AnAngryAmerican Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 (edited) I put this in the draft thread but I'll post it here too. We're not going to be able to keep Shaq next year when he hits unrestricted free agency and, as much as I would hate to see him go, packing him and one of our day 3 picks to get another pick today would be a good move for us. What would be great would be if we can trade Shaq + pick for a earlier pick and draft Michael Gallup, just trade Ram for another. Edited April 27, 2018 by AnAngryAmerican Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AKRNA Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 38 minutes ago, Broncofan said: We just see Williams differently then. I love him but I love Jackson/Oliver, Goedert & Hernandez/Daniels just as much. Had them all go in top 30 and truthfully had them all jumbled together (Jackson highest FWIW - Landry even higher but he won’t be there). Those guys have all fallen. Given how the next 7 picks go we should get 1 of them (unless Elway reaches for skill position but that’s a different issue). All good. Stop! I've been specific that I used that as a hypothetical example. I don't care about Williams. He's not the point! Gee, you're going to drive me nuts. Once again, if a player you love, ANY PLAYER, is on top of your board and has already fallen, don't cross your fingers and wait for him to fall to your spot, go get him! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Epic Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 (edited) @AAA. If that's true, I'd move up for Hernandez or Guice. I agree that it will be offense today. Edited April 27, 2018 by Epic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
broncos_fan _from _uk Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 (edited) 58 minutes ago, Cutler06 said: Quality over quantity, we do need talent and to fill needs, not just camp bodies. Except there have been studies that have proven that trading down produces more starts and pro bowls than trading up. It's not a coincidence that the patriots, steelers, packers, and ravens have the most day 2 picks over the last 10 years and are constantly in contention. *EDIT* Just because it interests me: Other studies have shown that there is a direct correlation between draft position and value of the player selected (kind of a no sh-t study) but what was interesting is that the change after round 1 is not steep enough to ever make trading up worth it. Football perspectives showed that there is no consistency in team drafts from one year to the next, and 538 showed that on a per pick basis all GMs are essentially the same. What's that mean? Quantity over quality baby! In the long run you will build a better team by accumulating as many round 1-4 picks as possible Edited April 27, 2018 by broncos_fan _from _uk 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Broncofan Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 (edited) 20 minutes ago, AKRNA said: Stop! I've been specific that I used that as a hypothetical example. I don't care about Williams. He's not the point! Gee, you're going to drive me nuts. Once again, if a player you love, ANY PLAYER, is on top of your board and has already fallen, don't cross your fingers and wait for him to fall to your spot, go get him! But not if that one guy isn’t head and shoulders over 4-5 more who’ve fallen. That’s all I’ve been saying. Which UK repeated and you agreed with. Then the context of this situation matters. Listen I’m just as frustrated as you are - labeling my point as “just stand pat” was completely disingenuous or just off-base. I actually agree with your point if it’s one guy who’s fallen - I just don’t see that it applies to 2.40 with who’s left. It isn’t one guy above the rest who’s fallen here and.now. If it’s just been a theoretical statement all good we agree. I don’t think it applies here. That’s all I’ve been saying. Edited April 27, 2018 by Broncofan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Broncofan Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 (edited) 33 minutes ago, AnAngryAmerican said: I put this in the draft thread but I'll post it here too. We're not going to be able to keep Shaq next year when he hits unrestricted free agency and, as much as I would hate to see him to, packing him and one of our day 3 picks to get another pick today would be a good move for us. What would be great would be if we can trade Shaq + pick for a earlier pick and draft Michael Gallup, just trade Ram for another. 12 minutes ago, Epic said: @AAA. If that's true, I'd move up for Hernandez or Guice. I agree that it will be offense today. It’s so telling how thin this EDGE class is that a cheap year of Shaq Barrett can get draft capital, even to the equivalent of only a 4th rounder. Especially when teams know that we are looking to leverage our newfound depth and Shaq likely will walk given our roster and cap woes. It also means that Harold Landry either goes really soon or there must be an extra medical or legal flag that’s making him fall. Edited April 27, 2018 by Broncofan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BroncosFan2010 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 Quote I put this in the draft thread but I'll post it here too. We're not going to be able to keep Shaq next year when he hits unrestricted free agency and, as much as I would hate to see him to, packing him and one of our day 3 picks to get another pick today would be a good move for us. What would be great would be if we can trade Shaq + pick for a earlier pick and draft Michael Gallup, just trade Ram for another. 