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ckoz24

Saints Path to the Draft: Thoughts and Opinions

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, whodatworm23 said:

True but this offseason in particular Payton has consistantly quoted the need for an edge rusher. They have in fact spent a ton of time with Arden Key maybe trying to convince themselves hes worth the 27th pick. However the guy I would say all Saints fans should start getting familiar with is Florida State's Josh Sweat. 

 

Sweat is an unbelievable athlete in the mold of Texans J. Clowney with the size, speed and length Ireland covets in edge rushers. As of right now Sweat is my sleeper pick at 27th overall to the Saints.

 

Edge rusher is something the saints could definitely use, but what if Okafor returns to form? Before his injury, he played close to 80% of the snaps at EDGE, we also potentially could have another solid contributor there with al-quadin muhammad. I definitely think the Saints view EDGE as a need, I just don't see the playing time available at #27, unless of course Okafor gets hurt again or his performance falls off. I think we'd essentially be spending our 1st rounder on Okafor insurance / Cam's future replacement, In this case I'd be disappointed if our 1st rounder is riding the bench in 2018.

I can't find the numbers on how often the saints are in their nicket defense, but If I had to guess it's roughly 70-75% of the time. Let's say instead of EDGE, we go with my preferred option which is DT / interior pass rusher - it's not a "need", but I clearly see a huge role for this position. You replace the NT [tyeler davison] in your nickel defense / obvious passing downs with someone like Maurice Hurst, in any case he's likely at a minimum going to play anywhere from 50-60% of the snaps vs Sweat who is potentially only getting about 10-15% per week because he's behind a productive Okafor and we have Cam on the other side. Again, my numbers are off because I haven't researched the stats here so I'm only estimating, but I think my point is obvious, it's all about who can help our team the most immediately in 2018.

EDIT: I forgot about Onyemata, but honestly we were fortunate that neither Rankins nor Onyemata missed any games last year, if either of them gets hurt were immediately thin in the pass rushing department, which is why I think we still need another DT in the rotation.

TL;DR I think EDGE is a need and will help the team in the long term, but in the short term it might not produce results. I prefer DT because I think we can get the best of boith worlds, we can improve our pass rush along with a guarantee that the player will see enough snaps to benefit the team. I also worry that we risk reaching for DE at @27 simply because we have a need there when by all accounts this is a weak draft for edge rushers.

Lastly, this is the same reason I prefer TE early, we have a clear starter position open there, whoever we pick is going to see playing time. For me, I prefer we pick someone @27 who is nearly guaranteed to see the field in 2018,  I wouldn't be upset if we went in another direction but I'd just interpret that to mean we were unlucky and nobody we really wanted fell, in that scenario I'd assume were just gonna go BPA @ O-Line / QB / WR / etc and call it a day.

 

 

Edited by Lyoane

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1 hour ago, Lyoane said:

 

Edge rusher is something the saints could definitely use, but what if Okafor returns to form? Before his injury, he played close to 80% of the snaps at EDGE, we also potentially could have another solid contributor there with al-quadin muhammad. I definitely think the Saints view EDGE as a need, I just don't see the playing time available at #27, unless of course Okafor gets hurt again or his performance falls off. I think we'd essentially be spending our 1st rounder on Okafor insurance / Cam's future replacement, In this case I'd be disappointed if our 1st rounder is riding the bench in 2018.

I can't find the numbers on how often the saints are in their nicket defense, but If I had to guess it's roughly 70-75% of the time. Let's say instead of EDGE, we go with my preferred option which is DT / interior pass rusher - it's not a "need", but I clearly see a huge role for this position. You replace the NT [tyeler davison] in your nickel defense / obvious passing downs with someone like Maurice Hurst, in any case he's likely at a minimum going to play anywhere from 50-60% of the snaps vs Sweat who is potentially only getting about 10-15% per week because he's behind a productive Okafor and we have Cam on the other side. Again, my numbers are off because I haven't researched the stats here so I'm only estimating, but I think my point is obvious, it's all about who can help our team the most immediately in 2018.

EDIT: I forgot about Onyemata, but honestly we were fortunate that neither Rankins nor Onyemata missed any games last year, if either of them gets hurt were immediately thin in the pass rushing department, which is why I think we still need another DT in the rotation.

TL;DR I think EDGE is a need and will help the team in the long term, but in the short term it might not produce results. I prefer DT because I think we can get the best of boith worlds, we can improve our pass rush along with a guarantee that the player will see enough snaps to benefit the team. I also worry that we risk reaching for DE at @27 simply because we have a need there when by all accounts this is a weak draft for edge rushers.

Lastly, this is the same reason I prefer TE early, we have a clear starter position open there, whoever we pick is going to see playing time. For me, I prefer we pick someone @27 who is nearly guaranteed to see the field in 2018,  I wouldn't be upset if we went in another direction but I'd just interpret that to mean we were unlucky and nobody we really wanted fell, in that scenario I'd assume were just gonna go BPA @ O-Line / QB / WR / etc and call it a day.

 

 

So you want a guy thats gonna play and be productive. Not someone whos drafted with future in mind at 27.

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Posted (edited)
54 minutes ago, whodatworm23 said:

So you want a guy thats gonna play and be productive. Not someone whos drafted with future in mind at 27.

Yea pretty much, my reasoning is 1.] Brees Age and 2.] No 2nd Rounder, we need someone who can come in and play right away at #27.

Edited by Lyoane

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1 hour ago, Lyoane said:

Yea pretty much, my reasoning is 1.] Brees Age and 2.] No 2nd Rounder, we need someone who can come in and play right away at #27.

