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Potential trades in the top 10


onejayhawk

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6 hours ago, Gmen said:

That’s what has been most widely reported.  But, there was a report recently claiming Giants coaches like Allen.  Other reports the Giants spent significant time with Rosen, and OBJ has been working out at UCLA.  Other reports the Giants love Bradley Chubb.  Barkley was spotted with a Giants hoody yesterday.  What does it all mean!??  Nobody really knows.

I said this in other threads, but I don’t like a trade down to 12.  I’d trade down to 5 with the broncos and take Chubb or Barkley if we don’t plan on drafting a qb.

 

I tend to agree, IMO, a team should always attempt to stay in the top 5 if possible or at least the top 10 when trading back from a high pick, places where game changers are found and really successful teams want game changers not just another starter or 2. You finish last or close to it, to get the stars of tomorrow and trading out usually leads to disaster. Cleveland has tried it twice and look what it got them!!!

As for the rumours and who visited and who didn't, I wouldn't put a whole lot of stock in it, the Giants can be trying to fool Cleveland into taking somebody besides Darnold and will try every trick in the book, to get them to pass on Darnold!!!

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10 hours ago, StLunatic88 said:

I dont think it would for a couple of reasons;

  • it is more of a saving face trade for the Browns than anything else
  • Trubisky was thought, at the time, to be the "only Franchise QB Prospect" where as we have accepted 4+ of them in this draft
  • The Browns' Josh Allen love has been out of the bag

Sorry, but just wishful thinking on the part of a Giant's fan.

The only way Cleveland does not draft Darnold is if their owner steps in and insists their GM drafts Allen. He did it with Manziel, so it is not out of the question here, Haslam is after all, the worst owner maybe in pro sports!!!

If it is left to the GM to decide, Cleveland will draft Darnold.

 

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1 hour ago, onejayhawk said:

The odd man in all this is John Elway. Which QB would he like to own? I am currently going  with trading to #2 for Rosen, but #4 and Allen is also plausible.

J

I genuinely don't think Denver are major players in the QB market, I think they're happy to roll with Keenum and Lynch and try and patch the holes they have elsewhere. 

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5 hours ago, goldfishwars said:

I genuinely don't think Denver are major players in the QB market, I think they're happy to roll with Keenum and Lynch and try and patch the holes they have elsewhere. 

I think Nelson and Denver are a match made in heaven. 

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9 hours ago, Iamcanadian said:

I tend to agree, IMO, a team should always attempt to stay in the top 5 if possible or at least the top 10 when trading back from a high pick, places where game changers are found and really successful teams want game changers not just another starter or 2. You finish last or close to it, to get the stars of tomorrow and trading out usually leads to disaster. Cleveland has tried it twice and look what it got them!!!

As for the rumours and who visited and who didn't, I wouldn't put a whole lot of stock in it, the Giants can be trying to fool Cleveland into taking somebody besides Darnold and will try every trick in the book, to get them to pass on Darnold!!!

I don't think even the Browns are stupid enough to let another team influence who they take with the #1 pick.  They'll take who they believe is the best QB in the draft. 

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9 hours ago, goldfishwars said:

I genuinely don't think Denver are major players in the QB market, I think they're happy to roll with Keenum and Lynch and try and patch the holes they have elsewhere. 

Keenum has the luxury of playing in a dome last year and playing outside in Denver is a whole different story. I could easily see them trade up one spot with Cleveland to get another option, should Keenum struggle. It likely only will cost them an extra 3rd, a cheap price to pay for a decade of security!

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3 hours ago, Gmen said:

I don't think even the Browns are stupid enough to let another team influence who they take with the #1 pick.  They'll take who they believe is the best QB in the draft. 

We are talking about an idiot as their owner, he is quite capable of being influenced by tricks and he has in the past, ordered his GM to draft Manziel over protests.

Hopefully he has learned his lesson, but he did attend Allen's Pro Day, an extremely unusual action by an owner and I could see him falling in love with Allen's arm and doing something crazy, do not count it out!!! 

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16 hours ago, goldfishwars said:

I genuinely don't think Denver are major players in the QB market, I think they're happy to roll with Keenum and Lynch and try and patch the holes they have elsewhere. 

Your answer to my question is Keenum, which is fair. That said, I have to wonder if he sees himself in Josh Allen. Of course,  it could also be Lamar Jackson.

J

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8 hours ago, Iamcanadian said:

Keenum has the luxury of playing in a dome last year and playing outside in Denver is a whole different story. I could easily see them trade up one spot with Cleveland to get another option, should Keenum struggle. It likely only will cost them an extra 3rd, a cheap price to pay for a decade of security!

As a Vikings fan, banking on Keenum as your QB would be concerning. A lot of his "best" plays were scrambling and just kind of chucking the ball up. He was also throwing to 2 guys that were great at getting separation and making contested catches. The plays that he found a lot of success on will be extremely hard to sustain going forward. I hope I'm wrong because he is a great guy and a ton of fun to watch. However, with their defense and Keenum (he is definitely and upgrade for them from last year), I highly doubt they are picking as high as 5 again next year. They need to go get their guy. I think a trade with the Giants makes a ton of sense if the Giants don't want a QB.

