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Broncos QB Battle - Siemian it is


AnAngryAmerican

Who Wins the QB Battle?  

24 members have voted

  1. 1. Who Wins the QB Battle?

    • Trevor Siemian
      16
    • Paxton Lynch
      8


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15 hours ago, thebestever6 said:

At the time the 2016 crop didn't look bad with a qb guru like andy reid or jerry jones wanting lynch. 

I really wanna trade up for one I dont wanna have to bank on a steal or 3rd qb in a draft class which is all elway has done.

Lets go for broke to land our man Elway is great at late round picks.

This is what I want as well. We have an extra 3rd, 4th, and 5th round pick(s) that we can package in a trade if we need to. If we can get a franchise QB, who cares about the cost. If Pat Mahomes pans out for KC, do you really think they're going to be worried about the 1st rounder they traded to get him?

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I don't understand the hate for Brock that exists in some quarters in Broncos Country.

Are fans mad because he didn't re-sign here after the Super Bowl, Elway offered him more than he was worth but Houston offered him even more than that. To make a relative comparison, if someone offered you $20,000 a year more to do your job would not take the offer? He made what he thought was the best decision at the time. Guys like Chris Harris and Derek Wolfe taking hometown discounts to stay here are the exception, not the norm.  He didn't bash the team or throw management under the bus or call Elway or anyone in the front office unprofessional on his way out the door. He didn't go after Kubiak or any of the coaches or his teammates. 

Was he mad that he got benched in the 2nd half the week 17 San Diego game? Yeah and I don't blame him, he's a competitor and as a lot of us said at the time and since, a lot of those turnovers weren't his fault. Frankly, I'd be more concerned if he wasn't upset about being benched. 

Yesterday I was able to catch a little bit of his press conference (really it more of a post-practice gaggle) but he really handled himself well. He called yesterday one of the three or four or five best days of his life. He called the Broncos a great organization, said the fan base is the best the league, said he and wife love Denver and Colorado and couldn't be happier to be making their home here. He praised Elway, Ellis and the Bowlen Family. He said the first thing to told Trevor was that it was his (Trevor's) team, he's (again Trevor) is the starter and he (Brock) is the backup and that he would do anything he could to help Trevor prepare each week and win us football games. 

As everyone should know, we don't win Super Bowl 50 without Brock playing the way he did in those games that Peyton was out. Those wins in Cincy and over New England in the snow were huge and he played a big part in both. Kubiak played it perfectly bringing Peyton back when he did but Peyton's brain and presence in the huddle were more important that anything he did on the actual field of play. Even Peyton himself said, "I don't play defense and I can't take too much credit for a good hand-off." Do people think we go better than 5-2 in those seven games if Trevor, then a true rookie with zero game experience, was in there instead of Brock or if a broken down Peyton was playing?

Truthfully, the way that certain elements have been wrecking Brock over the last 48 hours speaks awfully poorly to said portions of the local media and Broncos fan base. 

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1 hour ago, BroncoSojia said:

This is what I want as well. We have an extra 3rd, 4th, and 5th round pick(s) that we can package in a trade if we need to. If we can get a franchise QB, who cares about the cost. If Pat Mahomes pans out for KC, do you really think they're going to be worried about the 1st rounder they traded to get him?

The issue is that an extra 3rd, 4th and 5th are peanuts compared to another 1st round pick.    And more importantly, there are 4-5 teams who are much worse than we are who are thinking the same thing - SF, CLE, BUF, NYJ are easily going to be awful and looking hard at QB.  Now, one of them can get Cousins, so that takes 1 guy out of play.  But the 3 other teams aren't going to look to give up spots to let someone else get a QB...and in the case of CLE and BUF, they have MASSIVE draft capital to move up if they aren't in a top 5 spot - BUF has 2 1st,  2 2nds and 2 3rds.   CLE has 2 1sts, 3 2nds and 3 3rds.  We are outgunned, plain and simple.  Anything we can offer they can blow out of the water. 

