2019 Offseason Thread

[3rivers]

1 hour ago, jebrick said:

Dupree has been playing very well.  I do not see him being let go.

 

I would rather release the entire coaching staff.  As i have said before.  Stale, predictable  scheme.  Dcoordinator that has nothing but wait to earn his position.  OCoordinator that was only put there because Ben wanted him.  Those two are showing nothing.  No preparation.  At least the Defense shows up in the 2nd half.  First half Fichtner is just a waster of space.

Agree about everything except dupree. Ben got what he wanted, now where are the results?  Ben is out of excuses and the schedule is much more difficult this year. So while they could have been 9-7 last year, that could be 6-10 this year. 

I am in agreement with cleaning house. I would keep munchak though, and maybe tomlin but I am not a fan of his like some are. This team needs a real shake up and new blood  and that starts at the top IMO.  

Dupree has decent effort, and of course is in the wrong scheme, but might catch on with another team.

ben, bell , dupree (5thyear option) and pouncey are about $45M in cap space. Think about your options based on what you have seen this season 

[VigilantZombie]

1 hour ago, jebrick said:

Dupree has been playing very well.  I do not see him being let go.

 

I would rather release the entire coaching staff.  As i have said before.  Stale, predictable  scheme.  Dcoordinator that has nothing but wait to earn his position.  OCoordinator that was only put there because Ben wanted him.  Those two are showing nothing.  No preparation.  At least the Defense shows up in the 2nd half.  First half Fichtner is just a waster of space.

I agree with everything on the coaching staff.

Idk what you are looking at but Dupree has been far from "very well". He has made a few great plays but mostly he has been nothing more than another liability.

[3rivers]

1 hour ago, Dcash4 said:

My biggest concern about letting Ben be more involved in the offensive planning in the off season -- 71/29 pass to run. Granted, some of that is game flow, but there were times Haley would at least put the hammer down and FORCE the run (often too much).

71/29 means it's time to be a passing team, we know who wants that.  get off to a bad start, with a  bad D and there you have it a passing team out of necessity. Nice how that all fell into place isn't it. 

[3rivers]

1 minute ago, wwhickok said:

Idk what you are looking at but Dupree has been far from "very well". He has made a few great plays but mostly he has been nothing more than another liability.

He still wouldn't crack the starting lineup on a good 3-4 D with OLB's we have had in our history. Making some lays he is, but consistent enough pressure and variation there isn't. That INT from fitz was a gift near the end zone and that won't happen again. Rushing the passer will continue to happen and that is what really matters.  He isn't mailing it in like some appear to but lets not get carried away either. 

[KJtheWicked]

Can one of you cap gurus break down what our cap situation might look like heading into 2019 FA? 

 

A guy I really like is Deone Buchanon. He would give us that speed at LB we desperately need. 

[VigilantZombie]

1 hour ago, KJtheWicked said:

Can one of you cap gurus break down what our cap situation might look like heading into 2019 FA? 

 

A guy I really like is Deone Buchanon. He would give us that speed at LB we desperately need. 

Depending on what they do as far as resignings and cuts, depending on how long Bell sits out, we could be looking at $20M + in cap space, more realisticaly we are likely looking at 9.5M

[jebrick]

1 hour ago, 3rivers said:

He still wouldn't crack the starting lineup on a good 3-4 D with OLB's we have had in our history. Making some lays he is, but consistent enough pressure and variation there isn't. That INT from fitz was a gift near the end zone and that won't happen again. Rushing the passer will continue to happen and that is what really matters.  He isn't mailing it in like some appear to but lets not get carried away either. 

He has been playing so much better.  he is getting consent pressure when he rushes. He is not James Harrison but neither is Watt.  ILB is such a huge need I can't even begin making other holes in the team.

 

[MOSteelers56]

18 minutes ago, jebrick said:

He has been playing so much better.  he is getting consent pressure when he rushes. He is not James Harrison but neither is Watt.  ILB is such a huge need I can't even begin making other holes in the team.

 

Unless he's racking up 2 sacks a game people are going to hate him. I expected him to really break out and I was wrong, but I still understand he's a pretty good player. 

[VigilantZombie]

37 minutes ago, MOSteelers56 said:

Unless he's racking up 2 sacks a game people are going to hate him. I expected him to really break out and I was wrong, but I still understand he's a pretty good player. 

