Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
titans0021

What would you give up for OBJ?

Recommended Posts

With Suh watch over and a bit of a lull between the FA rush and the draft, figured this would make for an interesting discussion. 

Right now, it sounds like the Giants aren’t actively shopping Odell Beckham Jr., but they definitely seem willing to listen to offers. What would you trade in order to give Marcus a true No. 1?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Not much.

1. Hes a headcase

2. He's going to want a ginormous amount of money.

3. We can wait and see what we have in Corey Davis/

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I mean, he is SUPREMELY talented and it'd be amazing to watch him every Sunday making plays in a Titans jersey, but we don't have the culture to handle his off-kilter (putting it nicely) personality. At least not yet. Maybe we can start looking at this kinda guy in a few years if we're a perennial contender at that point, but right now I'd be way too nervous to give up major assets and a ridiculous contract to have him.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I mean, not that I entertain that much the idea of trading (for) Odell, mainly because I'm also a Giants fan, but it seems silly to not want to have him. 

1. He's really not a big headcase, mainly everything negatively written about him has been blown out of proportion. Compared to the antics of some of the former big-name, superstar WRs, his stuff is way minor.

2. The idea of not wanting to invest draft capital in him is just insane. Just like it was with Landry, but even more so with Odell. Let me put it this way, if only 5 players in this Draft that will end up better NFL players than Odell, it's going to be one hell of a Draft class. To not want to spend a mid 20s Draft pick into a top 15 (if not better) current NFL player seems pretty crazy.

Even if you think Davis will be as good as advertised or better, having him and Odell on the same team will only be a problem to opposing defenses.

But anyway, just some thoughts.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Even the best WR in the NFL is only marginally impact. WRs are hood ornaments and nothing more, even ones as good as OBJ.

I would give up nothing significant for him.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 minutes ago, TitanLegend said:

Even the best WR in the NFL is only marginally impact. WRs are hood ornaments and nothing more, even ones as good as OBJ.

I would give up nothing significant for him.

I mean, Eli's numbers with and without OBJ on the field over the last few years are pretty eye-opening.

Though, I'll also admit that I've never bought into the shiny hood ornament argument. Particularly after a year when the entire offense struggled, at least in some part, because our receivers were near the bottom of the league in created and contested receptions. Though maybe I'm sipping the Cian Fahey kool aid a little too much. Marcus has never really had anyone (outside of maybe Delanie) that could create separation and make contested catches with any regularity. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, TitanLegend said:

Even the best WR in the NFL is only marginally impact. WRs are hood ornaments and nothing more, even ones as good as OBJ.

I would give up nothing significant for him.

That's pretty naive, to be honest. Obviously Jon Robinson is among the majority of the (if not the whole) league who wouldn't agree with that, otherwise I doubt he would've spent a top 5 pick on a WR.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'd easily give up our 1st this year. How much more though? I honestly dont know.... Maybe a 3rd the following year. I know that may not be enough for the Giants, but thats about all I'd be comfortable giving up.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
33 minutes ago, Andrei01 said:

That's pretty naive, to be honest. Obviously Jon Robinson is among the majority of the (if not the whole) league who wouldn't agree with that, otherwise I doubt he would've spent a top 5 pick on a WR.

Spending the 5th pick on Corey Davis was a mistake, even if he ends up being really good. That being said, we had a need at receiver, covered our other big need at CB with the other first round pick, so it was an..alright? pick at the time, I guess. But long term a guy like Jamal Adams, Marshon Lattimore, Malik Hooker or Haason Reddick would have made us a far better football team both last year and going forward than Corey Davis ever will, even if he does live up to expectations(that's also assuming those 4 don't bust, obviously).

We no longer have a real need at receiver though, but do have needs at ILB, edge rusher and interior o-line(?). All positions that are far, far, far, far(infinitely more fars) more important than a receiver. So giving up anything of worth for OBJ would be absolutely foolish.

Cold Hard Football facts did a fantastic article on how generally useless wide receivers are, but their site doesn't really work anymore. Here's an article that broke it down some.

https://www.patspropaganda.com/the-chff-shiny-hood-ornament-theory-elevated-to/

Quote

ONE – Wide receivers, for all their eye-catching flash and dash, are little more than shiny ornaments on the hood of an NFL offense. Oh, sure, they’re nice to have. But they don’t necessarily make your offense any better – and they rarely if ever make your team any better.

