Rainmaker90 Posted July 2, 2023 Share Posted July 2, 2023 2 minutes ago, Forge said: There's more to winning a series than talent. They play a style that was not conducive to the Devils succeeding, they are more disciplined in their system and they have better system with Rod. They also have talent in line with the devils. The experience factor is massively overblown. They got their *** kicked and Carolina is a really good team. That's okay. But if you want to be that team, you better beat that team. Sure. Which is why you continue to grow, develop and add. You can’t say ‘playoffs are a different animal ‘ which is said a billion times and say experience is overblown. They may matchup well with us, but that’s only 1 factor in determining a series too. Plenty of reasons why going for Hellebuyck might not be the next move. Carolina being a good team, is not one of them. It’s not something to consider . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forge Posted July 2, 2023 Share Posted July 2, 2023 17 minutes ago, Rainmaker90 said: Sure. Which is why you continue to grow, develop and add. You can’t say ‘playoffs are a different animal ‘ which is said a billion times and say experience is overblown. They may matchup well with us, but that’s only 1 factor in determining a series too. Plenty of reasons why going for Hellebuyck might not be the next move. Carolina being a good team, is not one of them. It’s not something to consider . The experience angle with the devils last year is massively overblown. You can either play your game or you can't. They didn't lose last year to Carolina because they had less experience. That's just an easy out for people to feel better about it. As Beekay said, Carolina then promptly went out the next round and got smacked down by Florida. Carolina has a ton of experience. They lost because Carolina is a bad matchup, was a better team with better coaching, etc etc. That's okay. But if you're going to flip that, you have to flip it first. Carolina is not going away and if they are smart, they are going to push all the chips in the middle (not sure if they will do that or not...they are pretty straightforward in what they do). The devils had plenty of experience. Marino had been to the playoffs the last 3 years. Dougie had over 50 games of experience. Timo had 35 playoff games with San Jose. Tatar had been on two teams that made stanley cup final runs - he just sucks in the playoffs. Thats his thing. And he still had 40 games of experience. Erik Haula makes the playoffs every year. Graves had 25 playoff games the last two years. That was Smith's 8th time in the playoffs. Siegs had bene to the playoffs twice with Washington. Guys like Nico, Wood, Severson, Bratt...they had been to the playoffs before. Palat has two stanley cup championships. Jack didn't have any problems in the playoffs, so his lack of experience really wasn't a thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rainmaker90 Posted July 2, 2023 Share Posted July 2, 2023 3 minutes ago, Forge said: The experience angle with the devils last year is massively overblown. You can either play your game or you can't. They didn't lose last year to Carolina because they had less experience. That's just an easy out for people to feel better about it. As Beekay said, Carolina then promptly went out the next round and got smacked down by Florida. Carolina has a ton of experience. They lost because Carolina is a bad matchup, was a better team with better coaching, etc etc. That's okay. But if you're going to flip that, you have to flip it first. The devils had plenty of experience. Marino had been to the playoffs the last 3 years. Dougie had over 50 games of experience. Timo had 35 playoff games with San Jose. Tatar had been on two teams that made stanley cup final runs - he just sucks in the playoffs. Thats his thing. And he still had 40 games of experience. Erik Haula makes the playoffs every year. Graves had 25 playoff games the last two years. That was Smith's 8th time in the playoffs. Siegs had bene to the playoffs twice with Washington. Guys like Nico, Wood, Severson, Bratt...they had been to the playoffs before. Palat has two stanley cup championships. Jack didn't have any problems in the playoffs, so his lack of experience really wasn't a thing. There’s multiple reasons why we lost. Experience as a team in the playoffs is one ( but not the main ) . It also doesn’t mean they can’t win a series against them. We’re deviating from the main point. Caroline should have zero influence on what we do with our roster. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beekay414 Posted July 2, 2023 Author Share Posted July 2, 2023 (edited) We're in a tough spot with Foote not being waiver exempt IRT the forward group. Say you do sign a veteran forward and Holtz ends up having a good camp and sticks in his role as the 3rd line RWer. You're then at a point where you have a vet signed, Lazar and Foote in that 4th line LW role. Foote, you place down in Utica to start the year but once an inevitable injury happens and you have to call him up, he's kinda in a no man's land in that you can't send him back down. So you'd then end up calling up Thompson since you're less worried about risking him to waivers so you're intentionally impacting the quality of player on the ice (though you can just healthy scratch Thompson and run Lazar/vet forward out there). Wouldn't surprise me if we don't make a forward move at all and just role a PTO in camp. That way we know whether Foote and Holtz are going to take their roles and we don't have money allocated to other options. Edited July 2, 2023 by beekay414 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forge Posted July 2, 2023 Share Posted July 2, 2023 5 minutes ago, Rainmaker90 said: There’s multiple reasons why we lost. Experience as a team in the playoffs is one ( but not the main ) Which is why I would consider Carolina the favorite. Especially if Carolina also continues to get better along with us. If we are going to be the favorite, I need to see Carolina's structure fail or us take care of them. 5 minutes ago, Rainmaker90 said: It also doesn’t mean they can’t win a series against them. Never an argument that was made Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beekay414 Posted July 2, 2023 Author Share Posted July 2, 2023 You could also call up Clarke since he's waiver exempt but it's still more IRT Foote needing to be exposed to waivers and Fitz liking him enough that it puts us in a bind with our roster construction if he doesn't take that 4th line LW job. