TitanSS Posted January 22, 2020 Share Posted January 22, 2020 3 minutes ago, dtait93 said: Wrong. It’s more than one game man. It’s his performance against KC in the 2017 wildcard round, it’s his end to the 2018 season carrying an offense featuring dead arm Marcus and Gabbert with no weapons, it’s his him leading the league in rushing, leading the league in rushing TD’s, becoming a pro bowl, and of course his historical playoff run. My original argument was that Tannehill is not the most important player on our roster. If he was then when push came to shove he would lead us to victories when we abandon the run or when Henry is hobbled/not playing. And he definitely isn’t the unquestioned leader of the team either that’s for damn sure lol. I'll just let you guys live in your world where any RB is even half as important as a mildly decent QB, let alone one coming off a great season leading the league in passer rating, YPA, CPOE, PFF rating, you name it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dtait93 Posted January 22, 2020 Share Posted January 22, 2020 4 minutes ago, TitanSS said: I'll just let you guys live in your world where any RB is even half as important as a mildly decent QB, let alone one coming off a great season leading the league in passer rating, YPA, CPOE, PFF rating, you name it. And yet you live in a world where you fail to acknowledge Tannehill’s shortcomings without Henry. He literally couldn’t even score a point against Carolina until Henry got involved. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TitanSS Posted January 22, 2020 Share Posted January 22, 2020 7 minutes ago, dtait93 said: And yet you live in a world where you fail to acknowledge Tannehill’s shortcomings without Henry. He literally couldn’t even score a point against Carolina until Henry got involved. I'm sure Henry's 60 yards of offense went a long way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dtait93 Posted January 22, 2020 Share Posted January 22, 2020 11 minutes ago, TitanSS said: I'm sure Henry's 60 yards of offense went a long way. Nice box score scouting. He was given the ball 2 times in the first half. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TitanSS Posted January 22, 2020 Share Posted January 22, 2020 6 minutes ago, dtait93 said: Nice box score scouting. He was given the ball 2 times in the first half. 3. And maybe if he was valuable in passing situations he wouldn't have to come off the field for Dion Lewis when we're in a 1st and 25 due to penalties? When you only get 4 possessions in a half that's kind of a killer. I'm fae from advocating for more Dion Lewis, but Henry had hardly done anything up to that point in the season that would lead anyone to believe he deserved to be a true #1 back. Had games earlier in the season averaging 1.9 YPC? You wanna solo out individual games, what about those games? Why isn't he carrying us then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dtait93 Posted January 22, 2020 Share Posted January 22, 2020 3 minutes ago, TitanSS said: 3. And maybe if he was valuable in passing situations he wouldn't have to come off the field for Dion Lewis when we're in a 1st and 25 due to penalties? When you only get 4 possessions in a half that's kind of a killer. I'm fae from advocating for more Dion Lewis, but Henry had hardly done anything up to that point in the season that would lead anyone to believe he deserved to be a true #1 back. Had games earlier in the season averaging 1.9 YPC? You wanna solo out individual games, what about those games? Why isn't he carrying us then? He has weaknesses, and he has bad games just like anybody else. That’s not the point. The point is that without Henry, Tannehill proved he couldn’t answer the bell and I gave you numerous examples. You can’t be the most important player if you can’t get the job done without your starting RB. On the flip side, Henry proved to be successful with and without good QB play, which I also gave you numerous examples of. And before you once again shout, “omgz ya but 2-4 thoo” you have to look at all of the surrounding factors outside of Henry and the QB that led to that start....to which I also once again gave you numerous examples of that you conveniently ignored. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TitanSS Posted January 22, 2020 Share Posted January 22, 2020 (edited) 20 minutes ago, dtait93 said: He has weaknesses, and he has bad games just like anybody else. That’s not the point. The point is that without Henry, Tannehill proved he couldn’t answer the bell and I gave you numerous examples. You can’t be the most important player if you can’t get the job done without your starting RB. On the flip side, Henry proved to be successful with and without good QB play, which I also gave you numerous examples of. And before you once again shout, “omgz ya but 2-4 thoo” you have to look at all of the surrounding factors outside of Henry and the QB that led to that start....to which I also once again gave you numerous examples of that you conveniently ignored. Lol and Henry did nothing without Tannehill save for a few random examples you listed spread out across 3 years? Give me a freaking break. Tannehill was driving for the lead without Henry in the only game he didn't start when Raymond was knocked