Now, if we want to get someone falling out of the top 10, depending on where we pick, that's in play - but it still likely costs us way more than those picks.    We can forget about the top 10-type talents though - @BroncoBruin's scenario where a good talent falls later because this QB has insane depth is our only realistic option - it's just too soon to know if this class is in that scenario yet.  It's not just what we're willing to pay - it's what others are, and we are hopelessly outgunned for one of the elite guys.    And frankly, given the price required, that may not be such a bad thing.    Remember, if we don't move up for Lynch, we could easily have Chris Jones and a Ali Marpet instead.   Now, if a guy is truly a franchise QB, that's a fair price to pay - but over-reaching for mediocre talents, I've been down on for years...and if we can't get an elite talent, no thanks on the mediocre ones.  That's where wasted picks and destroyed franchise futures live.

It may not work out but our best shot at a 2018 option is Siemian to progress or a mid tier FA like Taylor is available.   Too soon to cut bait on Lynch but can't rely on that or Kelly being able to compete yet.  

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Here are some more quotes from Brock yesterday, courtesy of MHR. 

Quote

“I’d come back here to be the water boy,” Osweiler said Monday morning at Dove Valley. “I was getting fitted for cleats today, and they asked me what I wanted, and I said, ‘I don’t care. Just give me something. I’ll go out there in bare feet.’”

Quote

“There were some other offers, but I told my agency, ‘I love what you guys do, but if there’s an offer from Denver, I don’t care if it’s a dollar, that’s where we’re going.’”

Quote

“My role is to be the backup of this team and that’s what it should be. Trevor has earned the right to be the starter,” Osweiler said. “This is Trevor’s football team. I completely understand that. ...I’m just here to help him prepare and win football games.”

Quote

Osweiler insists he certainly has “no hard feelings” toward Denver, noting he had thanked the coaches and Elway multiple times today for bringing him back.

Quote

“I’ve never had anything but love and appreciation for this city and this organization,” he said. “I just hope in time the fans who feel that way let me earn back their trust and get a great relationship again.”

Quote

“I do see myself as a starter in the NFL,” he said. “I feel like I proved that in 2015. However, this is Trevor Siemian’s team. And right now my job is to be the backup and do it to best of ability – get the scout team running, get our defense ready – and I’m going to embrace that role because I’m so happy to be back here. There’s no better place in the NFL.”

I'm sure there is a degree of playing the PR game and brown-nosing a little bit here but what's not to like about any of that? In listening to his comments on the radio, he sure sounded genuine. 

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I had a look at QBs taken in the draft since 2010 -

Between 2010-2015 a total of 68 QBS have been drafted - this is a breakdown by round of how many are starters or back-ups

1st round - 16 drafted - 7 Starters - 1 back-up (of the 7 - 4 were no.1 picks, 1 no.2 and 1 no.3 - and a no.8 pick Tannehill is out for the season)

2nd round - 7 drafted - 2 starters - 3 back-ups

3rd round - 8 drafted - 2 starters - 5 back-ups

4th round - 8 drafted - 2 starters - 1 back-up

5th round - 8 drafted - 0 starters - 3 back-ups

6th round - 11 drafted - 1 starter - 0 back-ups

7th round - 10 drafted - 1 starter - 0 back-ups

The reality is that unless you get the first or second pick you are in a crap-shoot (and there are some notable busts there as well) - the no.3 pick who is a starter is Bortles and I don't think he would be starting anywhere else except Jacksonville.

Notable first rounders who are now out of a job

Manziel

Griffin

Weeden

Locker

Ponder

Tebow

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Yeah, I don't understand how people can have a personal issue with Brock. If anything the fan base should love him. We missed the playoffs with a qb that we didn't have to pay instead of missing the playoffs with a QB that was making 12-15m. 

