15412 Posted February 7, 2020 Share Posted February 7, 2020 "Allison, MVS and Kumerow were not NFL quality options in 2019. " True at least to a point. Nobody questions adding quality receivers would be a good thing, of course it would. Adding quality at any position is a good idea. But with Rodgers I'm talking about the plays that were sitting there waiting to be made. And weren't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacReady Posted February 7, 2020 Share Posted February 7, 2020 (edited) Speaking of regression, remember when Adams regressed in his second year? Davante had 482 yards his entire second season. MVS had 452 yards this year. 36 of those 452 yards came in the second half of the season. You’re all giving up on a WR who you’d all be pounding the table for if he had played with a different team last year. You’ve got a QB who sits there and doesn’t throw to open receivers because they’re not “crisp” and “precise” and expecting a rookie to come in and be Jerry Rice wise and precise. Edited February 7, 2020 by Outpost31 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
{Family Ghost} Posted February 7, 2020 Share Posted February 7, 2020 2 minutes ago, 15412 said: "Allison, MVS and Kumerow were not NFL quality options in 2019. " True at least to a point. Nobody questions adding quality receivers would be a good thing, of course it would. Adding quality at any position is a good idea. But with Rodgers I'm talking about the plays that were sitting there waiting to be made. And weren't. I can't explain a lot of those .. kind of mystifying. He's definitely become gun shy with some of those throws. He has no hesitation in throwing to Adams, who he has full trust in. I think Rodgers still has most of the talent he's ever had, but the end years of McCarthy and the first year of LaFleur have revealed some dents in the armor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
{Family Ghost} Posted February 7, 2020 Share Posted February 7, 2020 3 minutes ago, Outpost31 said: Speaking of regression, remember when Adams regressed in his second year? Davante had 482 yards his entire second season. MVS had 452 yards this year. 36 of those 452 yards came in the second half of the season. You’re all giving up on a WR who you’d all be pounding the table for if he had played with a different team last year. You’ve got a QB who sits there and doesn’t throw to open receivers because they’re not “crisp” and “precise” and expecting a rookie to come in and be Jerry Rice wise and precise. I'm not giving up on MVS, but he turned in a terrible season on the field and apparently on the practice field as well. LaFleur made references to his practice habits on more than one occasion. He's back to square one now. You can't go into 2020 counting on him to be a major cog, but there's potential that he could regain favor and contribute again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
15412 Posted February 7, 2020 Share Posted February 7, 2020 3 minutes ago, {Family Ghost} said: I can't explain a lot of those .. kind of mystifying. He's definitely become gun shy with some of those throws. He has no hesitation in throwing to Adams, who he has full trust in. I think Rodgers still has most of the talent he's ever had, but the end years of McCarthy and the first year of LaFleur have revealed some dents in the armor. This along with seemingly increasing inaccuracy. What bothers me worse though is when he ignores a quick move the chains 5 yard gain looking for the bigger play and then takes a hit or throws it away or (maddening scream) throws it deep to a covered receiver running a low percentage go route. He at times is his own worse enemy, but how it's affecting the team is what is at issue here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
{Family Ghost} Posted February 7, 2020 Share Posted February 7, 2020 2 minutes ago, 15412 said: This along with seemingly increasing inaccuracy. What bothers me worse though is when he ignores a quick move the chains 5 yard gain looking for the bigger play and then takes a hit or throws it away or (maddening scream) throws it deep to a covered receiver running a low percentage go route. He at times is his own worse enemy, but how it's affecting the team is what is at issue here. I don't know .. he affected the team all the way to the championship game. It could be a lot worse. This is not an overly talented roster, so to go 14-4 I'd say he's doing something right. Lets hope that year two of the LaFleur way, and some added talent at wide receiver can be a bit of a cure-all for #12. I'm not ready to bail on him yet. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pugger Posted February 7, 2020 Share Posted February 7, 2020 On 2/4/2020 at 3:20 PM, Joe said: I think this is a bit of an overreaction to say the least. FFS if we can stop the run and find a 2nd target for Rodgers, this team is very dangerous. We've solved the pass rush, we have an underrated secondary IMHO, and lo and behold we can actually run the damn ball now. We also have to be better at containing fast athletic TEs over the middle. This has been a problem for a while. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacReady Posted February 7, 2020 Share Posted February 7, 2020 5 minutes ago, Pugger said: We also have to be better at containing fast athletic TEs over the middle. This has been a problem for a while. This is a problem for every team. There are like 6 fast athletic tight ends in the league. It’s not some extreme disadvantage that we have that other teams do not have. