2024 Eagles regular season

[Nabbs4u]

5 minutes ago, Broadway Joe said:

Past instances have shown that the deterrent for HC to come here is not the QB, but the GM. 

It will be interesting if it happens again in the offseason. If we go after another yes man or Howie is willing to take a step back and meddle less, be a more traditional GM in that regard. I would think the latter would make sense after the last two, but maybe his ego and the Chip experience makes him go with the former. 

Who are the HC candidates you guys are even targeting that want GM power? Control over the Roster?

For better or worse depending on your side of the fence, Howie is never giving that power away again. For any HC, nor should he. It was a mistake with Chip Kelly and it would be a mistake with Bill Belicheck as well.

[Broadway Joe]

18 minutes ago, Nabbs4u said:

Who are the HC candidates you guys are even targeting that want GM power? Control over the Roster?

For better or worse depending on your side of the fence, Howie is never giving that power away again. For any HC, nor should he. It was a mistake with Chip Kelly and it would be a mistake with Bill Belicheck as well.

I don't think they want roster control, as much as they want to have control of their coaching staff, actives on gameday, not having the GM constantly over your shoulder. Picture Jerry Jones minus the media circus, we're the same situation for HCs. 

[Nabbs4u]

50 minutes ago, Broadway Joe said:

I don't think they want roster control, as much as they want to have control of their coaching staff, actives on gameday, not having the GM constantly over your shoulder. Picture Jerry Jones minus the media circus, we're the same situation for HCs. 

It's obvious Howie has hired HC with the intent on keeping certain coaches. That's undeniable. 

Who are the players Howie is telling Nick not to play? Dictating to him, the active 53?

IMO all GM's are looking over the HC shoulder unless your name is Reid / Tomlin / McVay. It's the norm. Jerry is the only idiot media whore seeking attention. 

Question/hypothetical the next HC hire actually wants to bring in his on OL coach and fire/release Stout. That HC hire is say Ben Johnson, Bobby Slowik or whomever is the top.....

Should Howie allow that to happen, give him free rain or fight for said coach to remain on staff? Knowing the impact Stout has had in that lockerroom and with players achievements as Eagles?

Edited October 3 by Nabbs4u

[CasperX22]

44 minutes ago, Broadway Joe said:

I don't think they want roster control, as much as they want to have control of their coaching staff, actives on gameday, not having the GM constantly over your shoulder. Picture Jerry Jones minus the media circus, we're the same situation for HCs. 

I think just from this year's roster Kenny Pickett and Bryce Huff are perfect examples. The coaches aren't blind.  They can clearly see that McKee is a better QB than Pickett and I don't think Pickett would be the #2 if Kellen Moore had his way.

Howie might've gone out of his way to go get Baun, but I'm not sure Fangio had a lot of input in the Eagles going after Huff.  You could tell almost immediately that Fangio was a bit sceptical of the move. perfect example of a splash signing where the player didn't fit the current scheme.  There are 2 obvious ways to build a roster:

1. Get players that are going to fit a very specific philosophy or scheme.

2. Build your scheme around the players on your roster

It's clear that the Eagles build the 1st way, so signing guys like Huff and White are obviously odd fits.  A lot of people want to blame Fangio for not using these guys properly, but Fangio is obviously very rigid in his philosophy and that philosophy fits the organizational philosophy, so then why were these guys signed?  Howie is a very good at what he does, but Howie is too much of a micromanager and needs to let the people he hires do the job he hired them to do.

 

[CasperX22]

6 minutes ago, Nabbs4u said:

It's obvious Howie has hired HC with the intent on keeping certain coaches. That's undeniable. 

Who are the players Howie is telling Nick not to play? Dictating to him, the active 53?

IMO all GM's are looking over the HC shoulder unless your name is Reid / Tomlin / McVay. It's the norm. Jerry is the only idiot media whore seeking attention. 

Question/hypothetical the next HC hire actually wants to bring in his on OL coach and fire/release Stout. That HC hire is say Ben Johnson, Bobby Slowik or whomever is the top.....

Should Howie allow that to happen, give him free rain or fight for said coach to remain on staff? Knowing the impact Stout has had in that lockerroom and with players achievements as Eagles?

Well he should very obviously not compel his HC to demote his 1st year DC in the middle of the season either.  I don't think Sirianni had much if any say in who his coordinators should be in 2023 or 2024.  That's a problem whether you think Sirianni is a good coach or not.  If you don't trust him to make those decisions, then he shouldn't be your HC.

