Cheese Curds: Green Bay Packers Updates

[Krauser]

2 hours ago, whitehops said:

so i didn't really look at running backs much before this draft but the PFF guys kept saying the packers added a "plodding" running back. they had to be referencing AJ Dillon's lack of pass catching ability, right?

AJ Dillon ran a 4.53 at 247 pounds. he's not quite as tall as derrick henry but otherwise compares very similarly to him. elite explosion scores, elite "speed score" (speed to weight ratio, essentially) and overall good testing besides the agility stuff. 

I think “plodding” refers to his lack of agility. Dillon is fast, but he’s not nimble. He’s also big and strong, which may be a problem for the Vikings with their undersized CBs — the big Seahawks back killed them a couple of years ago.

[Krauser]

No problem, I'm sure it'll be fine.

 

[RpMc]

Whenever Favre is around, you know it’s #schism time. 

[VikeManDan]

Still amazes me how many people spell his name wrong.

[SemperFeist]

2 hours ago, VikeManDan said:

Still amazes me how many people spell his name wrong.

Not as amazed that a 50 year old man can’t pronounce his correctly. 

[vikes635]

On 4/24/2020 at 10:46 PM, vike daddy said:

Matt Schneidman✔@mattschneidman

Josiah Deguara was @dpbrugler's No. 12 TE, forecasted as a sixth-round pick. The Packers make him the third TE taken in the draft. And for the second year in a row, Green Bay takes a TE in the third round.

they will probably use him as a H-Back

[swede700]

17 hours ago, VikeManDan said:

Still amazes me how many people spell his name wrong.

As was pointed out by some other writer yesterday, it amazes me still that the entire Packers draft seemed to be geared towards preparing for the Jordan Love era at QB, not to help Aaron Rodgers now.    

[CWood21]

2 hours ago, swede700 said:

As was pointed out by some other writer yesterday, it amazes me still that the entire Packers draft seemed to be geared towards preparing for the Jordan Love era at QB, not to help Aaron Rodgers now.    

How do you figure?  By the time that Love is projected to be the starting QB (2022), AJ DIllon and Josiah Degaura will be halfway through their rookie contracts.  And especially with regards to Dillon, there's a serious question about how much and how long you want to pay a RB on a second contract.  They were drafted for this year as much as they were for the future.  The notion otherwise is a fool's errand.  This was about adjusting to LaFleur's vision of the offense.  They want to be a run-based, play action offense with multiple looks.

[swede700]

1 minute ago, CWood21 said:

How do you figure?  By the time that Love is projected to be the starting QB (2022), AJ DIllon and Josiah Degaura will be halfway through their rookie contracts.  And especially with regards to Dillon, there's a serious question about how much and how long you want to pay a RB on a second contract.  They were drafted for this year as much as they were for the future.  The notion otherwise is a fool's errand.  This was about adjusting to LaFleur's vision of the offense.  They want to be a run-based, play action offense with multiple looks.

We'll have to see...I see where the writer was going though.  Maybe, it'll all work out, but it was a very odd plan, at the very least.  But, I guess you'll have to have a strong running game, considering how he only has 1 guy to throw to that he can count on.

[CWood21]

Just now, swede700 said:

We'll have to see...I see where the writer was going though.  Maybe, it'll all work out, but it was a very odd plan, at the very least.  But, I guess you'll have to have a strong running game, considering how he only has 1 guy to throw to that he can count on.

It's literally an asinine concept.  Teams don't draft for the future with early picks.  When was the last time a non-QB didn't play much their first two years, and put together a significant career moving forward?  They're few and far between.  They both have roles in the offense that LaFleur envisions.

[Heimdallr]

2 minutes ago, CWood21 said:

It's literally an asinine concept.  Teams don't draft for the future with early picks.  When was the last time a non-QB didn't play much their first two years, and put together a significant career moving forward?  They're few and far between.  They both have roles in the offense that LaFleur envisions.

I think the implication is that they are "drafting for the future" by drafting players that fit the scheme they want moving forward, not the players that will have the biggest immediate impact and will help win a SB in the next year or two with Rodgers.

[Leader]

12 minutes ago, CWood21 said:

It's literally an asinine concept.  Teams don't draft for the future with early picks.  When was the last time a non-QB didn't play much their first two years, and put together a significant career moving forward?  They're few and far between.  They both have roles in the offense that LaFleur envisions.

I agree with this. I see AJD and JD being on the field a good amount of time.
Conceptually....including the draft....its necessary to complete the picture / goal.

[Krauser]

1 hour ago, CWood21 said:

This was about adjusting to LaFleur's vision of the offense.  They want to be a run-based, play action offense with multiple looks.

