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2018 Ravens 1st Round Draft Pick (#32) - Lamar Jackson, QB, Louisville


wackywabbit

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On 4/27/2018 at 8:19 PM, sp6488 said:

Here's a question...

Is RG3 definitely gone?

Or, alternatively, do they go with 3 QBs so that Jackson does not have to step into a game this season under any circumstance and can focus completely on improving footwork, mechanics and learning NFL playbook?

IMO, Griffin has a lot more to offer Jackson than Flacco does in terms of mentoring. RGIII came into the league almost the same as Jackson did, but a more polished passer. He can teach Jackson that aspect of the game. I don't want Flacco anywhere near Jackson, tbh.

As for this year, I wouldn't even activate Jackson, I would roll with RGIII as the backup for now and let Jackson purely sit with no controversy and make it absolutely clear from day 1 that he's not playing this year, and this is a purely developmental year for him.

Once we cut ties with Flacco, RGIII and Jackson should be the QB's moving forward.

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50 minutes ago, Darth Pees said:

IMO, Griffin has a lot more to offer Jackson than Flacco does in terms of mentoring. RGIII came into the league almost the same as Jackson did, but a more polished passer. He can teach Jackson that aspect of the game. I don't want Flacco anywhere near Jackson, tbh.

As for this year, I wouldn't even activate Jackson, I would roll with RGIII as the backup for now and let Jackson purely sit with no controversy and make it absolutely clear from day 1 that he's not playing this year, and this is a purely developmental year for him.

Once we cut ties with Flacco, RGIII and Jackson should be the QB's moving forward.

I don’t understand how RG3 would have more to offer than Flacco given Flacco’s success as a constant professional in the NFL for over 10 years.

I think both QBs have much to offer. RG3 as a cautionary tale for Jackson to heed and Flacco as someone that is a professional that has gained the respect of his teammates with a similarly reserved personality when the cameras stop recording.

Lets not forget that it wasn’t Flacco that got his QBs coaches fired during his most formative years of the NFL. He also had to endure multiple OCs and offensive systems throughout his tenure. How to handle all of those adjustments like a professional are all invaluable lessons Flacco can impart.

The thing Lamar could stand to avoid is the offseason complacency that Flacco has appeared to have had. Flacco is a hard worker, but only within the course of the season, which is why playoff Flacco is so great... because he becomes steadily better as the year drags on.

There are coolers, closers, and cleaners. Flacco in my opinion is a closer. He’s not a follower, he tends to follow the beat of his own drum and when he gets going and decides to be great, he makes elite plays happen. But because he’s not relentless in his pursuit of excellence, he has teased our franchise enough that getting rid of him could mean greater doom, but without a true alpha, Flacco will never guide the team to greatness. This has always been understood. When we had a host of Cleaners on the team like Lewis, Reed, Boldin, and Suggs, the team thrived because Flacco provided enough to make it happen.

The biggest reason that I was willing to move on from Joe Flacco is because from what I’ve gathered, Lamar Jackson looks to be a cleaner. Jackson has an elite level drive to go along with great work ethic IMO. So while he’s not quite as outspoken, I see Jackson as an Ed Reed or Rod Woodson level cleaner.

So while Flacco hasn’t lived up to the expectations of his contract, it ultimately isn’t his fault because not many QBs in the league can. There are very few cleaner level QBs in the league that can, but Jackson can still learn a lot from Flacco. Including how if he doesn’t get complacent, he could become an elite QB.

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10 minutes ago, diamondbull424 said:

I don’t understand how RG3 would have more to offer than Flacco given Flacco’s success as a constant professional in the NFL for over 10 years.

I think both QBs have much to offer. RG3 as a cautionary tale for Jackson to heed and Flacco as someone that is a professional that has gained the respect of his teammates with a similarly reserved personality when the cameras stop recording.

Lets not forget that it wasn’t Flacco that got his QBs coaches fired during his most formative years of the NFL. He also had to endure multiple OCs and offensive systems throughout his tenure. How to handle all of those adjustments like a professional are all invaluable lessons Flacco can impart.

The thing Lamar could stand to avoid is the offseason complacency that Flacco has appeared to have had. Flacco is a hard worker, but only within the course of the season, which is why playoff Flacco is so great... because he becomes steadily better as the year drags on.

There are coolers, closers, and cleaners. Flacco in my opinion is a closer. He’s not a follower, he tends to follow the beat of his own drum and when he gets going and decides to be great, he makes elite plays happen. But because he’s not relentless in his pursuit of excellence, he has teased our franchise enough that getting rid of him could mean greater doom, but without a true alpha, Flacco will never guide the team to greatness. This has always been understood. When we had a host of Cleaners on the team like Lewis, Reed, Boldin, and Suggs, the team thrived because Flacco provided enough to make it happen.

The biggest reason that I was willing to move on from Joe Flacco is because from what I’ve gathered, Lamar Jackson looks to be a cleaner. Jackson has an elite level drive to go along with great work ethic IMO. So while he’s not quite as outspoken, I see Jackson as an Ed Reed or Rod Woodson level cleaner.

So while Flacco hasn’t lived up to the expectations of his contract, it ultimately isn’t his fault because not many QBs in the league can. There are very few cleaner level QBs in the league that can, but Jackson can still learn a lot from Flacco. Including how if he doesn’t get complacent, he could become an elite QB.

RGIII I just feel has more to offer in terms of "don't do this..." because he ultimately paid for his mistakes, whereas Flacco has been invincible no matter how terrible he's been thanks to his contract. Both of them can teach him things to do off the field, but ultimately on the field Jackson really doesn't have anyone to look up to as I don't trust RGIII or Flacco to teach Jackson about reads, progressions, pre-snap adjustments, etc.

