Cheese Curds: Green Bay Packers Updates

[wcblack34]

1 hour ago, Uncle Buck said:

Are you trying to say that the Lions aren't the worst ran franchise in the league?  If they aren't the worst, they have to be very close to the bottom.

Jets say “hi.”

[swede700]

1 hour ago, wcblack34 said:

Jets say “hi.”

Apparently, everyone's forgotten about the Texans, who, a handful of years ago looked like they'd be on the cusp of greatness...only to completely obliterate the franchise in 2 years time through dysfunction and mismanagement on an organizational basis and look like they have absolutely no plan whatsoever.  The Jets, under their new GM, actually appear to have some plan...don't know if it'll actually work, but there's a plan, which started when they started selling off all their pieces around Darnold. 

[CWood21]

9 hours ago, swede700 said:

I don't have a high opinion of Goff, but I don't have a low opinion of him either.  I never thought he should have been drafted #1, and never should have gotten the contract he did, as I view him in a similar tier as Garropolo.  He's a 15-20 level QB at best. 

Goff was clearly the best QB available in 2016, even ahead of Carson Wentz.  There were concerns with him, but the only players I had graded in a tier above him were Joey Bosa, Laremy Tunsil, and Jalen Ramsey.  And given what they gave up to get to that pick, it had to be a QB there.  Definitely disagree about the Jimmy G comparison given the fact that Jimmy G was given that big contract based on his 5 games as a starter for the 49ers.  In those five games, Jimmy G had a high completion percentage but a mediocre INT%, which has largely been his issue in his career.  Goff just got worse after that huge contract extension.

10 hours ago, swede700 said:

But, the new GM in Detroit knew what he had in Goff since he was with the Rams, so he's a far safer option than any they could get at #7.   I bet he also thinks that he just needs someone he can count on while he builds the rest of the team around him.

And why would the Rams throw him into the trade?  I imagine having to compete with all the other teams who were looking to peddle their QBs as well would have diluted the value that they could have gotten in return, so trade him to someone you know, because you know you'll get fair value.  

But he passed on both Justin Fields AND Mac Jones in favor of Jared Goff.  So either he's not the toxic contract that he was or they didn't like Fields/Jones.  Which one do you think is more likely?

[Cearbhall]

7 hours ago, CWood21 said:

But he passed on both Justin Fields AND Mac Jones in favor of Jared Goff.  So either he's not the toxic contract that he was or they didn't like Fields/Jones.  Which one do you think is more likely?

Way more likely they are not high on Fields and Jones. It is already clear that Goff's contract is a problem. The Rams had to give up quite a bit to unload that contract. It isn't quite as bad for Detroit since they don't have to deal with the prorated bonus amounts in addition to the salary.

[wcblack34]

8 hours ago, CWood21 said:

Goff was clearly the best QB available in 2016, even ahead of Carson Wentz.  There were concerns with him, but the only players I had graded in a tier above him were Joey Bosa, Laremy Tunsil, and Jalen Ramsey.  And given what they gave up to get to that pick, it had to be a QB there.  Definitely disagree about the Jimmy G comparison given the fact that Jimmy G was given that big contract based on his 5 games as a starter for the 49ers.  In those five games, Jimmy G had a high completion percentage but a mediocre INT%, which has largely been his issue in his career.  Goff just got worse after that huge contract extension.

But he passed on both Justin Fields AND Mac Jones in favor of Jared Goff.  So either he's not the toxic contract that he was or they didn't like Fields/Jones.  Which one do you think is more likely?

Judging by the reaction in the Lions draft room, and the fact that they tried to trade up to #4, they had Sewell ranked as the top player in the draft; likely by a fair margin. Goff is a bit like a Kirk Cousins: put a great team around him and he can get you somewhere (ymmv on how far he can get you). Plus, if Goff doesn't work, they got additional ammo for a QB next year. Detroit had the room to take the contract and get additional draft ammo. I think it's more likely they didn't like Fields and Jones. 

I see Goff's contract as more toxic to the Rams than the Lions. They handed out way too many top-of-the-market contracts and those bills will be coming due shortly. With the cap uncertainty, they're probably going to be in cap hell the next couple of years. 

[swede700]

9 hours ago, CWood21 said:

Goff was clearly the best QB available in 2016, even ahead of Carson Wentz.  There were concerns with him, but the only players I had graded in a tier above him were Joey Bosa, Laremy Tunsil, and Jalen Ramsey.  And given what they gave up to get to that pick, it had to be a QB there.  Definitely disagree about the Jimmy G comparison given the fact that Jimmy G was given that big contract based on his 5 games as a starter for the 49ers.  In those five games, Jimmy G had a high completion percentage but a mediocre INT%, which has largely been his issue in his career.  Goff just got worse after that huge contract extension.

But he passed on both Justin Fields AND Mac Jones in favor of Jared Goff.  So either he's not the toxic contract that he was or they didn't like Fields/Jones.  Which one do you think is more likely?

To me, Goff and Jimmy G are the same.  I've never been impressed with either one, even before Goff's extension.  In fact, while not all stylistically the same, I put Wentz in the same category.  They are all 3rd-4th tier QBs...in the 15-20 range.  People tell me that Wentz was good and just got bad...every time I've seen him, I have no idea what they're looking at.  The same goes for Goff and Jimmy G.