Right, but the Shanahan/Kubiak scheme that Lafleur is using is designed to make the most of a pretty-good-but-not-great QB: Garoppolo, Cousins, Ryan, and Goff and the like have excelled in it. Those guys are accurate, not especially creative and willing to run the plays as called.

Rodgers at his best has been one of the best QBs of all time, but his strengths as a player are more his arm talent, control of the offense, pocket movement and ability to improvise later in the play. The scheme is a poor fit for him, or at least it will only work if he's willing to stay on schedule, and curb some of the things that make him great. 

I don't know much about Jordan Love but he seems to have a much better chance to become a competent starting QB than an elite one.

So the Packers drafting to reinforce their run-first scheme is essentially an admission that the offense will not be centered on Rodgers' elite talents, but on the sorts of plays that any pretty good QB can make. And that suggests GB will move on from Rodgers soon, in a year or two if Love develops.

[CWood21]

7 minutes ago, Krauser said:

Right, but the Shanahan/Kubiak scheme that Lafleur is using is designed to make the most of a pretty-good-but-not-great QB: Garoppolo, Cousins, Ryan, and Goff and the like have excelled in it. Those guys are accurate, not especially creative and willing to run the plays as called.

Rodgers at his best has been one of the best QBs of all time, but his strengths as a player are more his arm talent, control of the offense, pocket movement and ability to improvise later in the play. The scheme is a poor fit for him, or at least it will only work if he's willing to stay on schedule, and curb some of the things that make him great. 

I don't know much about Jordan Love but he seems to have a much better chance to become a competent starting QB than an elite one.

So the Packers drafting to reinforce their run-first scheme is essentially an admission that the offense will not be centered on Rodgers' elite talents, but on the sorts of plays that any pretty good QB can make. And that suggests GB will move on from Rodgers soon, in a year or two if Love develops.

But imagine having a QB who can run an offense to perfection.  We're talking about something akin to what the Packers had in the McCarthy/Rodgers peak era.  Rodgers hasn't quite been the same the last couple of years.  If you want to blame it on Barr breaking him, so be it.  But Rodgers has left throws on the field, and it's been well documented.  There's till more arm talent there than the majority of the QBs in the NFL, but he's clearly lost a bit.

Look at what the Saints have done the last couple of years.  In Brees' first 11 seasons in New Orleans, he was averaging 632 passing attempts per season, and the Saints were 101-73 (.581 winning percentage) over that period.  In the last 3 seasons, Brees has averaged 468 passing attempts and the Saints have gone 32-10 (.762 winning percentage).  If you extrapolate last season over 16 games, Brees' average passing attempts goes up to 525.  So...the Saints are actually winning at a higher clip with Brees throwing less?  They're committing to the run significantly more.  The Saints were considerably more balanced than they have been in previous years.  Brees' ANY/A the last 3 seasons have been 8.3+.  Rodgers over the last 3 years has been 8.1 or less the last 3 years.

[swede700]

37 minutes ago, CWood21 said:

But imagine having a QB who can run an offense to perfection.  We're talking about something akin to what the Packers had in the McCarthy/Rodgers peak era.  Rodgers hasn't quite been the same the last couple of years.  If you want to blame it on Barr breaking him, so be it.  But Rodgers has left throws on the field, and it's been well documented.  There's till more arm talent there than the majority of the QBs in the NFL, but he's clearly lost a bit.

Look at what the Saints have done the last couple of years.  In Brees' first 11 seasons in New Orleans, he was averaging 632 passing attempts per season, and the Saints were 101-73 (.581 winning percentage) over that period.  In the last 3 seasons, Brees has averaged 468 passing attempts and the Saints have gone 32-10 (.762 winning percentage).  If you extrapolate last season over 16 games, Brees' average passing attempts goes up to 525.  So...the Saints are actually winning at a higher clip with Brees throwing less?  They're committing to the run significantly more.  The Saints were considerably more balanced than they have been in previous years.  Brees' ANY/A the last 3 seasons have been 8.3+.  Rodgers over the last 3 years has been 8.1 or less the last 3 years.

But, the Packers draft choices don't make them a more balanced offense now. I suppose if you're expecting Jones to turn into more of a Kamara-style RB this season, maybe it will (with Dillon being the Ingram/Murray), and Jones has certainly made some strides in that direction to be a more dynamic runner/receiver.  But, we don't have the evidence yet.   And in the end, they still need the receivers to play roles like Ginn and Smith do (well and the TE, but we already know Rodgers doesn't use them)...and right now, there isn't a single one of them proven to play those roles to their Michael Thomas (in Adams)...and their draft didn't help in that regard.