What if Buffalo had drafted Lattimore?

[whodatworm23]

 

As we all know by now, the Saints were extremely close to sending shock waves throughout the NFL had the Buffalo Bills not traded down in the 2017 NFL draft with the Kansas City Chiefs. 

 

New Buffalo Bills head coach Sean McDermott has already stated that had the deal not been struck with the Chiefs, that the Bills obvious choice would have been Ohio State cornerback Marshon Lattimore who eventually went to the Saints.

 

The Saints meanwhile were prepared to take Texas Tech quarterback Pat Mahomes with the 11th pick had that scenario played out.

 

The question here is... what if? What if the Saints pick had been Mahomes and not Lattimore? How would you feel not only about this upcoming season but the future of this franchise? What would your belief be regurding the future of Drew Brees in a Saints uniform or Sean Payton roaming their sidelines as head coach? What does the fact that this front office was so close in choosing an heir apparent to Brees tell us about how long they foresee him being a viable option on this team? 

 

Mahomes himself was widely viewed as a prospect with raw ability but also a work in progress. It would be foolish to believe that an NFL team like the Saints who has as many needs as they do would consider a prospect like that to be their best option with their top pick... unless your not sold on your current quarterback beyond 2017.

 

 

thoughts...

whodat

[Dome]

If Payton thought he was our guy, I would've been fine with it. I like Lattimore better and I'm glad we took him. But Payton still has a couple more QB whiffs before he starts getting any hate from me, at least for that reason. 

To be honest, I don't really think we're gonna be too this year competitive anyways. Taking Mahomes over a CB would've been the catalyst to a rebuild. 

[whodatworm23]

2 hours ago, domepatrol91 said:

If Payton thought he was our guy, I would've been fine with it. I like Lattimore better and I'm glad we took him. But Payton still has a couple more QB whiffs before he starts getting any hate from me, at least for that reason. 

To be honest, I don't really think we're gonna be too this year competitive anyways. Taking Mahomes over a CB would've been the catalyst to a rebuild. 

I agree... I'd say if Buffalo would have taken Lattimore leaving Mahomes for us at 11, the fact that Brees is on a 1 year deal would be a much bigger storyline right now than it currently is.

[CWood21]

On 7/22/2017 at 9:33 AM, domepatrol91 said:

Taking Mahomes over a CB would've been the catalyst to a rebuild. 

Pretty much.  It's no different than when you bring in a new head coach, it just puts the writing on the wall that major changes are coming.

[whodatworm23]

4 minutes ago, CWood21 said:

Pretty much.  It's no different than when you bring in a new head coach, it just puts the writing on the wall that major changes are coming.

So in your opinion... by the Saints being so heavily interested in taking Mahomes that high (and would have for not the Buf/KC trade) donyou think that an indictment on how this team feels about Brees longevity with the club or Payton's? 

 

Ive been hearing whispers about Saints GM Mickey Loomis wanting a young talented successor behind Brees for a few years now but this is the highest I've ever seen the organization consider taking one and if all times when the head coach is presumably in a precarious situation as far as his job security. 

 

I would highly doubt that Payton was the guy clamoring for Mahomes on draft day. He's in a make or break season and his defense is still trash. My feelings are that the Mahomes fauation was more so in the front office side especially with a soon to be 39 year old quarterback in the final year of his deal looking for another big payday on a team that can't break even. 

 

Call me crazy but my personal belief is that had Buffalo stayed pat and taken Lattimore at 10 the Saints would have taken Mahomes at 11 and neither Payton nor Brees would likely have been back in 2018. 

 

Thats just me.

[CWood21]

4 minutes ago, whodatworm23 said:

So in your opinion... by the Saints being so heavily interested in taking Mahomes that high (and would have for not the Buf/KC trade) donyou think that an indictment on how this team feels about Brees longevity with the club or Payton's? 

Drew Brees is 38 years old, he's not going to play forever.  The Saints have drafted exactly one QB in the first five rounds over the last five drafts.  That's not a lot of capital investment into the position.  Just for comparison, Brett Favre was 36 years old when the Packers selected Aaron Rodgers in the first round.  Being a former 3rd round, Grayson didn't even make the active roster in his second year.  IF they felt that Brees' play was about to drop off significantly, they probably would have been more proactive about moving up to select Mahomes.  I think this was one of those situation where they felt that if Mahomes fell to them, they'd take him but they didn't feel motivated to move up and select him.