I see him struggling in coverage, struggling to get off blocks, and failing to set the edge against the run.

[VigilantZombie]

I did this list based on when Tomlin became the HC of the Pittsburgh Steelers, I felt that was the most fair way to do it. 

 

2007 -- Lawrence Timmons was the lone man in this draft that had what I'd refer to as long-term success with our team.  Woodley had success but injuries did him in.  William Gay was an initial bust for our team, sure he eventually came back and had 'content-level' success but as a draft pick, he was a failure, same can be said for Matt Spaeth.  Not one other guy in this draft was a true success. 

1	15	Lawrence Timmons	LB	Florida State
2	46	LaMarr Woodley	LB	Michigan
3	77	Matt Spaeth	TE	Minnesota
4	112	Daniel Sepulveda	P	Baylor
4	132	Ryan McBean	DE	Oklahoma State
5	156	Cameron Stephenson	G	Rutgers
5	170	William Gay	CB	Louisville
7	227	Dallas Baker	WR	Florida

2008 - Not one player from this draft came to pass as a long-term talented player. 

 

1	23	Rashard Mendenhall	RB	Illinois
2	53	Limas Sweed	WR	Texas
3	88	Bruce Davis	LB	UCLA
4	130	Tony Hills	T	Texas
5	156	Dennis Dixon	QB	Oregon
6	188	Mike Humpal	OLB	Iowa
6	194	Ryan Mundy	FS	West Virginia

2009 - A few players in this class have had some success in the NFL, none of them truly to a long-term tune for the Steelers.  Wallace, Shipley, and Lewis all have seen NFL success but I wouldn't consider any of them outside of perhaps Shiply

1	32	Ziggy Hood	DT	Missouri
3	79	Kraig Urbik	T	Wisconsin
3	84	Mike Wallace	WR	Mississippi
3	96	Keenan Lewis	DB	Oregon State
5	168	Joe Burnett	DB	Central Florida
5	169	Frank Summers	RB	Nevada-Las Vegas
6	205	Ra'Shon Harris	DT	Oregon
7	226	A.Q. Shipley	C	Penn State
7	241	David Johnson	TE	Arkansas State

 

2010 - Obviously Antonio Brown &  Pouncey was the big take away from this draft, but it was the first draft during Tomlin's run that had more than one successful pick, Brown, Pouncey, Worilds, Sanders.  Worilds was a fringe success story, he did well for us but nothing great, went elsewhere and found the end of his career.  

1	18	Maurkice Pouncey	C	Florida
2	52	Jason Worilds	LB	Virginia Tech
3	82	Emmanuel Sanders	WR	Southern Methodist
4	116	Thaddeus Gibson	LB	Ohio State
5	151	Chris Scott	T	Tennessee
5	164	Crezdon Butler	DB	Clemson
5	166	Stevenson Sylvester	LB	Utah
6	188	Jonathan Dwyer	RB	Georgia Tech
6	195	Antonio Brown	WR	Central Michigan
7	242	Doug Worthington	DE	Ohio State

 

2011 - Cam Heyward obviously is the most important selection here.  Marcus Gilbert has been a success at right tackle but I do feel that I should add, he was originally drafted with the intent to be a LT at which he failed.  Still, with this class we're up to 7 players that have found true NFL success and just 4 that found it long-term with Pittsburgh.

1	31	Cameron Heyward	DE	Ohio State
2	63	Marcus Gilbert	T	Florida
3	95	Curtis Brown	DB	Texas
4	128	Cortez Allen	DB	The Citadel
5	162	Chris Carter	LB	Fresno State
6	196	Keith Williams	G	Nebraska
7	232	Baron Batch	RB	Texas Tech

2012 - If not for an injury it might have been different, but in the end, 2 guys made an impact from this class and one was a 7th round pick.  Sean Spence is the guy who might have been great if not for a horrific leg injury.  David DeCastro however is the only guy from this class that, at this point in the NFL is worth mentioning.  If you're keeping track that's 8 over the course of 6 drafts.