Also, I agree that it would be tremendously stupid for the Giants to stay put if they aren't taking a QB. Don't take a RB at 2 when you don't have a long term answer at QB and you don't have much on the line to help a RB or your current QB.

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On 4/13/2018 at 1:52 PM, StLunatic88 said:

I dont think it would for a couple of reasons;

  • it is more of a saving face trade for the Browns than anything else
  • Trubisky was thought, at the time, to be the "only Franchise QB Prospect" where as we have accepted 4+ of them in this draft
  • The Browns' Josh Allen love has been out of the bag

I still dont quite understand why he was seen as such then. I feel like the Giants won't move up 1 spot for Darnold though. IF Cleveland takes Darnold you might see a trade but its not like Sam will say he won't play there like Eli did

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On April 14, 2018 at 12:38 AM, goldfishwars said:

I genuinely don't think Denver are major players in the QB market, I think they're happy to roll with Keenum and Lynch and try and patch the holes they have elsewhere. 

What makes you say that? Everything we know now points to them being extraordinarily interested in the QBs; they seem particularly interested in Mayfield, interestingly enough. 

They, alongside the Jets, are the two teams displaying the most interest and using the most resources on the 4 top QBs. The Jets and Broncos have not really scouted any other position in the first round besides QB. 

There are a couple anomalies; Jets had 15-minute combine interview with Minkah Fitzpatrick; Broncos had 15-minute combine interview with Saquon Barkley; Broncos hosted Vita Vea for top-30 visit. Barkley is a player projected near their pick, but the team has not had any contact with him since.

Those are the only examples though. Denver has met with Mayfield/Allen/Darnold/Rosen several times. They met with each during the combine, they sent representatives to each pro day; John Elway personally attended them as well as having the most representatives at Mayfield's and Allen's pro days. Denver has also hosted each QB for a top-30 private session either in state or at the player's home save for Mayfield. All of these visits are two day visits, using up two allotted visits each, while the one non-QB first rounder they invited(Vea) was a single day. Lastly they spent time with Allen and Mayfield at the senior bowl, specifically requesting Mayfield on their team.

Mayfield will be flying into Denver on Monday morning, staying until Tuesday afternoon. The 16th and 17th, also known as the Broncos' first two days of OTAs. Interesting choice of dates. Even if it means nothing, Denver has clearly spent the most time and resources on Baker.

Also, you may be thinking something along the lines of a smokescreen. Not so. Elway has shown throughout his tenure as GM that he consistent drafts players that he displays heavy interest in, particularly in the first couple rounds. Almost every player drafted in those rounds(even more so with offensive players) since Elway took over had been brought in for a visit and was given heavy interest leading up to the draft, much like these QBs this year.

2017 
Garrett Bolles   --- combine interview, private workout, pro day
Demarcus Walker --- No displayed interest, expected 1st rounder fell to 2nd.

2016
Paxton Lynch --- Combine interview, private workout, pro day 
Adam Gotsis --- pro day

2015
Shane Ray --- No displayed interest, projected top 12 pick before pot arrest caused him to fall. Broncos trade up, history.
Ty Sambrailo --- Combine, private workout, pro day, local schools pro day

2014
Bradley Roby --- No displayed interest
Cody Latimer --- pro day

2013
Sylvester Williams --- no displayed interest
Montee Ball --- private workout, pro day

2012
Derek Wolfe --- no displayed interest
Brock Osweiler --- private workout, pro day

2011(the last time Denver picked top 10; they worked out 11 players this year, all OL/DL/QB/CB)
Von Miller --- combine, pro day, private workout
Rahim Moore --- no displayed interest 


I could have extended the list; there are many 3rd-7th round picks that they displayed heavy interest in and then took.

The point is, Elway is not Shanahan, he is not a man for smokescreens. He drafts who he is interested in, and when it comes to the 2018 draft.. It is clear where his interest lies.

It would be a monumental surprise if Denver doesn't select a QB. Based on all the info we have now, and what I know, I predict a draft day trade with the Giants and Baker Mayfield being the selection. I mean, watch them play; he is the most similar to Elway, even if he is 2" shorter than him; their throwing motion and release on the move are so similar, it's in the feet.

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On 4/13/2018 at 9:50 PM, onejayhawk said:

The odd man in all this is John Elway. Which QB would he like to own? I am currently going  with trading to #2 for Rosen, but #4 and Allen is also plausible.

J

I’m calling it now they’re going up to 2

Giants will make sure Browns don’t draft Allen at 1 because they’d draft Darnold if he’s there

when he’s not there’s they’ll trade down with Denver and guarantee themselves Barkley because Browns won’t draft him at four

so draft goes 

Darnold

Rosen to the Broncos

Mayfield

Chubb

Barkley to the Giants 

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27 minutes ago, brownie man said:

I’m calling it now they’re going up to 2

Giants will make sure Browns don’t draft Allen at 1 because they’d draft Darnold if he’s there

when he’s not there’s they’ll trade down with Denver and guarantee themselves Barkley because Browns won’t draft him at four

so draft goes 

Darnold

Rosen to the Broncos

Mayfield

Chubb

Barkley to the Giants 

I agree with this scenario. The Giants would guarantee themselves either one of Barkley or Chubb, or their choice if Cleveland trades with Buffalo.

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