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forge Posted July 2, 2023 Share Posted July 2, 2023 4 minutes ago, beekay414 said: We're in a tough spot with Foote not being waiver exempt IRT the forward group. Say you do sign a veteran forward and Holtz ends up having a good camp and sticks in his role as the 3rd line RWer. You're then at a point where you have a vet signed, Lazar and Foote in that 4th line LW role. Foote, you place down in Utica to start the year but once an inevitable injury happens and you have to call him up, he's kinda in a no man's land in that you can't send him back down. So you'd then end up calling up Thompson since you're less worried about risking him to waivers so you're intentionally impacting the quality of player on the ice (though you can just healthy scratch Thompson and run Lazar/vet forward out there). Wouldn't surprise me if we don't make a forward move at all and just role a PTO in camp. That way we know whether Foote and Holtz are going to take their roles and we don't have money allocated to other options. If we don't make another move at forward, are we at 13 or 14 with all Holtz / Lazar / Foote included? The thing with Lazar is that he's an insanely good defensive forward. Maybe preferred as a 13th forward, but I won't complain if he's on the 4th line. I can't remember if Tyce is waiver exempt, do you know? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forge Posted July 2, 2023 Share Posted July 2, 2023 Yamamoto to Seattle. 1 x 1.5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forge Posted July 2, 2023 Share Posted July 2, 2023 Damnit, now I have to do counting. Jack Nico Bratt Timo Toffoli Mercer Palat Mikey Bastian Holtz Lazar Foote Haula Am I missing anyone? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rainmaker90 Posted July 2, 2023 Share Posted July 2, 2023 7 minutes ago, Forge said: Which is why I would consider Carolina the favorite. Especially if Carolina also continues to get better along with us. If we are going to be the favorite, I need to see Carolina's structure fail or us take care of them. Never an argument that was made That’s why I said that’s what I felt you were implying . As of right now, absolutely they should be the favorite. Who knows what happens during the season Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beekay414 Posted July 2, 2023 Author Share Posted July 2, 2023 3 minutes ago, Forge said: If we don't make another move at forward, are we at 13 or 14 with all Holtz / Lazar / Foote included? The thing with Lazar is that he's an insanely good defensive forward. Maybe preferred as a 13th forward, but I won't complain if he's on the 4th line. I can't remember if Tyce is waiver exempt, do you know? Yep, 13 forwards with those guys. Thus why bringing in another guaranteed contract at forward puts us in a pickle if Holtz, the waiver exempt player, earns his spot and the non-waiver exempt player, Foote, doesn't. Lazar might have a spot simply due to Rango no longer being around for the PK. But I'm not super thrilled with a Lazar-McLeod-Bastian 4th line offensively lol. No, he's gotta be exposed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forge Posted July 2, 2023 Share Posted July 2, 2023 The reaction to "needing a guy who will punch someone in the face" is gold over there lol 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forge Posted July 2, 2023 Share Posted July 2, 2023 Just now, beekay414 said: Yep, 13 forwards with those guys. Thus why bringing in another guaranteed contract at forward puts us in a pickle if Holtz, the waiver exempt player, earns his spot and the non-waiver exempt player, Foote, doesn't. Lazar might have a spot simply due to Rango no longer being around for the PK. But I'm not super thrilled with a Lazar-McLeod-Bastian 4th line offensively lol. No, he's gotta be exposed. So the interesting one will definitely be Holtz. The annoying thing is that he looked great last pre-season and camp with Palat and Jack and which got him on the roster and then they promptly didn't want to play him. I have some concerns about ruff pulling that **** again. This team needs to crap or get off the pot with Holtz. If he's good in the off season, they have to commit to him on the NHL roster, or they need to let him sit in Utica and play and then bring him up as needed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beekay414 Posted July 2, 2023 Author Share Posted July 2, 2023 1 minute ago, Forge said: So the interesting one will definitely be Holtz. The annoying thing is that he looked great last pre-season and camp with Palat and Jack and which got him on the roster and then they promptly didn't want to play him. I have some concerns about ruff pulling that **** again. This team needs to crap or get off the pot with Holtz. If he's good in the off season, they have to commit to him on the NHL roster, or they need to let him sit in Utica and play and then bring him up as needed Well with no more Zetterlund, Sharangovich, Wood, Tatar or Boqvist, I don't think Ruff is going to have the ability to yank him from the lineup the way he did last season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forge Posted July 2, 2023 Share Posted July 2, 2023 1 minute ago, beekay414 said: Well with no more Zetterlund, Sharangovich, Wood, Tatar or Boqvist, I don't think Ruff is going to have the ability to yank him from the lineup the way he did last season. Super damn annoying. It was like watching them screw with Boqvist his first year all over again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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