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.Buzz

With the 93rd overall pick, the Jacksonville Jaguars select Ronnie Harrison, S

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9 minutes ago, .Buzz said:

 

That is why I didn't understand the selection of Edmunds by the Steelers in the first he is scheme specific to them because they play a lot of zone but it was significant reach because I don't think he is a better player than Harrison.. Edmunds could have gone as late as where we picked Harrison. 

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3 hours ago, iPwn said:

I haven’t followed this year even close to enough so as to have any real opinions on these players. But it’s pretty obvious that after years of just kinda doing things without any plan other than just “address what we see directly in front of us”, they’re making decisions that clearly fit a long term plan. They have an identity and are matching players to that, and they’re addressing depth and long term solutions to situations that aren’t necessarily immediately a problem.

I have no real opinion on whether these guys will be successful or not, but them clearly making a concerted effort towards this is pretty big.

This is true.  And i like this pick for that reason.  It's definitely a proactive type pick.

 

But at the same time, windows for "elite" defenses are typically short in this league today.  Even if you continue to nab value guys like this (and they actually pan out).  It's a fine line between "looking to the future" and "neglecting the present".  Especially with a team where this one currently is.  We've got some honestly pretty old players featuring prominently, and at some point...you simply aren't going to be able to keep an elite defense together cap-wise.  I think "contending windows" really come into play as well.

It's nice to have depth at strong positions, insurance, a succession plan, etc.  But unless you're a team built around a Franchise QB that makes you a perennial contender...sometimes i think you've gotta sacrifice a bit of the future for the now, to maximize your ~3 year sort of window on a truly Elite defense and heavily featured running game offense.

 

Just such a fine line.  And this draft feels like it's toeing dangerously close to the tipping point of future over present.  Worrying a bit too much about the next couple years' potential cap problems.  Not over the line...but feeling dangerously close.

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8 hours ago, Tugboat said:

This is true.  And i like this pick for that reason.  It's definitely a proactive type pick.

 

But at the same time, windows for "elite" defenses are typically short in this league today.  Even if you continue to nab value guys like this (and they actually pan out).  It's a fine line between "looking to the future" and "neglecting the present".  Especially with a team where this one currently is.  We've got some honestly pretty old players featuring prominently, and at some point...you simply aren't going to be able to keep an elite defense together cap-wise.  I think "contending windows" really come into play as well.

It's nice to have depth at strong positions, insurance, a succession plan, etc.  But unless you're a team built around a Franchise QB that makes you a perennial contender...sometimes i think you've gotta sacrifice a bit of the future for the now, to maximize your ~3 year sort of window on a truly Elite defense and heavily featured running game offense.

 

Just such a fine line.  And this draft feels like it's toeing dangerously close to the tipping point of future over present.  Worrying a bit too much about the next couple years' potential cap problems.  Not over the line...but feeling dangerously close.

I agree with this to a point. These are guys that will see the field and help our future out alot but our time is now so i kind of wanted us to go more OL. Idk, i hate to blindly trust the process but after last years draft weren’t alot of us upset that we didn’t address QB, didnt get a 2nd OL, took Smoot and Dede? At least in the beginning before trying to rationalize it? 

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5 hours ago, JaguarCrazy2832 said:

I agree with this to a point. These are guys that will see the field and help our future out alot but our time is now so i kind of wanted us to go more OL. Idk, i hate to blindly trust the process but after last years draft weren’t alot of us upset that we didn’t address QB, didnt get a 2nd OL, took Smoot and Dede? At least in the beginning before trying to rationalize it? 

i mean, are we sure were wrong?

Fournette set the tone, but look at the rest of that rb class.

Cam was good, and I'm not sure many questioned Dede, but Smoot is still a question mark, especially compared to the OL available at that spot

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20 hours ago, Speedyg said:

i mean, are we sure were wrong?

Fournette set the tone, but look at the rest of that rb class.