unconscious and ruled a fumble. It was a minimum 10 point swing in a game we trailed by 3 with a few minutes left. Edited January 23, 2020 by TitanSS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dtait93 Posted January 23, 2020 Share Posted January 23, 2020 12 minutes ago, TitanSS said: Lol and Henry did nothing without Tannehill save for a few random examples spread put across 3 years? Give me a freaking break. Tannehill was driving for the lead without Henry in the only game he didn't start when Raymond was knocked unconscious and ruled a fumble. It was a minimum 10 point swing in a game we trailed by 3 with a few minutes left. Your bias hate towards Henry is hilarious. Check the facts dude. 2 of those years he was stuck behind DeMarco. Then he erupted against KC in the playoffs. The following year he breaks 1k and double digit TD’s with back up QB’s. Then this year he did what he did and I don’t need to rehash that again. **** isn’t random lmao. Yeah and guess what? He lost. He had a plethora of other chances which included 5 punts in a row. You sound like the Lebron stans that praise him for getting to the 6 Finals he lost in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TitanSS Posted January 23, 2020 Share Posted January 23, 2020 2 minutes ago, dtait93 said: Your bias hate towards Henry is hilarious. Check the facts dude. 2 of those years he was stuck behind DeMarco. Then he erupted against KC in the playoffs. The following year he breaks 1k and double digit TD’s with back up QB’s. Then this year he did what he did and I don’t need to rehash that again. **** isn’t random lmao. Yeah and guess what? He lost. He had a plethora of other chances which included 5 punts in a row. You sound like the Lebron stans that praise him for getting to the 6 Finals he lost in. I don't hate Henry I think he's a great RB. He just hadn't done anything to separate himself until Tannehill took over. A 1k season is like 60 yards a game. How ground-breaking. 60 yards a game is a foundation of an offense for sure. And half of those yards came in the final 4 games of the season. That's no random huh? Totally consistent? Your argument that Tannehill can't do anything without him is just a flat joke based on one bad game. You acknowledge that Henry has plenty of bad games then use this incredibly small and isolated sample size to try to make an argument on Tannehill's succes being totally dependant on Henry. It's a flat out joke. You're right about one thing though. Wins are a QB stat as even the most mediocre of them have more impact on a teams chance to win than a RB. Unfortunately Drew Brees is better than Ryan Tannehill and he got the W. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dtait93 Posted January 23, 2020 Share Posted January 23, 2020 2 minutes ago, TitanSS said: I don't hate Henry I think he's a great RB. He just hadn't done anything to separate himself until Tannehill took over. A 1k season is like 60 yards a game. How ground-breaking. 60 yards a game is a foundation of an offense for sure. And half of those yards came in the final 4 games of the season. That's no random huh? Totally consistent? Your argument that Tannehill can't do anything without him is just a flat joke based on one bad game. You acknowledge that Henry has plenty of bad games then use this incredibly small and isolated sample size to try to make an argument on Tannehill's succes being totally dependant on Henry. It's a flat out joke. You're right about one thing though. Wins are a QB stat as even the most mediocre of them have more impact on a teams chance to win than a RB. Unfortunately Drew Brees is better than Ryan Tannehill and he got the W. The final 4 games equaled 40% of his attempts so yes it's no surprise half of his yards came in the final 4 weeks. He was efficient from week 8 onward but didn't get the touches. 1k yards on 215 attempts is extremely impressive. Down play it all you want. And I'm seriously starting to wonder your reading comprehension. I gave you 5 examples of Tannehill failing without Henry. Not 1. Go back and read. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TitanSS Posted January 23, 2020 Share Posted January 23, 2020 (edited) 12 minutes ago, dtait93 said: The final 4 games equaled 40% of his attempts so yes it's no surprise half of his yards came in the final 4 weeks. He was efficient from week 8 onward but didn't get the touches. 1k yards on 215 attempts is extremely impressive. Down play it all you want. And I'm seriously starting to wonder your reading comprehension. I gave you 5 examples of Tannehill failing without Henry. Not 1. Go back and read. Erased my original post as I felt it was offensive. I apoligize. I'll go with this instead and end the argument with that. You're trying to say that Tannehill can't do anything without Henry. In the only game he was truly without Henry this season he threw for 272 yards, 10 YPA, 3 TDs, 0 INTs, and the team scored 28 points, all offensively. The defense just played like trash. Dropped 3 potential Brees interceptions in that game. The team is absolutely better with Henry starting than it is with the back ups. But I disregard the majority of your examples because I just don't plain agree with you and find the conclusions you jump to illogical. Agree to disagree. Not