Brock sucks, though. Don't get your hopes up. That guy shouldn't have a job in the NFL. 

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4 hours ago, AnAngryAmerican said:

I don't understand the hate for Brock that exists in some quarters in Broncos Country.

Are fans mad because he didn't re-sign here after the Super Bowl, Elway offered him more than he was worth but Houston offered him even more than that. To make a relative comparison, if someone offered you $20,000 a year more to do your job would not take the offer? He made what he thought was the best decision at the time. Guys like Chris Harris and Derek Wolfe taking hometown discounts to stay here are the exception, not the norm.  He didn't bash the team or throw management under the bus or call Elway or anyone in the front office unprofessional on his way out the door. He didn't go after Kubiak or any of the coaches or his teammates. 

Was he mad that he got benched in the 2nd half the week 17 San Diego game? Yeah and I don't blame him, he's a competitor and as a lot of us said at the time and since, a lot of those turnovers weren't his fault. Frankly, I'd be more concerned if he wasn't upset about being benched. 

Yesterday I was able to catch a little bit of his press conference (really it more of a post-practice gaggle) but he really handled himself well. He called yesterday one of the three or four or five best days of his life. He called the Broncos a great organization, said the fan base is the best the league, said he and wife love Denver and Colorado and couldn't be happier to be making their home here. He praised Elway, Ellis and the Bowlen Family. He said the first thing to told Trevor was that it was his (Trevor's) team, he's (again Trevor) is the starter and he (Brock) is the backup and that he would do anything he could to help Trevor prepare each week and win us football games. 

As everyone should know, we don't win Super Bowl 50 without Brock playing the way he did in those games that Peyton was out. Those wins in Cincy and over New England in the snow were huge and he played a big part in both. Kubiak played it perfectly bringing Peyton back when he did but Peyton's brain and presence in the huddle were more important that anything he did on the actual field of play. Even Peyton himself said, "I don't play defense and I can't take too much credit for a good hand-off." Do people think we go better than 5-2 in those seven games if Trevor, then a true rookie with zero game experience, was in there instead of Brock or if a broken down Peyton was playing?

Truthfully, the way that certain elements have been wrecking Brock over the last 48 hours speaks awfully poorly to said portions of the local media and Broncos fan base. 

Is everyone here forgetting how the players felt after he abandoned ship?  Everyone was let down especially the players.  We'll have to see if he can get any semblance of what he had but he's been through some tough, sad times and this ship is Siemien's to steer - I just hope Sims stays healthy!   

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30 minutes ago, anewdawn said:

Is everyone here forgetting how the players felt after he abandoned ship?  Everyone was let down especially the players.  We'll have to see if he can get any semblance of what he had but he's been through some tough, sad times and this ship is Siemien's to steer - I just hope Sims stays healthy!   

Brock got 4/72 and 36M guaranteed.  I guarantee you not a single player blamed him for leaving.   The public posts were mostly reactionary and disbelief.    The next day most non-elite players were probably going "well good for him - hope I can sniff that when it's my time". 

When ppl point to the fact Den cut Ward that it's a business first no one knows that more than the players.  But the principle cuts both ways.  We can't ever blame a player for taking the $ when it's that much of a difference.  No player would for sure.  Elway could say that Oz was giving up the best chance to succeed for him last year - he never could argue it wasn't the best financial decision for Os.  

FTR IMO Brock isn't the answer beyond a min wage backup long term.  But I don't hold anything from 2016 against him.  Frankly he & HOU did us a huuuuge favor.  