Cam was good, and I'm not sure many questioned Dede, but Smoot is still a question mark, especially compared to the OL available at that spot

There's some questions with that class yet, but they look like they likely found an elite level RB, LT for the next 8-10+ years, a very talented WR who will have a large part in the offense, and at worst a solid rotational DL who flashed plenty in year 1. I'd say that's a pretty damn solid draft regardless of our perceived needs/wants. Blair Brown looks like solid depth at LB/Special teamer too.

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On 4/28/2018 at 2:19 AM, Tugboat said:

But at the same time, windows for "elite" defenses are typically short in this league today.  Even if you continue to nab value guys like this (and they actually pan out).  It's a fine line between "looking to the future" and "neglecting the present".  Especially with a team where this one currently is.  We've got some honestly pretty old players featuring prominently, and at some point...you simply aren't going to be able to keep an elite defense together cap-wise.  I think "contending windows" really come into play as well.

I mean doesn’t this kinda justify the moves they’ve made though? They’re building a succession plan for those aging players, and also making sure the current group has some players who can step in when someone inevitably goes down. 

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On 4/28/2018 at 5:55 PM, Speedyg said:

i mean, are we sure were wrong?

Fournette set the tone, but look at the rest of that rb class.

Cam was good, and I'm not sure many questioned Dede, but Smoot is still a question mark, especially compared to the OL available at that spot

Not saying we were wrong, if anything they looked to have drafted BPA and it worked so far. Guys like Smoot and Dede weren't needs at all at the time but seemed to play better than their draft spot. Just curious to see how this one shapes up too and how last years guys progress

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On 29/04/2018 at 12:51 PM, iPwn said:

I mean doesn’t this kinda justify the moves they’ve made though? They’re building a succession plan for those aging players, and also making sure the current group has some players who can step in when someone inevitably goes down. 

Sort of.  It's helping make sure the window stays open, and "injury proofing" it to some extent.

But as far as trying to build a succession plan for those aging players to sustain a truly elite defense?  I don't really buy that as any kind of likelihood.  I think more likely, we're putting in place a plan to keep our defense from completely falling apart as guys age/price themselves out.  But it takes more than just taking some fliers in the draft to assemble a defense as elite as the one we have right now.  So many things have to come together just right, at just the right times.

Calais Campbell for instance, is arguably our very best player and a huge component in the upturn of our defense last year.  Expecting a guy like Taven Bryan to take over from that in a few years without missing a beat is extremely optimistic, and imo farfetched.  It'd be absolutely phenomenal if it happens, but i wouldn't exactly count on it.  I think you can call that a succession plan in terms of hopefully maintaining a "good" defense without too many gaping holes.  But it's not a succession plan for a sustainably "elite" defense.  I don't believe that sort of plan realistically exists.  It's just too hard, and too rare for truly special defenses to come together for the long-term.  A top tier Franchise QB is really the only truly long-term "sustainable" thing to build a team around.

 

Which is why it's tougher to swallow moves that are more than likely geared toward keeping this team at least solid on defense a number of years from now.  At the expense of opportunities to bolster this team's glaring weakness for right now, while we do have a rare and honestly pretty special truly elite defense. 

I do like that they're showing this sort of proactive mentality.  But it's always a balancing act between the future and the present.  And at some point, to some extent...i'm also a pretty big believer in the adage, "make hay while the sun's up".

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On 4/29/2018 at 6:03 PM, JaguarCrazy2832 said:

Not saying we were wrong, if anything they looked to have drafted BPA and it worked so far. Guys like Smoot and Dede weren't needs at all at the time but seemed to play better than their draft spot. Just curious to see how this one shapes up too and how last years guys progress

not to really trash dede but i would have Picked Lawson in round 4 and Took Elflein in round 3.  

i certainly would have Picked Elflein in round 3. depending how that shakes the draft up i would then take lawson/smoot in round 4. 

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One of the best value picks in the draft

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