1	24	David DeCastro	G	Stanford
2	56	Mike Adams	T	Ohio State
3	86	Sean Spence	LB	Miami (Fla.)
4	109	Alameda Ta'amu	DT	Washington
5	159	Chris Rainey	RB	Florida
7	231	Toney Clemons	WR	Colorado
7	240	David Paulson	TE	Oregon
7	246	Terrence Frederick	CB	Texas A&M
7	248	Kelvin Beachum	T	Southern Methodist

2013 - 2 guys from this class were a success, one an amazing success, but then look at where we are now with him, (that doesn't make him a bad pick).  Vince Williams is the other guy but to me, he is a backup quality player so his success is relative to that.  He is not a starter worthy guy, and he is as much a part of the problem in our current defensive situation. Personally I'm not going to credit him here.  We're up to 10 over 7 years. 

1	17	Jarvis Jones	OLB	Georgia
2	48	Le'Veon Bell	RB	Michigan State
3	79	Markus Wheaton	WR	Oregon State
4	111	Shamarko Thomas	SS	Syracuse
4	115	Landry Jones	QB	Oklahoma
5	150	Terry Hawthorne	CB	Illinois
6	186	Justin Brown	WR	Oklahoma
6	206	Vince Williams	ILB	Florida State
7	223	Nick Williams	DT	Samford

 

2014 - I think it's fair to say this is was one of his more successful drafts, relative to the reality we now find ourselves in.  Shazier was a great player, key word being was. That doesn't make it a bad pick, it turned out to be an excellent pick, but it is a pick that is no more.  Tuitt, let's not make him something he isn't, he isn't Khalil Mack, but he is a very good, well above average DE.  Martavis Bryant was a bust, let's not try to suggest otherwise, so was McCullers.

1	15	Ryan Shazier	OLB	Ohio State
2	46	Stephon Tuitt	DT	Notre Dame
3	97	Dri Archer	RB	Kent State
4	118	Martavis Bryant	WR	Clemson
5	157	Shaquille Richardson	DB	Arizona
5	173	Wesley Johnson	C	Vanderbilt
6	192	Jordan Zumwalt	LB	UCLA
6	215	Dan McCullers	DT	Tennessee
7	230	Rob Blanchflower	TE	Massachusetts

 

2015 - Jesse James is the lone note worthy player here.  Bud Dupree, regardless of how you feel about him right now, is a bust and Chickillo shouldn't even be on the roster.  Bud Dupree is on borrowed time and as a 1st round choice, he ended up being a terrible pick. 

1	22	Bud Dupree	LB	Kentucky
2	56	Senquez Golson	CB	Mississippi
3	87	Sammie Coates	WR	Auburn
4	121	Doran Grant	CB	Ohio State
5	160	Jesse James	TE	Penn State
6	199	L.T. Walton	DT	Central Michigan
6	212	Anthony Chickillo	DE	Miami (Fla.)
7	239	Gerod Holliman	FS	Louisville

 

2016 - I'm not prepared to call a guy who barely sees the field due to lack of athleticism and overall talent (T.M.) a success.  Javon Hargrave is a consistent starter, he was the one quality pick from this draft.  Artie Burns is starting because he is the best of the terrible CBs we have healthy right now.  Sean Davis is starting for lack of options.  Both are busts. Up to 14/10

1	25	Artie Burns	CB	Miami (Fla.)
2	58	Sean Davis	SAF	Maryland
3	89	Javon Hargrave	DT	South Carolina State
4	123	Jerald Hawkins	T	LSU
6	220	Travis Feeney	OLB	Washington
7	229	DeMarcus Ayers	WR	Houston
7	246	Tyler Matakevich	LB	Temple

 

2017 - Too early to tell but early on it would appear TJ Watt and JuJu are the real deal.  It also appears Sutton doesn't belong on the field and Keion Adams isn't ever going to be given a chance.  James Conner was a quality pick seemingly.  Time will tell.  I'll give them 3 from this draft.

1	30	T.J. Watt	LB	Wisconsin
2	62	JuJu Smith-Schuster	WR	USC
3	94	Cameron Sutton	CB	Tennessee
3	105	James Conner	RB	Pittsburgh
4	135	Joshua Dobbs	QB	Tennessee
5	173	Brian Allen	CB	Utah
6	213	Colin Holba	LS	Louisville
7	248	Keion Adams	LB	Western Michigan

2018 - Obviously it's far too early to even guess on this but regardless and given our FA signings, T.E. wasn't a great pick.  I suspect a minimum of 3 players in this draft will not amount to anything. 