[Broadway Joe]

4 minutes ago, Nabbs4u said:

It's obvious Howie has hired HC with the intent on keeping certain coaches. That's undeniable. 

Who are the players Howie is telling Nick not to play? Dictating to him, the active 53?

IMO all GM's are looking over the HC shoulder unless your name is Reid / Tomlin / McVay. It's the norm. Jerry is the only idiot media whore seeking attention. 

Question/hypothetical the next HC hire actually wants to bring in his on OL coach and fire/release Stout. That HC hire is say Ben Johnson, Bobby Slowik or whomever is the top.....

Should Howie allow that to happen, give him free rain or fight for said coach to remain on staff? Knowing the impact Stout has had in that lockerroom and with players achievements as Eagles?

More like Howie has hired HC with the intent of having certain type of HC. He's been called by the media "a master in self preservation" before and for good reason. 

We are one of the few if not one of only two FO centric franchises. Only us and the Cowboys have a GM with this type of power. 

As for the gameday actives, we would have to look at which players each year, but the game day actives was an issue that was reported during Doug's tenure. 

In this cases, usually the team keeps certain coaches until the coach dictates if they want to retain them, like the Chargers did with Moore. It is very unlikely they want to get rid of Stout, as he is very respected and given the current state of OL play it would be foolish and hardly a deal breaker for any HC coming here. So the Stout example is a very bad one, would you prioritize an OL coach over a HC? How about all the other position coaches? He's literally the only one worth keeping, and he might as well look for a job elsewhere voluntarily if we switch HCs again like it almost happened last time.  

Say what you want but Stout being here is hardly a justification for Howie to be the overlord. 

[Broadway Joe]

13 minutes ago, CasperX22 said:

I think just from this year's roster Kenny Pickett and Bryce Huff are perfect examples. The coaches aren't blind.  They can clearly see that McKee is a better QB than Pickett and I don't think Pickett would be the #2 if Kellen Moore had his way.

Howie might've gone out of his way to go get Baun, but I'm not sure Fangio had a lot of input in the Eagles going after Huff.  You could tell almost immediately that Fangio was a bit sceptical of the move. perfect example of a splash signing where the player didn't fit the current scheme.  There are 2 obvious ways to build a roster:

1. Get players that are going to fit a very specific philosophy or scheme.

2. Build your scheme around the players on your roster

It's clear that the Eagles build the 1st way, so signing guys like Huff and White are obviously odd fits.  A lot of people want to blame Fangio for not using these guys properly, but Fangio is obviously very rigid in his philosophy and that philosophy fits the organizational philosophy, so then why were these guys signed?  Howie is a very good at what he does, but Howie is too much of a micromanager and needs to let the people he hires do the job he hired them to do.

 

Add the White signing to that. Everyone was talking about how he is not a LB for Fangio at the time but it fit the Howie MO of signing former highly touted players and see what happens. He is very good at dealing, being proactive, aggressiveness, he is hit or miss with pro player scouting and poor on college scouting. 

The team should invest a lot more on scouting and constructing their big board, because even though this year we were less rigid in our philosphy, we still go too much with the consensus or special requests when going after players.

9 minutes ago, CasperX22 said:

Well he should very obviously not compel his HC to demote his 1st year DC in the middle of the season either.  I don't think Sirianni had much if any say in who his coordinators should be in 2023 or 2024.  That's a problem whether you think Sirianni is a good coach or not.  If you don't trust him to make those decisions, then he shouldn't be your HC.

Not to mention they did make Sirianni take the fall for the whole Patricia situation at the end of the year when it was obvious from the moment it happened that it wasn't on him. 

A big downside of hiring yes man is that the last two had little to no connections in the league, so the moment the staff got poached, the team spiraled. 

Edited October 3 by Broadway Joe

[UndyTaker]

18 minutes ago, Broadway Joe said:

More like Howie has hired HC with the intent of having certain type of HC. He's been called by the media "a master in self preservation" before and for good reason. 

We are one of the few if not one of only two FO centric franchises. Only us and the Cowboys have a GM with this type of power. 

As for the gameday actives, we would have to look at which players each year, but the game day actives was an issue that was reported during Doug's tenure. 