going to beat the drum any further than that. Edited January 23, 2020 by TitanSS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dtait93 Posted January 23, 2020 Share Posted January 23, 2020 (edited) 13 minutes ago, TitanSS said: It is impressive. Not being able to beat out Dion Lewis as the starter when he was the incumbent isn't very impressive. Most of what you're saying is nonsensical or anecdotal so I really try to let it go in one ear and out the other. You're trying to argue that a RB is more important to the teams success than a QB who lead the league a number of categories. Honestly, you should be surprised anyone is even responding to you. That's funny. Coming from a guy who argued we didn't pass against NE because our OC, "forgot" about it. Terrible arguments from you all around today. Edited January 23, 2020 by dtait93 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TitanSS Posted January 23, 2020 Share Posted January 23, 2020 (edited) 2 minutes ago, dtait93 said: That's funny. Coming from a guy who argued we didn't pass against NE because our OC, "forgot" about it. Terrible arguments from you all around today. Same. I tried to put a less offensive post in before you saw my response so for that I do apologize. Edited January 23, 2020 by TitanSS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dtait93 Posted January 23, 2020 Share Posted January 23, 2020 9 hours ago, ragevsuall17 said: You're trying to downplay Henry's role while trying to make Tannehill more than he was. He was good, no one is taking that away from him... he was important to our run, drastically better than Mariota. But he showed he's still just a game manager... who when paired with an elite running game, is very good at doing what he needs to do to win games. Since Henry got going against the Chiefs in week 10, we averaged 186 passing yards and 203 running yards per game when we won. In Tannehill's 4 losses, we averaged 259 passing yards and 129 rushing yards. FTR, our D gave up an average of 398 yards per game during those wins, and 381 during the losses. With a gimpy Henry, he was asked to get us a win against Houston and couldn't... without Henry, he was asked to beat NO, and they couldn't hold on to a lead. And when a opposing D finally took Henry away, he couldn't do anything to get us the win. After taking a 17-7 lead, Henry was neutralized totaling 6 rushes for 8 yards. Tannehill went 10/14 for 73 yards, 1 TD, and 2 sacks (one on 3rd down and the other on 4th). The biggest play after we took the 17-7 lead was the fake punt which resulted in a 28 yard gain. 10/14 is good... 5 ypa is not...3 1st downs in the last 36+ minutes is not. I'm not against bringing Tanny back... but I am if he's going to get significantly more than 75M over the next 3 years. I'm also strongly of the opinion that bringing Tanny back without Henry is not going to yield positive results... without investing heavily in another back (big money in FA or high draft pick), and even that is a gamble. Lcok Henry up first, then let the QB dominoes fall into place... 1st choice is Tanny, within reason... and if not, I'm ok with a couple of the other veteran options available. Couldn't have said it better myself. Especially the bolded. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TitanSS Posted January 23, 2020 Share Posted January 23, 2020 (edited) I do not think Tannehill is in the elite level of QBs if that is what you all think. He is a good QB who had a great season. But you're downplaying him against the Saints as well acting as if "he couldn't get the win" when he was driving for the W with 4 minutes to go and his receiver was knocked unconscious in FG range and fumbled. Your using a game that he was extremely capable of winning and a fluke play potentially cost us the W as if it was a negative towards him. I'm not doing anything in my argument that you aren't doing as well. Fluke plays happen to all teams. And it's not exactly like the Saints weren't one of the best teams in the NFL as well. It was a top team in a game where Tannehill didn't have this RB you claim he couldn't live without and yet he played well. He's not a top tier QB. He never will be. He is absolutely this teams best chance to win going forward barring a miracle draft pick QB. The rushing yards in win debate has been debunked a thousand times. You mean teams with a lead in the second half are more likely to be adding rushing yards than passing yards? Gasp! Also, why start that statistic in week 10 instead of when Tannehill took over as a starter? Why intentionally decrease the volume of your data set for any reason other than skewing the statistics in the favor of your argument as much as possible? Not that it matters because the conclusion should be the same as teams with a lead usually run the ball late in the game. In the regular season, since week 10, we averaged 242 passing yards in our wins. With a lowered sample size, the two playoff wins really drop that average. I'm gonna guess they really raise the rushing average as well. We all know those two games are not exactly blue prints for future success, unless your defense is going to ball out. Edited January 23, 2020 by TitanSS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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