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On 4/27/2018 at 6:21 PM, diamondbull424 said:

What have you seen from Mason Rudolph that you like and makes you believe he will succeed as a starting NFL quarterback?

As per Greg Cosell (and I agree because this is what I saw of him) Rudolph comes from an air raid system with route concepts that don’t translate to the NFL, he struggles with passing accuracy, he has only an average NFL arm, and he struggles with decision making on third downs or when the pocket is dirty. He’s as big of a project as Jackson as a passer, only he’s not a generation athlete. But if you see something that justifies your reasoning, I would be interested in hearing what it is.

I like Rudolph. I think his arm is solid. He hangs in the pocket and delivers the ball deep with very good accuracy.

But I much prefer Jackson. Much much much more upside. And the notion of saving draft value on a QBoTF misses me. I'd give up multiple first for a better QB prospect.

 

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2 hours ago, wackywabbit said:

I like Rudolph. I think his arm is solid. He hangs in the pocket and delivers the ball deep with very good accuracy.

But I much prefer Jackson. Much much much more upside. And the notion of saving draft value on a QBoTF misses me. I'd give up multiple first for a better QB prospect.

 

Perhaps I was harsh. I don’t hate Mason Rudolph, but just like I didn’t necessarily believe Hayden Hurst was a 1st round tight end because similar talents such as Zack Ertz were taken in the 2nd round (not pick #16), I don’t think Rudolph is a franchise QB. His accuracy is at the same level as Lamar’s. Similar arm strength for both as well, I’d probably define it as average to above average. Neither is elite. 

I say all that because I know Lamar isn’t an elite passer of the football, simply solid. If he develops his accuracy though, he could definitely have franchise passing ability. Same with any quarterback, but Jackson has had experience in a pro style system and his feet will buy him more time to develop his accuracy. Plus he’s still very young, he’s only 21.

Rudolph had he been selected in the first round might have been asked to start in a year’s time (like Jackson), only he’s a much bigger project because he needs to develop both his understanding of the pro-system and develop his passing accuracy. All this while being both older (23) and without any elite traits to buy him time. That’s a recipe for disaster. He’s essentially an older Lamar Jackson without a superpower. So when I say I don’t like him, I suppose that’s relative. I would’ve taken a guy like Kyle Lauletta before Rudolph as well, but I would take Rudolph before JT Barrett. In Rudolph I see a 4th/5th round talent.

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2 hours ago, diamondbull424 said:

Perhaps I was harsh. I don’t hate Mason Rudolph, but just like I didn’t necessarily believe Hayden Hurst was a 1st round tight end because similar talents such as Zack Ertz were taken in the 2nd round (not pick #16), I don’t think Rudolph is a franchise QB. His accuracy is at the same level as Lamar’s. Similar arm strength for both as well, I’d probably define it as average to above average. Neither is elite.

Mason Rudolph is noodle armed, I don't know what you guys are talking about. Lamar has a really strong whippy arm. It's not even close. 

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16 minutes ago, DreamKid said:

Mason Rudolph is noodle armed, I don't know what you guys are talking about. Lamar has a really strong whippy arm. It's not even close. 

I think you’re right. The eyeball test seems to show Jackson with a stronger arm, but after looking at the combine throw velocity, it had Jackson at 49 mph to Rudolph’s 52 mph.

I suppose, if anything, It must show that Jackson inconsistently throwing without his legs produces an inconsistent throwing strength. That said, I don’t know if I’d say Rudolph has a noodle arm either.

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3 minutes ago, diamondbull424 said:

I suppose, if anything, It must show that Jackson inconsistently throwing without his legs produces an inconsistent throwing strength. That said, I don’t know if I’d say Rudolph has a noodle arm either.

Every analyst I've seen talk about him specifically mentions his lack of an arm. Charles Davis and Daniel Jeremiah even joked about how for a big guy he has a small arm during the draft. I think he'll be a pick machine at the next level. Good for us, and our young demon DBs >:(.

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1 minute ago, DreamKid said:

Every analyst I've seen talk about him specifically mentions his lack of an arm. Charles Davis and Daniel Jeremiah even joked about how for a big guy he has a small arm during the draft. I think he'll be a pick machine at the next level. Good for us, and our young demon DBs >:(.

Yeah, I’m definitely not too concerned with playing Mason Rudolph, that’s for sure. He doesn’t scare me in the slightest.

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1 hour ago, diamondbull424 said:

the combine throw velocity,

I wouldn't use that as a measure of arm strength - only as a minimum benchmark imo

IIRC the suggested minimum benchmark was 52 or 53mph (although DeShaun Watson threw significantly slower than that).

There are a few of examples of players with with noodle arms setting numbers higher than those with cannons (Colt McCoy being one in particular iirc). Plus I'm pretty sure that almost all the highest results belong to guys that never made it in the NFL

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3 hours ago, DreamKid said:

"The Baltimore Burglar" 

How many touchdowns will he steal for us? He can pick any team's pocket for 6. (media will never go for burglar, I expect "Baltimore Blur" or "Purple Panther")

I think his nickname has already been decided. Lamar “Action Jackson”. It’s corny, but the media loves corny. Plus any player with that last name inevitably gets the moniker.? 

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will definitely be interesting to see how Lamar Jackson and Mason Rudolph progress. Both should be seeing the field around the same time (rudolph earlier then he should be due to ben retiring)

 

As for Jackson, Ive had a 4 days to digest, and I think with the proper coaching, he will turn into a beast. Lets just hope the ravens dont screw this up!

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