In this cases, usually the team keeps certain coaches until the coach dictates if they want to retain them, like the Chargers did with Moore. It is very unlikely they want to get rid of Stout, as he is very respected and given the current state of OL play it would be foolish and hardly a deal breaker for any HC coming here. So the Stout example is a very bad one, would you prioritize an OL coach over a HC? How about all the other position coaches? He's literally the only one worth keeping, and he might as well look for a job elsewhere voluntarily if we switch HCs again like it almost happened last time.  

Say what you want but Stout being here is hardly a justification for Howie to be the overlord. 

Funny enough I believe it was Zach Berman maybe, or another reporter that I cant remember the name but it was reported that Kliff Kingsbury was offered the job for OC but he wanted to bring his own Oline coach, and the Eagles said no.

[Nabbs4u]

15 minutes ago, Broadway Joe said:

More like Howie has hired HC with the intent of having certain type of HC. He's been called by the media "a master in self preservation" before and for good reason. 

We are one of the few if not one of only two FO centric franchises. Only us and the Cowboys have a GM with this type of power. 

As for the gameday actives, we would have to look at which players each year, but the game day actives was an issue that was reported during Doug's tenure. 

In this cases, usually the team keeps certain coaches until the coach dictates if they want to retain them, like the Chargers did with Moore. It is very unlikely they want to get rid of Stout, as he is very respected and given the current state of OL play it would be foolish and hardly a deal breaker for any HC coming here. So the Stout example is a very bad one, would you prioritize an OL coach over a HC? How about all the other position coaches? He's literally the only one worth keeping, and he might as well look for a job elsewhere voluntarily if we switch HCs again like it almost happened last time.  

Say what you want but Stout being here is hardly a justification for Howie to be the overlord. 

You said Howie dictating the staff. I don't care if that next HC is an idiot , if he wanted to fire Stout should Howie step in? Is that not him meddling and dictating the staff? You can't cherry pick which coaches deserve to stay which don't in that scenario,  it's still meddling. Not allowing the new HC to hire his own staff.

It was clear to me and most people Vic Fangio not only wanted the Eagles DC job in 2023, he was Priority #1. No one knew Gannon was already out the door. I honestly believe Gannon kept that quite on purpose because he didn't want Fangio taking his job. Probably was pissed Vic was even brought in as a consultant for the playoffs in the first place!. 

So demoting Desai with a historically bad Defense in favor for Patricia Probably was influenced by Howie. In hopes of something changing. We couldn't stay status quo could we?

Both sucked. Niether could adapt,  both looked horrific. Both were horrible additions but clearly not option #1.

Besides Fangio who do you believe Sirianni might of wanted as DC if Fangio was forced on him to remsin HC? Honestly Curious?

[Broadway Joe]

20 minutes ago, Nabbs4u said:

You said Howie dictating the staff. I don't care if that next HC is an idiot , if he wanted to fire Stout should Howie step in? Is that not him meddling and dictating the staff? You can't cherry pick which coaches deserve to stay which don't in that scenario,  it's still meddling. Not allowing the new HC to hire his own staff.

It was clear to me and most people Vic Fangio not only wanted the Eagles DC job in 2023, he was Priority #1. No one knew Gannon was already out the door. I honestly believe Gannon kept that quite on purpose because he didn't want Fangio taking his job. Probably was pissed Vic was even brought in as a consultant for the playoffs in the first place!. 

So demoting Desai with a historically bad Defense in favor for Patricia Probably was influenced by Howie. In hopes of something changing. We couldn't stay status quo could we?

Both sucked. Niether could adapt,  both looked horrific. Both were horrible additions but clearly not option #1.

Besides Fangio who do you believe Sirianni might of wanted as DC if Fangio was forced on him to remsin HC? Honestly Curious?

You can absolutely cherry pick, not all coaches are created equal. Some are worth intervening some don't. That's the reality.

I can't speak on your second paragraph as it is all conjecture. We know Gannon screwed us over, that much is true, the reasons are only for him to know. 

Yes we could stay in the status quo with Desai, yes it was pretty bad, but he didn't even get the season and the way the demotion was handled was weird in all ways, we weren't even upfront about it, he retained his title, he was not the play caller. We weren't even do one of those right.  So at least fire the guy, that much could have been done. 

I have no idea who Sirianni wanted after Gannon walked, as I said in my previous post, our yes men coaches have limited league connections. Leonhard already turned us down due to his medical condition, now he is in the league, we may find out how good he is. 