1 This is what I was saying earlier in this thread. If it was 2015, I would want to keep all our EDGE guys even if we didnt have a great chance to resign them. That was a year we were 'going for it'. This team is building for the future, and its smarter to cash on one of Ray/Shaq now than let them play out a year and lose one for nothing. It would be a prudent move. I think both Shaq and Ray have low R3 value, the league values EDGE guys. We have a good relationship w/ SF. Maybe Shaq and 3.99 for 2.59. They could afford to resign him and lack EDGE talent. And the McGlinchey pick sorta shows me they want to win sooner than later, Shaq would help that. 2.40 - Conor Williams OT 2.59 - Carlton Davis CB 3.71 - Mike Gesicki TE 4.106 - Michael Gallup WR 4.113 - Josey Jewell ILB 5.149 - Royce Freeman RB 5.160 - Jaylen Samuels H-Back Its a mainline shot of talent right into the arm lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BaldyBronco Posted April 27, 2018 Author Share Posted April 27, 2018 42 minutes ago, AnAngryAmerican said: I put this in the draft thread but I'll post it here too. We're not going to be able to keep Shaq next year when he hits unrestricted free agency and, as much as I would hate to see him to, packing him and one of our day 3 picks to get another pick today would be a good move for us. What would be great would be if we can trade Shaq + pick for a earlier pick and draft Michael Gallup, just trade Ram for another. Getting rid of Shaq is about as sad a narrative as not drafting Michael Gallup at 3.99. Big mistake, and I will be sniping Mr Kendell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BroncosFan2010 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 Quote Getting rid of Shaq is about as sad a narrative as not drafting Michael Gallup at 3.99. Big mistake, and I will be sniping Mr Kendell. He is a UFA next season. Ray has underwhelmed but is cost controlled next season still. We spend #5 on a EDGE. Von makes billions. We wont resign him. Cash in now. Hate to see him go, but its the realities of this game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BaldyBronco Posted April 27, 2018 Author Share Posted April 27, 2018 2 minutes ago, BroncosFan2010 said: This is what I was saying earlier in this thread. If it was 2015, I would want to keep all our EDGE guys even if we didnt have a great chance to resign them. That was a year we were 'going for it'. This team is building for the future, and its smarter to cash on one of Ray/Shaq now than let them play out a year and lose one for nothing. It would be a prudent move. I think both Shaq and Ray have low R3 value, the league values EDGE guys. We have a good relationship w/ SF. Maybe Shaq and 3.99 for 2.59. They could afford to resign him and lack EDGE talent. And the McGlinchey pick sorta shows me they want to win sooner than later, Shaq would help that. 2.40 - Conor Williams OT 2.59 - Carlton Davis CB 3.71 - Mike Gesicki TE 4.106 - Michael Gallup WR 4.113 - 5.149 - Royce Freeman RB 5.160 - Jaylen Samuels H-Back Its a mainline shot of talent right into the arm lol If this happens: 2.40 - Ronald Jones, RB 2.59 - D.J. Chark WR 3.71 - Tyrell Crosby, OG 4.106 - Josey Jewell ILB 5.149 - Durham Smythe, TE 5.160 - Parry Nelson, CB I would be a happy man. And I also like your take @Broncofan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Broncofan Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 (edited) 14 minutes ago, BroncosFan2010 said: He is a UFA next season. Ray has underwhelmed but is cost controlled next season still. We spend #5 on a EDGE. Von makes billions. We wont resign him. Cash in now. Hate to see him go, but its the realities of this game. Plus as mentioned in the other thread Shaq gets us no compensation of significance barring a big payday or a Pro Bowl season the next year (lol not holding my breath). Realistically we aren’t a 2018 contender. We need to draft well to gain back 2019 hopes of contending. Shaq leaving after 2018 with little to no comp pick (and waiting to 2020 to boot) does nothing. Frankly teams might not even bother giving us enough to be worth it. But if they do with Chubb in the fold and our roster and cap situation if they do, then Elway should pounce. Plus it’s not really a draft until Elway makes 1 trade. Edited April 27, 2018 by Broncofan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnAngryAmerican Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 13 minutes ago, BroncosFan2010 said: He is a UFA next season. Ray has underwhelmed but is cost controlled next season still. We spend #5 on a EDGE. Von makes billions. We wont resign him. Cash in now. Hate to see him go, but its the realities of this game. Yeah it’s like a mid-July baseball trade for a team that has fallen out of contention. Get something for him now rather than lose him in free agency and hope for compensatory pick. With that in mind, I would wager Shaq gets paid like a plus, but not elite, pass rusher, meaning we could expect a 5th, maybe 4th if a team overpays, compensatory pick in 2020. I would package him and one of day three picks for a 2nd, San Fran is a good suggestion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BaldyBronco Posted April 27, 2018 Author Share Posted April 27, 2018 Ok. So I embrace the thought of trading Barrett or Shane Ray. Elway sounded very luke warm about Shane today. And I think he is the guy. He is in the "Patriot" window of getting value before you lose him and Shaq and BRADLEY Mo FKN CHUBB make him expendable. What about this trade? Cleveland get: Shane Ray 2.40 Broncos get: 2.33 2.35 or 2.64 We have one extra pick tonight and Cleveland signs Shane to a long term deal. ??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AKRNA Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 (edited) 20 minutes ago, BroncosFan2010 said: He is a UFA next season. Ray has underwhelmed but is cost controlled next season still. We spend #5 on a EDGE. Von makes billions. We wont resign him. Cash in now. Hate to see him go, but its the realities of this game. It is the reality. It's kind of a BB thing to do, unpopular but good for the team. Edited April 27, 2018 by AKRNA spelling 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
broncos_fan _from _uk Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 2 minutes ago, BaldyBronco said: Ok. So I embrace the thought of trading Barrett or Shane Ray. Elway sounded very luke warm about Shane today. And I think he is the guy. He is in the "Patriot" window of getting value before you lose him and Shaq and BRADLEY Mo FKN CHUBB make him expendable. What about this trade? Cleveland get: Shane Ray 2.40 Broncos get: 2.33 2.35 or 2.64 We have one extra pick tonight and Cleveland signs Shane to a long term deal. ??? I mean yeah which broncos fan wouldn't take that?!? it values Ray as a late 1st (for 35) early 2nd (for 64) A team would be stupid to take it. That being said this is Cleveland who drafted baker #1 (lol) and Ward before Chubb (HAHAHA) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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