1	28	Terrell Edmunds	DB	Virginia Tech
2	60	James Washington	WR	Oklahoma State
3	76	Mason Rudolph	QB	Oklahoma State
3	92	Chuks Okorafor	T	Western Michigan
5	148	Marcus Allen	DB	Penn State
5	165	Jaylen Samuels	FB	North Carolina State
7	246	Josh Frazier	DT	Alabama

(Bolded are guys who worked out)

 

So here's my point I gave Colbert credit for 13 people that he drafted.  Depending on your opinion you could give him credit for more, or less.  But this is over an 11 year span (Tomlin's tenure) with 2 years still waiting to develop but not particularly looking promising in some areas.  When you add in the FA blunders he has had, while Colbert might be above average in terms of GM's, let's not pretend that he is amazing, he is far from it.  I have trouble believing that we can't at the very least, easily match his effectiveness as a GM by replacing him.

[jebrick]

 

Try the same thing with the Patriots and see how BB does.  just from 2007, to keep it fair, he has 12 drafted players that have impacted the Pats.  And he had far more picks.

Green Bay from 2007.  I count 12 impact players.

 

Judge them against the league and other teams drafting late.  I personally am for replacing scouts and coaches.  Colbert has had a long run of getting talent for this team and keeping them very competitive in the salary cap era.  Especially when he has had to rely almost solely on the draft.

 

[Chieferific]

You have also left off players that went on to other teams and played for years and/or are still playing. Also players that had injuries force them out of the League. I do not agree Colbert has been terrible OVERALL. I do agree he needs help selecting Defensive players. He's been better then most on the Offensive side of the ball. 

[3rivers]

3 hours ago, MOSteelers56 said:

Unless he's racking up 2 sacks a game people are going to hate him. I expected him to really break out and I was wrong, but I still understand he's a pretty good player. 

HIs effort is there this year , and he has been getting closer , so that isn't bad IMO. The problem is this is year 4 and he doesn't have variation and our GM is about to give him a deal for 10+M per at least . Any decent starting OT will solve his ways, all history shows this.  If there were some moves added to his repertoire I might actually step back , but with colbert willing to risk everything to prove himself right with his RD1 picks, this is a serious crossroads. The team can get a player that does have various moves and is already better per snap and move forward.  As someone pointed out, dupree isomer suited for 4-3 DE in 9 tech and I agree. In this scheme, he isn't being utilized properly and his move gets neutralized more often than it would in 9 tech. 

[3rivers]

What has doomed this team the most is depending solely on the draft for the D. They got lucky when fro some reason the browns released Haden. Imagine if the browns kept him. They have missed too many times in the draft on D yet hit often for the offence.

From this, it could be said the Defensive scouting is the issue if they give colbert a list per position to draft. 

15 minutes ago, Chieferific said:

You have also left off players that went on to other teams and played for years and/or are still playing. Also players that had injuries force them out of the League. I do not agree Colbert has been terrible OVERALL. I do agree he needs help selecting Defensive players. He's been better then most on the Offensive side of the ball. 

The draft has variation from year to years. Many hyped Nelson to be the next great OG. He has helped Indy, but is not near the player DDC is/was yet he was drafted much earlier. I have watched a few colts games and their D plays with more heart than ours  

Colberts crew have been good for drafting WR's and QB's IMO based on limited QB play that I have seen from Dobbs and Mason. 

We can blame the D scouts more than colbert, but the bell  situation would fall on colbert mostly .  They could have decided to let him walk if he didn't sign a deal before the draft and move forward from there. When bell showed up just before the playoff game last minute, that should have been all they needed to know.  

[VigilantZombie]

2 hours ago, Chieferific said:

You have also left off players that went on to other teams and played for years and/or are still playing. Also players that had injuries force them out of the League. I do not agree Colbert has been terrible OVERALL. I do agree he needs help selecting Defensive players. He's been better then most on the Offensive side of the ball. 

I didnt leave off Shazier. I also didnt leave off Sanders. I explained why i personally didnt count some individuals. Im not saying he did a terrible job. Im saying 2hat he has done, wouldnt be hard to replace. Now, is it a scout issue? Alright im willing to see them all replaced and give him another year to find out.