[CasperX22]

29 minutes ago, Nabbs4u said:

You said Howie dictating the staff. I don't care if that next HC is an idiot , if he wanted to fire Stout should Howie step in? Is that not him meddling and dictating the staff? You can't cherry pick which coaches deserve to stay which don't in that scenario,  it's still meddling. Not allowing the new HC to hire his own staff.

It was clear to me and most people Vic Fangio not only wanted the Eagles DC job in 2023, he was Priority #1. No one knew Gannon was already out the door. I honestly believe Gannon kept that quite on purpose because he didn't want Fangio taking his job. Probably was pissed Vic was even brought in as a consultant for the playoffs in the first place!. 

So demoting Desai with a historically bad Defense in favor for Patricia Probably was influenced by Howie. In hopes of something changing. We couldn't stay status quo could we?

Both sucked. Niether could adapt,  both looked horrific. Both were horrible additions but clearly not option #1.

Besides Fangio who do you believe Sirianni might of wanted as DC if Fangio was forced on him to remsin HC? Honestly Curious?

We were 10-3 when the change was made and it was reported that weeks before that some of the play calling and game planning was pulled from him, so the Eagles had lost all of 1 game before Howie slapped his D on the table and that was the 1 game Hurts stole a loss from the jaws of victory.  The defense obviously had issues, but the defense very clearly didn't have enough talent to expect much more than what they were getting from the defense.  What it did do though is completely emasculate Sirianni and the locker room hasn't been the same since.

[Last Stand]

1 hour ago, CasperX22 said:

We were 10-3 when the change was made and it was reported that weeks before that some of the play calling and game planning was pulled from him, so the Eagles had lost all of 1 game before Howie slapped his D on the table and that was the 1 game Hurts stole a loss from the jaws of victory.  The defense obviously had issues, but the defense very clearly didn't have enough talent to expect much more than what they were getting from the defense.  What it did do though is completely emasculate Sirianni and the locker room hasn't been the same since.

While I don’t know exactly what happened

i do know there were reports that reddick came into nicks office asking to get rid of Sean desai and that Sean desai couldn’t communicate correctly with several of the players who all had issues with him.

I believe it was Geoff mosher who reported it but there were others as well

so while it’s easy to say Nick this or howie that in regards to that situation I will say howie and lurie both have historically avoided in season changes much in the same way Nick didn’t flinch on Gannon early when it seemed like fans and media wanted anyone else

its possible desai had that bad of a relationship with guys in the lockerroom.

also Patricia was brought in late in the off-season from what I remember which indicates there probably were some early red flags from desai 

[UndyTaker]

8 minutes ago, Last Stand said:

also Patricia was brought in late in the off-season from what I remember which indicates there probably were some early red flags from desai 

He was "officially" hired on April 20th. I remember there was some controversy surrounding his hire because the team website released the information, and then took it down. Nick was asked about it in his next press conference and he said it was "trending in that direction" talking about Matt getting hired. But Matt had been in the building for a few days or weeks before April 20th it sounds like.

Edited October 3 by UndyTaker

[Broadway Joe]

34 minutes ago, UndyTaker said:

He was "officially" hired on April 20th. I remember there was some controversy surrounding his hire because the team website released the information, and then took it down. Nick was asked about it in his next press conference and he said it was "trending in that direction" talking about Matt getting hired. But Matt had been in the building for a few days or weeks before April 20th it sounds like.

There's a lot of precedence of this organization not handling those type of moves well and not being upfront. I think it's the Joe Banner school.

[CasperX22]

1 hour ago, Last Stand said:

While I don’t know exactly what happened

i do know there were reports that reddick came into nicks office asking to get rid of Sean desai and that Sean desai couldn’t communicate correctly with several of the players who all had issues with him.

I believe it was Geoff mosher who reported it but there were others as well

so while it’s easy to say Nick this or howie that in regards to that situation I will say howie and lurie both have historically avoided in season changes much in the same way Nick didn’t flinch on Gannon early when it seemed like fans and media wanted anyone else

its possible desai had that bad of a relationship with guys in the lockerroom.

also Patricia was brought in late in the off-season from what I remember which indicates there probably were some early red flags from desai 

Patricia was such a bad hire and the decision to go to him if you're going to make a change was even more puzzling.  Asking a guy to call a game from a defensive scheme he had minimal experience in was destined to fail.