy Nelson had nothing to do with how he felt about Nelson and was done to appease a fan base.  He thought Jordy Nelson was a 10 year veteran minimum caliber of player with his contract offer.  

I'm not putting any player above a fan base.  I think the cuttting had a detrimental effect on the team.  Like it or not, Jordy Nelson lead this team in both yards and catches prior to the injury to AR12.  Unless we're planning on getting rid of Rodgers and running with Hundley this team absoluetely isn't better off without him.  Say what you want but with AR12 on the field, he's been our best and most consistant WR.  That's not an opinion, that's a fact based on pure numbers. teh fact that Randall Cobb or Adams were more productive with Hundley as QB matters little.  That's like the Steelers cutting Antonio Brown because  he had a huge drop off when Mike Vick was QBing them.  Or like Indy cutting TY Hilton because he had a MAJOR drop off in production without Andrew Luck.

TY and Antonio Brown were well under 30 and had no one to replace them. If they were 33 and had a receiver like Davante next to them I'm sure that would've been considered.

Also because Gute offered him the min doesn't have anything to do with what his worth was, it's what you can afford. I've negotiated for plenty of vehicles where I know I'm lowballing the owner by 5k from what it's worth, but that's what I could afford for the vehicle and it did me no hard to see if the owner was desperate to move it.

The Packers could only afford a certain amount for Jordy knowing they want to upgrade the defense and tight end position. They offered Jordy what he could afford and he declined. No skin off anyone's back.

[incognito_man]

5 minutes ago, SSG said:

off the top of my head.... Mike Williams and Dwayne Bowe who were guaranteed upwards of 25 million each in their contracts that they signed in 2013 (again, that's off the top of my head without looking).  There are probably upwards of 7 or 8 more as well.  Hell, Randall Cobb made more per season than Nelson despite a HUGE differance in production.

I don't think you know what you're talking about. 

[Norm]

1 hour ago, squire12 said:

Better fire Gutekunst....apparently it did not work.

 

@NormSizedMidget. Anyone have a website for this?

www.firegute.com

Bookmark it.

[IBleedGreen&Gold]

2 years/$15mm with $13mm guaranteed is what I heard. Good rebound Jordy. Obviously too rich for the Packers.

[AlexGreen#20]

4 minutes ago, IBleedGreen&Gold said:

2 years/$15mm with $13mm guaranteed is what I heard. Good rebound Jordy. Obviously too rich for the Packers.

Options:

A. Jordy Nelson at 11 million in 2018, let him walk after the season and pick up your 6th round comp pick in the 2019 draft.

B. Restructure Jordy, get him at 2/13 (figure you get some kind of hometown discount). Let him walk in 2020 and retire.

C. Cut Nelson, get 7.5 million in cap space.

 

Tough call

 

[squire12]

1 minute ago, AlexGreen#20 said:

Options:

A. Jordy Nelson at 11 million in 2018, let him walk after the season and pick up your 6th round comp pick in the 2019 draft.

B. Restructure Jordy, get him at 2/13 (figure you get some kind of hometown discount). Let him walk in 2020 and retire.

C. Cut Nelson, get 7.5 million in cap space.

 

Tough call

 

Option A is only viable if Nelson does not retire after 2018 season and has a reasonably productive 2018 season.

[AlexGreen#20]

13 minutes ago, squire12 said:

Option A is only viable if Nelson does not retire after 2018 season and has a reasonably productive 2018 season.

Valid, I think that's a fair gamble though. I don't think Jordy signs that deal without planning to play out that year. 

Regardless you have him for this year and then you're free of financial liability the following year. Remove the part about not getting the comp pick if you're not a believer.