Who do you think is the second best player in the league?

[Chiefer]

20 hours ago, Soggust said:

"You need an elite QB to win Super Bowls"

"But Eli wasn't elite"

"Well, he was because he won super bowls".

“I’d rather have Eli’s career than Rodgers’, two rings”

[Mr.UFO]

Joe Burrow -- when he's healthy.

[Soko]

On 8/22/2024 at 8:15 AM, Ozzy said:

Big Ben is so awful, he is only 5th all time in passing yards, terrible Eli Manning is 10th all time, Matthew Stafford is 11th all time, hell Joe Flacco is 18th all time and Russell Wilson is 19th all time.

 

So all of those guys top 20 all time in passing yards over just the regular season.  Oh what terrible QBs they are and how not elite they all are...what a freaking joke.

 

All outside of probably Joe Flacco should end up being in the Hall of Fame when all is said and done.  How average they all are, when only what 36 guys currently are in the NFL Hall of Fame at the QB position.  

What’s that fallacy called when you over dramatize and misrepresent the other people’s opinions? The one that’s basically putting words in their mouth that they didn’t say? It’s on the top of my tongue, like a needle in a haystack.

In your spectrum of QBs, are there only elite-average-terrible quarterbacks? If a guy isn’t an elite, top-3/4 QB, then he’s average or terrible? How many elite QBs are in the league? Stafford, Ben, Brees, Brady, Rodgers, Peyton, Eli, Flacco, and Russ were all playing at the same time. So that’s minimum 9, according to you. Crazy, there must be a dozen+ HOFers every decade! 

[Ozzy]

3 minutes ago, Soko said:

What’s that fallacy called when you over dramatize and misrepresent the other people’s opinions? The one that’s basically putting words in their mouth that they didn’t say? It’s on the top of my tongue, like a needle in a haystack.

In your spectrum of QBs, are there only elite-average-terrible quarterbacks? If a guy isn’t an elite, top-3/4 QB, then he’s average or terrible? How many elite QBs are in the league? Stafford, Ben, Brees, Brady, Rodgers, Peyton, Eli, Flacco, and Russ were all playing at the same time. So that’s minimum 9, according to you. Crazy, there must be a dozen+ HOFers every decade! 

You want to call QBs who make it to the Hall of Fame not elite because they are not the top 1% or something of QBs, I do not really care!  Last time I checked if you are in or close to being considered to be enshrined into the Pro Football Hall of Fame, you would be considered elite for the QB position. 

You want to categorize only the top 2-3 players to ever play the position as "elite", whatever the hell have fun.

[HerbertGOAT]

On 8/21/2024 at 8:06 PM, Ozzy said:

Eli Manning only won when it mattered, how dare he.  He only beat Tampa Bay, Dallas and Green Bay on the road in the playoffs to get to the Super Bowl and beat a historically great New England team.  Wow what an awful QB, then the next Super Bowl run beat Green Bay and the 49ers on the road and went up against another great New England team and beat them.  Who really gives a crap about his stats in the regular season when it wins and that is really all that matters.

He did that on the back of 2 of the greatest defensive postseason runs ever; calling his playoff performance elite is ridiculous unless you're talking about 2 plays.

[HerbertGOAT]

4 hours ago, Ozzy said:

You want to call QBs who make it to the Hall of Fame not elite because they are not the top 1% or something of QBs, I do not really care!  Last time I checked if you are in or close to being considered to be enshrined into the Pro Football Hall of Fame, you would be considered elite for the QB position. 

You want to categorize only the top 2-3 players to ever play the position as "elite", whatever the hell have fun.

Throwing a serious tantrum because people are calling out your flawed logic is odd.

 

Josh Allen may very well be the 2nd best player in the league, I wouldn't argue with that on its own. However, you're being absurd about it. "Josh Allen is the 2nd best player in the league because elite QBs impact a team and give you more of a chance to win a SB than any other position" is the general gist of your argument from my understanding. If that's true, do Burrow, Lamar, and whichever your pick of Herbert/Dak/Stafford/Purdy/Stroud round out your top 5 ahead of the best of the best from the other positions? And why is Allen the #2 player over the only other active QB to win a SB, Stafford? Why is Stafford not the 2nd best player and QB in the league?

[The BILLievers]

13 minutes ago, HerbertGOAT said:

Throwing a serious tantrum because people are calling out your flawed logic is odd.

 

Josh Allen may very well be the 2nd best player in the league, I wouldn't argue with that on its own. However, you're being absurd about it. "Josh Allen is the 2nd best player in the league because elite QBs impact a team and give you more of a chance to win a SB than any other position" is the general gist of your argument from my understanding. If that's true, do Burrow, Lamar, and whichever your pick of Herbert/Dak/Stafford/Purdy/Stroud round out your top 5 ahead of the best of the best from the other positions? And why is Allen the #2 player over the only other active QB to win a SB, Stafford? Why is Stafford not the 2nd best player and QB in the league?

I'd say Allen is #2 because the Bills have the 2nd best record in the NFL (only behind Mahomes) over the last 4 seasons and he has the most TDs in the NFL over the past 4 seasons.

But yes it is true that I'd rather have Burrow, Lamar, Herbert, Stafford on my team over CMC or JJ or Garrett if I had to pick. 

 

 

[HerbertGOAT]

25 minutes ago, The BILLievers said:

But yes it is true that I'd rather have Burrow, Lamar, Herbert, Stafford on my team over CMC or JJ or Garrett if I had to pick. 

That's fair, but it's a different argument IMO. CMC/JJ/Garrett/etc. are much better at their positions than those guys are at QB. Obviously QB is the most important position, but that doesn't automatically make them "better" to me.

[Soko]

4 hours ago, Ozzy said:

You want to call QBs who make it to the Hall of Fame not elite because they are not the top 1% or something of QBs, I do not really care!  Last time I checked if you are in or close to being considered to be enshrined into the Pro Football Hall of Fame, you would be considered elite for the QB position. 

You want to categorize only the top 2-3 players to ever play the position as "elite", whatever the hell have fun.

I mean…what math are you using where being top 3-4 out of 32 starting QBs = 1%? Wouldn’t that be ~10%? 

But it has less to do with the specific number and more to do with your inability or unwillingness to accept that you’re being a hypocrite. Once again, does Flacco count as being an elite QB, because he played really well? Okay, great, then Peyton Manning is out because he played below average in his runs. Or does Peyton count, because he’s an established elite QB? Okay, great, then Eli, Flacco, and Foles are out, because although they played at a high level, they weren’t elite QBs. You simply can’t have it both ways.

Let’s use your logic: Peyton played poorly in his SB runs, but he’s an elite QB - so he counts. Flacco was a solid but not great QB, but he played at an elite level in his SB run - so he counts. Big Ben was a really good but not elite QB, and he played pretty well in his SB runs overall - so he counts. Foles was a mediocre backup QB, but he played at a magical level in his SB run - so he counts. So who are we even excluding? Backup QBs can win it. Decent but not great QBs can win it. Elite QBs can obviously win it. Good QBs can win it. You’re not excluding anybody except the Zach Wilson’s of the world. 

The reason you have to make things up instead of actually respond to the posts is because your arguments contradict each other, but I’m not sure if you actually know that and are just spinning in circles, or if you actually just can’t understand it. Unless you can actually explain how that stuff isn’t just one fat contradiction, I’m all done here. Miss me with that “oh so he’s not [insert elite QB here], that makes him not elite???” 

****ing yes, dude.