TWO – You should add a flashy wide receiver only when all the other pieces of a great team are in place: a great driver (the quarterback), some sporty tires that provide plenty of traction (the offensive line and ground game), a powerful motor (the defense) and a great transmission (special teams) that allows you to change gears quickly and effectively.

THREE – Even the greatest receivers of all time can make a big impact only when all those pieces are in place, and even then the impact is largely overstated. Even the great Jerry Rice, for example, touched the ball just four to five times per game. So the impact of even the greatest at the position is minimal compared with the impact of a certain position that touches the ball on every offensive snap. And remember, Rice did not make the 49ers a great team. He was drafted by the 18-1 defending Super Bowl champ 49ers in 1985.

 

Edited by TitanLegend

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Opinions vary.... Bucky Brooks listed a #1 WR as the 5th most important... MLB 9th, FS at 11 and strong safety 18.

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000503855/article/ranking-each-positions-importance-from-quarterback-to-returner

Personally an elite WR would put this offense over the top... More so than any rookie we draft at 25... On offense or defense.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, TitanLegend said:

Spending the 5th pick on Corey Davis was a mistake, even if he ends up being really good. That being said, we had a need at receiver, covered our other big need at CB with the other first round pick, so it was an..alright? pick at the time, I guess. But long term a guy like Jamal Adams, Marshon Lattimore, Malik Hooker or Haason Reddick would have made us a far better football team both last year and going forward than Corey Davis ever will, even if he does live up to expectations(that's also assuming those 3 don't bust, obviously).

We no longer have a real need at receiver though, but do have needs at ILB, edge rusher and interior o-line(?). All positions that are far, far, far, far(infinitely more fars) more important than a receiver. So giving up anything of worth for OBJ would be absolutely foolish.

Cold Hard Football facts did a fantastic article on how generally useless wide receivers are, but their site doesn't really work anymore. Here's an article that broke it down some.

https://www.patspropaganda.com/the-chff-shiny-hood-ornament-theory-elevated-to/

 

That hardly seems like a piece out of a fantastic article, but more like a bunch of random opinions tried to be passed on as knowledge? 

Anyway, there's hardly such a thing as a position of no value in the NFL. We can debate what's overrated or not, but if you think CBs play an important role, I assume you do because you did mention three DBs in what you project to be should be picks of higher value than Davis (and one of them happens to be a CB), it makes 0 sense to not attribute the same importance to the WR position. The two balance each other out, like OL and pass rush.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
37 minutes ago, ragevsuall17 said:

I'd easily give up our 1st this year. How much more though? I honestly dont know.... Maybe a 3rd the following year. I know that may not be enough for the Giants, but thats about all I'd be comfortable giving up.

This is kind of where I'm at. I think his impact on the offense as a whole would be significant, even if there are plenty of people that use the shiny hood ornament argument. Gives Marcus an actual game-changing threat on offense (something that he's definitely never had here) and would almost certainly help open things up underneath for Delanie and across the board for CD. I've also long stated that headcase stuff means very little to me. I don't know if I'd go beyond a first, but I'd offer up #25 without much of a second thought. Our absolute best-case scenario with that pick would be hoping and praying that the guy would eventually develop into the kind of player OBJ already is. And Beckham doesn't even turn 26 until November.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Wide receivers are like running backs. When it comes to running backs, the important thing is can your team run the ball. If you can create a good running game juggling 3 backs, you don't need one great one. Same with WR's if you can make the pass game work, you don't need an OBJ. 

Personally I believe WR's can be worth the high draft pick, but not often are they worth paying  big money to.

I mean how many truly elite WR's have been on championship teams? Hell look at Odell in his best season, 2015, his team went 6-10. I mean he's had 3 elite seasons and only made 1 playoff appearance. I mean its a team game yes, but Beckham is asking to be paid like a game changer. Does he change games? Here's a question I ask, what was more instrumental to the Giants 2016 playoff run, the infusion of free agent talent on defense or OBJ being OBJ. I'd argue the defensive talent.

I dunno, I curious how valuable you are as a player if you have a career season and your team doesn't win. Call if the Chris Johnson conundrum. 

WR's tend to attract more top 10 highlights and prime time games, than they do meaningful wins imo. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  



×