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Ya, there should be zero bad blood between the fanbase and Brock. He got paid more by another team, that's how this sport, and world, work. And by doing so he TOTALLY bailed us out because he is a backup level QB at best. And even then, I have issues even naming him a top 16 backup QB. I have issues with Brock because I think Elway still may have a odd, unexplainable love for him and I am scared he benches the better, more cerebral QB in Trevor for another one of his 6'7 projects because 'measurable duh'

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5 minutes ago, BroncosFan2010 said:

Ya, there should be zero bad blood between the fanbase and Brock. He got paid more by another team, that's how this sport, and world, work. And by doing so he TOTALLY bailed us out because he is a backup level QB at best. And even then, I have issues even naming him a top 16 backup QB. I have issues with Brock because I think Elway still may have a odd, unexplainable love for him and I am scared he benches the better, more cerebral QB in Trevor for another one of his 6'7 projects because 'measurable duh'

it's frustrating seeing our team operate with pure nepotism when they tell us they want to win, but that's how the NFL works. 

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16 minutes ago, BroncosFan2010 said:

Ya, there should be zero bad blood between the fanbase and Brock. He got paid more by another team, that's how this sport, and world, work. And by doing so he TOTALLY bailed us out because he is a backup level QB at best. And even then, I have issues even naming him a top 16 backup QB. I have issues with Brock because I think Elway still may have a odd, unexplainable love for him and I am scared he benches the better, more cerebral QB in Trevor for another one of his 6'7 projects because 'measurable duh'

The guy was brought in on a vet minimum deal solely on the fact that he's familiar with Mike McCoy's system. We wouldn't have looked at him if Lynch doesn't get hurt in the 3rd preseason game. He's here to be a backup and if/when Lynch comes back, he's probably going to be cut. 

People are making too much of a big deal out of this whole situation.

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45 minutes ago, BroncoSojia said:

The guy was brought in on a vet minimum deal solely on the fact that he's familiar with Mike McCoy's system. We wouldn't have looked at him if Lynch doesn't get hurt in the 3rd preseason game. He's here to be a backup and if/when Lynch comes back, he's probably going to be cut. 

People are making too much of a big deal out of this whole situation.

The money was irrelevant - Cleveland are picking up the tab - it would have been daft for any team to pay him more than the vet minimum.

However, I would not be surprised if Osweiler is kept for the season - particularly if he shows any kind of understanding and ability with the offence. Lynch sucks at the moment - he has gone backwards. Osweiler has similar physical traits as Lynch but seems to have more between the ears - while not coming close to Siemian.

As for Elway - given that Osweiler was in college with his son, it wouldn't be surprising if Elway had a little more time for Os than other GMs might. 

Besides - I don't think anyone is 'making too much of a big deal' out of anything. Osweiler is just another QB on the roster and if he proves to be better than what is here already he is likely to be kept around.

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1 minute ago, jolly red giant said:

The money was irrelevant - Cleveland are picking up the tab - it would have been daft for any team to pay him more than the vet minimum.

However, I would not be surprised if Osweiler is kept for the season - particularly if he shows any kind of understanding and ability with the offence. Lynch sucks at the moment - he has gone backwards. Osweiler has similar physical traits as Lynch but seems to have more between the ears - while not coming close to Siemian.

As for Elway - given that Osweiler was in college with his son, it wouldn't be surprising if Elway had a little more time for Os than other GMs might. 

Besides - I don't think anyone is 'making too much of a big deal' out of anything. Osweiler is just another QB on the roster and if he proves to be better than what is here already he is likely to be kept around.

If we had waited 1 week, Os' salary wouldn't have been guaranteed for the entire season, would have been just week-to-week.  By signing him this week, we guaranteed his salary in full for the entire year.  So yeah, seems like Os is definitely staying season-long by that move alone.

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5 minutes ago, Broncofan said:

If we had waited 1 week, Os' salary wouldn't have been guaranteed for the entire season, would have been just week-to-week.  By signing him this week, we guaranteed his salary in full for the entire year.  So yeah, seems like Os is definitely staying season-long by that move alone.

It's not like he didn't have options, (with Kaepernick out there that is sad) which is why we probably rushed to sign him and didn't wait. And it's not like cutting someone on a vet min salary is going to affect our cap.

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