I’m more worried about wasting all of the young talent on this team than an aging Drew Brees. This team has a five year window assuming the Saints have a decent transition away from Brees. The Saints had enough last year to win a Super Bowl and should be better with FA improvements and tons of guys returning from IR. We don’t need a guy to step in at #27 right away. And how realistic is that anyway? The past two guys we drafted this late on the 1st were Meachem and Robinson. Yes...last years draft was phenominal, but it’s not sustainable. 

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7 hours ago, whodatworm23 said:

True but this offseason in particular Payton has consistantly quoted the need for an edge rusher. They have in fact spent a ton of time with Arden Key maybe trying to convince themselves hes worth the 27th pick. However the guy I would say all Saints fans should start getting familiar with is Florida State's Josh Sweat. 

 

Sweat is an unbelievable athlete in the mold of Texans J. Clowney with the size, speed and length Ireland covets in edge rushers. As of right now Sweat is my sleeper pick at 27th overall to the Saints.

Yeah that's fair. I went back and saw the quote and he mentioned Edge rusher, TE and LB being the areas he wanted to improve this season.

Tbh, I want nothing to do with Key. His weight fluctuations and his poor pro-day (4.8 40????) really make me wonder what's going on with him. What's funny to me too is the guy he's getting compared to (Danielle Hunter) is probably the best comparison for the guy you're mentioning, Sweat. Sweat's usage and recovery from injury really hampered his production at FSU imo. Between being a stunning athlete and already a good run defender, I'd be really happy taking him in the 1st. Another option is the guy from Wake Forest Duke Ejiofer (sp?). Dropping due to injury, but a really good pass rusher. Could be another Shaq Lawson type scenario for him.

For the later rounds, I really hope we consider drafting Fred Warner from BYU. I think he'd be a really good weapon for us on this D has a coverage backer. His ability to play slot should really help us in passing situations. I'd be ok with him in the 3rd.

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11 hours ago, Lyoane said:

Yea pretty much, my reasoning is 1.] Brees Age and 2.] No 2nd Rounder, we need someone who can come in and play right away at #27.

I agree with you but ive been studying this draft and prospects along with team needs... 27 isnt gonna produce the type of player your coveting, at least not at a BPA 1st round value IMO. I believe that if the Saints stand pat at 27 they will have to choose between the BPA whose a 1st round talent but plays a position of strength for us or pick a player that plays a position of need at 27 whos more like a 2nd round talent.

 

Trading back could look very enticing to the Saints this year or dont rule out a jump up to like 23rd with the Pats in order to land a player they covet.

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2 hours ago, whodatworm23 said:

I agree with you but ive been studying this draft and prospects along with team needs... 27 isnt gonna produce the type of player your coveting, at least not at a BPA 1st round value IMO. I believe that if the Saints stand pat at 27 they will have to choose between the BPA whose a 1st round talent but plays a position of strength for us or pick a player that plays a position of need at 27 whos more like a 2nd round talent.

 

Trading back could look very enticing to the Saints this year or dont rule out a jump up to like 23rd with the Pats in order to land a player they covet.

I love the flexibility we got this year. We can truly do almost whatever we want.  

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2 hours ago, ckoz24 said:

I love the flexibility we got this year. We can truly do almost whatever we want.  

That is true

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Just saw Reuben Foster being charged up to 11 years in prison.

I thought the Saints wanted this guy when the 49ers took him and we got Ramczyk.

Saints draft team is good and lucky!

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Posted (edited)

Is anyone a little annoyed with every mock draft showing us getting a TE. I'm ok with it happening but we ranked 2nd in offense and 17th in defense. 

It almost feels like all the pundits are scared to say anything else besides a TE. If they get the wrong TE they save face with choice, if they get it wrong gehy can say no one expected it.

Edited by ckoz24

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On 4/24/2018 at 5:01 PM, ckoz24 said:

Is anyone a little annoyed with every mock draft showing us getting a TE. I'm ok with it happening but we ranked 2nd in offense and 17th in defense. 

It almost feels like all the pundits are scared to say anything else besides a TE. If they get the wrong TE they save face with choice, if they get it wrong gehy can say no one expected it.

Well let's not kid ourselves we're still an offensive team and TE is a definite need(one of the only holes on offense).

That said, I'm not convinced we'll take one at 27 and wouldn't be disappointed if we picked defense depending on who is available.

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22 hours ago, Jlowe22 said:

Well let's not kid ourselves we're still an offensive team and TE is a definite need(one of the only holes on offense).

That said, I'm not convinced we'll take one at 27 and wouldn't be disappointed if we picked defense depending on who is available.

I think our offense can be improved considerably. We struggled moving the ball at times last year...especially on 3rd down and the red zone. It really was the offenses no-show in the first half of the Vikings game that lost the game. 

The biggest problem I have with drafting a 1st round TE (same as WR/OG/OC) is that it’s judt not very good value. There is not a huge off between the guy we’d get at #27 and a guy we’d get in the mid-rounds. 

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3 minutes ago, sammymvpknight said:

I think our offense can be improved considerably. We struggled moving the ball at times last year...especially on 3rd down and the red zone.

Sure, I'm only saying I don't think it was a personnel problem(other than TE, and Snead's no show).  We don't have the best of the best at every position, but they're pretty solid throughout.  We could certainly improve, but TE is the glaring hole.  And I think having one could have improved our red zone offense significantly.

I don't disagree with the problems of drafting one in the first though.

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