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pugger Posted February 7, 2020 Share Posted February 7, 2020 1 hour ago, 15412 said: This is not the first year ol' Rodgers has been lacking. I've witnessed this for a few years now. Of course before it was all MM's fault, or at least their relationship. Rodgers is still a good NFL QB. He is not elite and we are paying for elite. The reason we are paying for elite is because when he signed his extension he was elite. He hasn't looked like his old self since the second broken collarbone. The only way we can rid ourselves of this albatross that some are calling him is to trade him away but from what I understand that will be a cap killer. I for one am hoping another season in this new scheme and better weapons around him will help. When a QB gets older like Rodgers he needs better players around him. For a couple of years Brees looked terrible until the Saints improved the roster. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
15412 Posted February 7, 2020 Share Posted February 7, 2020 33 minutes ago, {Family Ghost} said: I don't know .. he affected the team all the way to the championship game. It could be a lot worse. This is not an overly talented roster, so to go 14-4 I'd say he's doing something right. Lets hope that year two of the LaFleur way, and some added talent at wide receiver can be a bit of a cure-all for #12. I'm not ready to bail on him yet. As I said he's a good NFL QB. He at times is really, really good. Elite QB's are consistently really, really good and slant the weight of every game their way. We are paying him to be elite. Rodgers does a lot of things right, obviously. That doesn't excuse him for when he doesn't. I don't think anyone is ready to bail on him, I agree. If he doesn't improve at all next year he still is a good NFL QB. We obviously can win with him. Odds are though we will not be as healthy next year as we were last year, we need every play we can get. He left too many on the field. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
15412 Posted February 7, 2020 Share Posted February 7, 2020 3 minutes ago, Pugger said: The reason we are paying for elite is because when he signed his extension he was elite. He hasn't looked like his old self since the second broken collarbone. The only way we can rid ourselves of this albatross that some are calling him is to trade him away but from what I understand that will be a cap killer. I for one am hoping another season in this new scheme and better weapons around him will help. When a QB gets older like Rodgers he needs better players around him. For a couple of years Brees looked terrible until the Saints improved the roster. I haven't seen every one of their games over the years, but I don't remember Brees ever looking terrible. Not on a consistent basis anyway. He's the little engine that could. And does. Yes, he has played on some terrible teams. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pugger Posted February 7, 2020 Share Posted February 7, 2020 1 minute ago, 15412 said: As I said he's a good NFL QB. He at times is really, really good. Elite QB's are consistently really, really good and slant the weight of every game their way. We are paying him to be elite. Rodgers does a lot of things right, obviously. That doesn't excuse him for when he doesn't. I don't think anyone is ready to bail on him, I agree. If he doesn't improve at all next year he still is a good NFL QB. We obviously can win with him. Odds are though we will not be as healthy next year as we were last year, we need every play we can get. He left too many on the field. No one will argue with this post but some here are dumping most of the offensive struggles on him alone. But that is the blessing and the curse of playing the position. He gets all the praise when things go well and all the blame when things go south. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pugger Posted February 7, 2020 Share Posted February 7, 2020 17 minutes ago, Outpost31 said: This is a problem for every team. There are like 6 fast athletic tight ends in the league. It’s not some extreme disadvantage that we have that other teams do not have. I'm not sure what you meant by this statement. Can you elaborate? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacReady Posted February 7, 2020 Share Posted February 7, 2020 6 minutes ago, Pugger said: The reason we are paying for elite is because when he signed his extension he was elite. No, he was not. And on the whole Brees sucked until they improved their roster? Also not true. Since Rodgers has been starting, Drew’s completion percentage never dropped below 63%. His yards per attempt never dropped below 7 yards per attempt. Other than the one year his YPA dropped to 7, it never dropped below 7.5. Rodgers completed below 7.5 yards per attempt every single year since 2014. If your QB needs more than an elite WR, elite RB, elite LT to be elite, he was never elite. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacReady Posted February 7, 2020 Share Posted February 7, 2020 6 minutes ago, Pugger said: I'm not sure what you meant by this statement. Can you elaborate? We really don’t struggle against that type of tight end anymore than other teams do. We were 15th in the NFL at yards allowed to tight ends. 20 teams allowed more or the same amount of touchdowns to tight ends as we did. https://fftoolbox.fulltimefantasy.com/football/2019/points-allowed.cfm?pos=TE It’s not any type of area for concern. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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