As for Payton, I don't think his future is tied to any draft pick.  There's already been rumblings that he's going to be on the outside looking in when speaking of job status.  Fortunately for he and the Saints, they didn't fire him and with him and Brees they're still capable of putting a ton of points.  Payton's future is probably tied to Drew Brees, moreso than any draft pick.  And I'd agree that Payton probably isn't the "draft a QB early" camp.  Like we've discussed, his name has been the hot seat the last couple of seasons, so drafting Lattimore does a better job of securing his job security than a QB that needs to be developed and likely is being cultivated for the next head coach.

[whodatworm23]

1 hour ago, CWood21 said:

Drew Brees is 38 years old, he's not going to play forever.  The Saints have drafted exactly one QB in the first five rounds over the last five drafts.  That's not a lot of capital investment into the position.  Just for comparison, Brett Favre was 36 years old when the Packers selected Aaron Rodgers in the first round.  Being a former 3rd round, Grayson didn't even make the active roster in his second year.  IF they felt that Brees' play was about to drop off significantly, they probably would have been more proactive about moving up to select Mahomes.  I think this was one of those situation where they felt that if Mahomes fell to them, they'd take him but they didn't feel motivated to move up and select him.

As for Payton, I don't think his future is tied to any draft pick.  There's already been rumblings that he's going to be on the outside looking in when speaking of job status.  Fortunately for he and the Saints, they didn't fire him and with him and Brees they're still capable of putting a ton of points.  Payton's future is probably tied to Drew Brees, moreso than any draft pick.  And I'd agree that Payton probably isn't the "draft a QB early" camp.  Like we've discussed, his name has been the hot seat the last couple of seasons, so drafting Lattimore does a better job of securing his job security than a QB that needs to be developed and likely is being cultivated for the next head coach.

I agree... Mahomes tho would have created a very interesting debate amongst the fan base and league wide.

[whodatworm23]

As a Green Bay fan what side of the fence were you on when the whole Farve/Rodgers thing went down? At the time were you ready to move on from Farve? Were you convinced Rodgers were the guy? It's easy to look at it now and say the team made the right call but what was your mindset when it all first went down?

 

Ive got to believe that Farve was beloved by most Packers fans as is Brees by most Saints fans making it a very emotional time in your franchises history.

[CWood21]

37 minutes ago, whodatworm23 said:

As a Green Bay fan what side of the fence were you on when the whole Farve/Rodgers thing went down? At the time were you ready to move on from Farve? Were you convinced Rodgers were the guy? It's easy to look at it now and say the team made the right call but what was your mindset when it all first went down?

 

Ive got to believe that Farve was beloved by most Packers fans as is Brees by most Saints fans making it a very emotional time in your franchises history.

I think at the point it finally started to transition from Favre to Rodgers, I think I was in the Rodgers camp.  I know I (and a lot of other Packers fans) got tired of him essentially holding the franchise hostage with the will he or won't he retire talk?  That was one of the reasons why I was okay with the transition.  Obviously, I wasn't privy to the development of Rodgers, but McCarthy felt comfortable enough moving forward with Rodgers as the starting QB that he pretty much said that it was Rodgers' team despite the fact that Favre was still under contract.  McCarthy saw Rodgers' development and his progression from when he was a rookie to when he took over as the starting QB.  This was one of those situations where we as fans weren't privy to all the facts, and McCarthy has been quite candid about this.

[whodatworm23]

1 hour ago, CWood21 said:

I think at the point it finally started to transition from Favre to Rodgers, I think I was in the Rodgers camp.  I know I (and a lot of other Packers fans) got tired of him essentially holding the franchise hostage with the will he or won't he retire talk?  That was one of the reasons why I was okay with the transition.  Obviously, I wasn't privy to the development of Rodgers, but McCarthy felt comfortable enough moving forward with Rodgers as the starting QB that he pretty much said that it was Rodgers' team despite the fact that Favre was still under contract.  McCarthy saw Rodgers' development and his progression from when he was a rookie to when he took over as the starting QB.  This was one of those situations where we as fans weren't privy to all the facts, and McCarthy has been quite candid about this.