I also understand why they would have passed on both Fields and Jones.  Whether they like it or not and not necessarily the main factor here, Ohio State and Alabama don't exactly have stellar track records of developing NFL QBs, and it also appeared that, in a lot of people's evaluations, they were the 4th and 5th QBs on the board, and just likely weren't Detroit's cup of tea.  

[Guest]

3 hours ago, swede700 said:

To me, Goff and Jimmy G are the same.  I've never been impressed with either one, even before Goff's extension.  In fact, while not all stylistically the same, I put Wentz in the same category.  They are all 3rd-4th tier QBs...in the 15-20 range.  People tell me that Wentz was good and just got bad...every time I've seen him, I have no idea what they're looking at.  The same goes for Goff and Jimmy G.

I also understand why they would have passed on both Fields and Jones.  Whether they like it or not and not necessarily the main factor here, Ohio State and Alabama don't exactly have stellar track records of developing NFL QBs, and it also appeared that, in a lot of people's evaluations, they were the 4th and 5th QBs on the board, and just likely weren't Detroit's cup of tea.  

Bart Starr, Joe Namath and Ken Stabler say hello!!

[swede700]

1 hour ago, Virginia Viking said:

Bart Starr, Joe Namath and Ken Stabler say hello!!

They actually showed up in big moments...can't say the same about them.  About the only thing that can be said is the Goff and Garroppolo actually played in the Super Bowl..and lost.  

[Guest]

13 minutes ago, swede700 said:

They actually showed up in big moments...can't say the same about them.  About the only thing that can be said is the Goff and Garroppolo actually played in the Super Bowl..and lost.  

It's really telling about the Ohio State program when Mike Tomczak, who wasn't even drafted I don't think, is this schools most successful product in the NFL at QB. In 1971, an Ohio State quarterback was taken in the 10th round (to play DB in the NFL) named Rex Kern.  He led the Buckeyes to an undefeated season and the National Championship in '68. This is the same draft class as Jim Plunkett, Archie Manning, Dan Pastorini, Lynn Dickey, Kenny Anderson and Joe Theisman.  The draft class of '83 tends to be thought of as the best class of QB's ever, mainly for Elway and Marino.  I think the class of '71 gives them competition.  Except for Rex Kern...who, drafted by the Colts and traded to the Bills, only last 3 seasons.  He was elected to the College Football Hall of Fame in 2007.

[swede700]

Tells me everything I need to know that Kerns is the only one I have no recollection of the name even.   I never watched Pastorini play (but did see him in several NFL Films videos).  All the others I did, but of course later in their careers.

Edited May 14, 2021 by swede700

[Guest]

1 minute ago, swede700 said:

Tells me everything I need to know that Kerns is the only one I have no recollection of the name even.   I never watched Pastorini play (but did see him in several NFL Films videos), but all the others I did, but of course later in their careers.

The best pure QB of the bunch was Kenny Anderson.  If the Bengals had defeated the Montana led 49'ers in '82 there would be no doubt about him being in the HOF.  He was as good a thrower of the ball as most HOF qb's.

[swede700]

I was more of a Boomer guy myself, but Kenny was way at the tail-end when I starting paying attention, so I'll take your word for it.  😂

[vike daddy]

On 5/14/2021 at 11:45 AM, Virginia Viking said:

...an Ohio State quarterback was taken in the 10th round (to play DB in the NFL) named Rex Kern.  He led the Buckeyes to an undefeated season and the National Championship in '68. 

Rex Kern, sigh...

i went to the Univ of Illinois (Go, Fighting Illini!) and we had awful, awful teams then. and of course had to play Ohio State, Michigan, Purdue, Wisconsin, etc every year. one year we went 0-11 and another year we went 1-10. one year the team MVP was the punter. Alas, i digress...

so we're playing the Kern led Buckeyes at home one sunny fall day and Ohio State has a 3rd and 1 at their 49 yard line. obviously, it's going to be quarterback sneak play, we were all ready for it. and it was just that.

and Kern ran 51 yards for a touchdown.

[Guest]

21 hours ago, vike daddy said:

Rex Kern, sigh...

i went to the Univ of Illinois (Go, Fighting Illini!) and we had awful, awful teams then. and of course had to play Ohio State, Michigan, Purdue, Wisconsin, etc every year. one year we went 0-11 and another year we went 1-10. one year the team MVP was the punter. Alas, i digress...

so we're playing the Kern led Buckeyes at home one sunny fall day and Ohio State has a 3rd and 1 at their 49 yard line. obviously, it's going to be quarterback sneak play, we were all ready for it. and it was just that.

and Kern ran 51 yards for a touchdown.

Sounds a lot like the defense of my high school team.  

[swede700]

1 hour ago, Virginia Viking said:

Sounds a lot like the defense of my high school team.  

Sounds like my HS football team period.  Only won 2 games in the 4 years I was there, both in my senior year...for whatever reason, the football coach thought it was illegal to pass the ball, averaging about 1 pass per game.