Raiders sign LB Cory Littleton to 3 years, 36M

[El Ramster]

3 minutes ago, FrantikRam said:

 

JL was kind of a JAG - certainly worse than Littleton and was overrated by Rams fans for years. And I say that as an Ohio State fan who screamed for the Rams to draft him.

I agree that it's not black and white - black and white is saying "you don't pay these positions unless they're elite" - what is NOT black and white is applauding the Raiders for this signing while they have some great players on rookie deals.

"They're in a position whose impact is very heavily influenced by the surround cast (line in front of them)" - Seriously? You know what other position is heavily influenced by a line in front of them? QB.

I don't even really disagree with you - I think Littleton is a slightly above average ILB - but I don't think there's a guy on the market right now that's better than him, especially when you factor in his age and durability. Teams should use all their cap space to upgrade their team - sometimes that means overpaying for FAs.

You’re forgetting that many didn’t want Mark

Barron cut because Littleton was just a special teams ace. I’ll argue that Littleton’s 18 season was better! Yet he played under a tag. Many teams didn’t show interest. I’m happy to see him get paid. But the rams even with Littleton have had their issues on defense. 
 

 

[Dr LBC]

11 minutes ago, FrantikRam said:

 

JL was kind of a JAG - certainly worse than Littleton and was overrated by Rams fans for years. And I say that as an Ohio State fan who screamed for the Rams to draft him.

I agree that it's not black and white - black and white is saying "you don't pay these positions unless they're elite" - what is NOT black and white is applauding the Raiders for this signing while they have some great players on rookie deals.

"They're in a position whose impact is very heavily influenced by the surround cast (line in front of them)" - Seriously? You know what other position is heavily influenced by a line in front of them? QB.

I don't even really disagree with you - I think Littleton is a slightly above average ILB - but I don't think there's a guy on the market right now that's better than him, especially when you factor in his age and durability. Teams should use all their cap space to upgrade their team - sometimes that means overpaying for FAs.

My point is (and PackerRaymond's was, to a lesser extent) it makes more "sense" for a team that's not the Rams to overpay a player like Littleton than it did for the Rams.  If a player on your is elite at his position (for the most part) you don't let him see the market.  But when you start factoring in scarcity of certain positions, you have to move that needle some on the threshold to meet to justify payment to keep (e.g. QB) and when you do that for the positions that are scarcer (ILB and RB frankly aren't) you have to make a correlating balancing adjustment.  Neither of us (PR or I) are saying you absolutely do not pay (just automatically let them go away on the market without making a reasonable offer to try and keep them) those positions.  What we're saying is that you don't bend over backwards to accommodate them (i.e. they're "lower priority") because the average rookie and free agent pool on a given year is chock full of JAG's (or slightly better) who are likely to be only marginal (if any, depending on who all they're replacing and how much the surrounding cast changes) regression in performance for a cost that is considerably less than the premium another team was willing to pay for your not-so-premium asset.  This is the model that's sustained the Ravens defense for the better part of 20 years at this point.

[FrantikRam]

15 minutes ago, The LBC said:

My point is (and PackerRaymond's was, to a lesser extent) it makes more "sense" for a team that's not the Rams to overpay a player like Littleton than it did for the Rams.  If a player on your is elite at his position (for the most part) you don't let him see the market.  But when you start factoring in scarcity of certain positions, you have to move that needle some on the threshold to meet to justify payment to keep (e.g. QB) and when you do that for the positions that are scarcer (ILB and RB frankly aren't) you have to make a correlating balancing adjustment.  Neither of us (PR or I) are saying you absolutely do not pay (just automatically let them go away on the market without making a reasonable offer to try and keep them) those positions.  What we're saying is that you don't bend over backwards to accommodate them (i.e. they're "lower priority") because the average rookie and free agent pool on a given year is chock full of JAG's (or slightly better) who are likely to be only marginal (if any, depending on who all they're replacing and how much the surrounding cast changes) regression in performance for a cost that is considerably less than the premium another team was willing to pay for your not-so-premium asset.  This is the model that's sustained the Ravens defense for the better part of 20 years at this point.

 

That makes sense.

But as the salary cap continues to climb, what a player is "worth" is relative. IMO, $12 million per year for three years is a solid price for Littleton, once you add age and durability to his actual on field play. There are currently 10 guys making over $10 million per year at ILB. Sometime between now and the end of his contract, he'll probably end up being around the 12-16th highest paid ILB in the NFL. That is right about where he should be.

There's two sides to this:

From the Rams perspective, should we have let him go? Sure, I'm fine with that - your point is a good one even though I personally feel this is good value for him, I realize that's debatable.

The Raiders perspective - given that they have the cap space and not every FA is going to want to play for them, this is a slam dunk signing. Anyone who disagrees with that is what I'd have an issue with.

[uk9erfan]

Great pick up for the Raiders and I'm delighted because he's out of the NFC West.