I guess there must have been a certain population of Packer fans that didn't want to move on from Farve. What made yall's transition so seamless was that it didn't take very long to see that Rodgers was the real deal. 

 

I honestly believe that there will be a great divide amongst Saints fans when that day comes as older Saints fans who were around for the terrible teams appreciate Brees and what he's done on a different level than many of the newer generation Saints fans that only know of a competitive team under Payton and might be more willing to move on from Brees much sooner than the old timers would. 

[CWood21]

2 hours ago, whodatworm23 said:

I guess there must have been a certain population of Packer fans that didn't want to move on from Farve. What made yall's transition so seamless was that it didn't take very long to see that Rodgers was the real deal. 

 

I honestly believe that there will be a great divide amongst Saints fans when that day comes as older Saints fans who were around for the terrible teams appreciate Brees and what he's done on a different level than many of the newer generation Saints fans that only know of a competitive team under Payton and might be more willing to move on from Brees much sooner than the old timers would. 

No doubt.  There was a large contingent of Packer fans who were highly critical of the way they handled Favre in his later years, like he deserved special treatment given what he meant to the franchise.  Fortunately, like you mentioned was that Rodgers' transition was rather smooth and largely successful.  Nobody wants a franchise to push out their starting QB only to find out that their replacement isn't adequate.  The problem I'm seeing is that there are voids in Brees' contract, which complicates things.  Ideally, the Saints would be able to keep him for another year or two beyond this year.  Preferably at a lower cap hit than his 2018 salary is set at $28M.  The Saints also would incur an $18M cap hit when that contract voids, so an extension probably favors both parties.

[Dome]

1 hour ago, CWood21 said:

The Saints also would incur an $18M cap hit when that contract voids, so an extension probably favors both parties.

Definitely. And it also guarantees they cant tag him, which was smart on his end.

Although a sign and trade is also a possibility. There's no way they just take that $18m hit to the chops though, one way or another 

[whodatworm23]

8 hours ago, domepatrol91 said:

Definitely. And it also guarantees they cant tag him, which was smart on his end.

Although a sign and trade is also a possibility. There's no way they just take that $18m hit to the chops though, one way or another 

Does this fact kinda make you have to bite the bullet at some point as a franchise anyway tho?

 

Brees agent I'm sure wanted this type of structure to his deal in order to make it more appealing to extend him. It also give them leverage in extension talks which would likley come with yet another deadmoney hit in the event the Saints opt out or Brees isn't resigned later. 

 

I guess what im saying is that at some point it will cost us to eventually let Brees go reguardless... he and his agent will make sure of that.

[Dome]

7 hours ago, whodatworm23 said:

Does this fact kinda make you have to bite the bullet at some point as a franchise anyway tho?

 

Brees agent I'm sure wanted this type of structure to his deal in order to make it more appealing to extend him. It also give them leverage in extension talks which would likley come with yet another deadmoney hit in the event the Saints opt out or Brees isn't resigned later. 

 

I guess what im saying is that at some point it will cost us to eventually let Brees go reguardless... he and his agent will make sure of that.

I think Brees and Condon are after guaranteed money, after that everything else is secondary.

If the Saints are unsure of what they want to do with Brees moving forward and the trade talks heat up, I think Brees would be OK signing somewhere else if they're gonna give him more guaranteed than we are, or than he's worth. Brees has always been about financial security and self promotion, I think he'd agree to a huge contract elsewhere as a sign and trade deal.

[whodatworm23]

34 minutes ago, domepatrol91 said:

I think Brees and Condon are after guaranteed money, after that everything else is secondary.

If the Saints are unsure of what they want to do with Brees moving forward and the trade talks heat up, I think Brees would be OK signing somewhere else if they're gonna give him more guaranteed than we are, or than he's worth. Brees has always been about financial security and self promotion, I think he'd agree to a huge contract elsewhere as a sign and trade deal.

Or he could just leave the Saints holding the bag on this 18 mil and leave as an unrestricted FA likley landing him one last bigtime contract.

 

Personally if I'm Brees, I'm playing this season out and if this team (defense) doesn't show a big improvement I'm bailing and if he did no one could blame him. At some point Brees will have to consider the fact that it may be in his best interest of he wants another ring to eventually be the one to pull the cord.