State of the Steelers

[3rivers]

40 minutes ago, 43M said:

Spells the end for Chuks time in Pittsburgh (good riddance).

Next year, replace Moore and Cole, and maybe, JUST MAYBE, we might have a good OLine.

draft Van Pran and another OT, keep Moore though he will be replaced mid season much like Jones did to Chuks this year. 

Nice to see they finally woke up about Chuks.  Cole had a decent game, but if he slides  or goes bact to how he was playing, then it will be Herbig time eventually. 

The OL has a chance if they get a good C and OT.  Finally , just after how many years now? I actually gave up with colbert letting things go.  In retrospect, tomlins steelers have had a good/elite OL for about 1/4 of his tenure and a bad to terrible OL for about half . 

[Dcash4]

19 hours ago, August4th said:

Jones listed as a starter today 

*Co-starter

Because we can't be mean to anyone or praise someone else. 

Now that we have replaced our 3rd worst offensive lineman, I would really like to see the plan to replace the worst. 

[warfelg]

1 minute ago, Dcash4 said:

*Co-starter

Because we can't be mean to anyone or praise someone else. 

Now that we have replaced our 3rd worst offensive lineman, I would really like to see the plan to replace the worst. 

IMO we did replace our worst. 
 

Why?

Chuks has the skill but his effort is crap. As many bad things you can say technically on Moore and Cole, one thing I can’t say is that they don’t give max effort. 

[Dcash4]

2 minutes ago, warfelg said:

IMO we did replace our worst. 

Why?

Chuks has the skill but his effort is crap. As many bad things you can say technically on Moore and Cole, one thing I can’t say is that they don’t give max effort. 

Presented without comment. 

 

 

 

 

[warfelg]

1 minute ago, Dcash4 said:

Presented without comment. 

 

 

 

 

Ok? Your point? That somehow my opinion is invalid? Chuks isn’t a good run blocker because of effort and that pisses me off. Doesn’t mean Moore doesn’t need to be replaced. 

[Dcash4]

11 minutes ago, warfelg said:

Ok? Your point? That somehow my opinion is invalid? Chuks isn’t a good run blocker because of effort and that pisses me off. Doesn’t mean Moore doesn’t need to be replaced. 

My point is that Moore isn't just the worst offensive lineman on this team, he is one of the worst in the league. 

Back to my original post, what's the plan to replace the worst o-lineman now? I have my hopes, but he is currently listed as Co-starter on the other side. 

[warfelg]

4 minutes ago, Dcash4 said:

My point is that Moore isn't just the worst offensive lineman on this team, he is one of the worst in the league. 

Back to my original post, what's the plan to replace the worst o-lineman now? I have my hopes, but he is currently listed as Co-starter on the other side. 

First off it’s my opinion because you can’t coach effort. I need to watch the all 22 because someone is saying Chuks gave a few Ole blocks on the last drive of the Jags game. To throw a tomlinism in here for groans: He’s a hostage not a volunteer with that effort. 
 

The offseason. We just don’t have the horses. My opinion right now: give Moore help. How often does a TE chip? How often does slide protection go his way? How often does the side car chip on his side? I feel like I t’s not that often. And I’m not asking in the being a wise you know what, I’m honestly asking. We leave him on an island too much. It’s like Canada only know max protect and 5 blockers. 

[Dcash4]

28 minutes ago, warfelg said:

First off it’s my opinion because you can’t coach effort.

You can't, but I do believe you can engineer it. Chuks has had zero competition because they were never serious about moving Dan Moore off his starting position earlier in the year to rep him at RT with any real consistency. 

Please understand this: I have never once considered your opinion invalid just because I don't share it. But this team has gone out of it's way to protect Dan Moore's starting spot where he is continually one of the worst players in the league at the position.  

Jones has now twice shown he shouldn't be on the bench. He may well be our best OL. So here is a Tomlinism in return of yours: Two dogs one bone (but for real this time). Move Chuks back to the spot he trained at for 3 seasons before injury and tell him and Moore they have through November to figure it out. 

More talent vs more effort. Let the best man win. Stop this "co-starter" nonsense, because even if it's just that -- nonsense -- you did it purposely for someone. All of Chuks reps this week should have come at LT, and if they didn't shame on this staff. 

So back to my first post: I want to know what the plan is for replacing the worst LT in the league now that his competition is at RT. I understand all the things you mention with helping him, but if they haven't done that yet it's really unlikely do that now with a rookie playing a foreign position (by my count, 8 practices with the Steelers at RT) on the other side. 

[warfelg]

4 minutes ago, Dcash4 said:

You can't, but I do believe you can engineer it. Chuks has had zero competition because they were never serious about moving Dan Moore off his starting position earlier in the year to rep him at RT with any real consistency. 

Please understand this: I have never once considered your opinion invalid just because I don't share it. But this team has gone out of it's way to protect Dan Moore's starting spot where he is continually one of the worst players in the league at the position.  

Jones has now twice shown he shouldn't be on the bench. He may well be our best OL. So here is a Tomlinism in return of yours: Two dogs one bone (but for real this time). Move Chuks back to the spot he trained at for 3 seasons before injury and tell him and Moore they have through November to figure it out. 

More talent vs more effort. Let the best man win. Stop this "co-starter" nonsense, because even if it's just that -- nonsense -- you did it purposely for someone. All of Chuks reps this week should have come at LT, and if they didn't shame on this staff. 

So back to my first post: I want to know what the plan is for replacing the worst LT in the league now that his competition is at RT. I understand all the things you mention with helping him, but if they haven't done that yet it's really unlikely do that now with a rookie playing a foreign position (by my count, 8 practices with the Steelers at RT) on the other side. 

Just a FWIW, here’s Tomlin directly commenting on Moore at RT:

”He is significantly better at left than he is at right," Tomlin said about Moore Jr.

 

I don’t think you can engineer what Chuks is missing. That tenacity, mean streak, anger in the run game is either there or it isn’t. He’s a positional blocker. Just doesn’t fit with what you want. 

I hold true on this on my coaching and I’ll say it here. I rather see the less talented player who wants it than the more talented who doesn’t. And that’s why I’m fine with Chuks being benched.

Like I said, I know Moore isn’t good, and despite acknowledging that your hammering at it is what makes me feel like my opinion is invalidated. IMO for the remainder of the year I rather not play Chuks, let this lack of effort come infectious, and have Jones at RT. I like what Baldinger said on Jones and that for him any rep at any position is worth it.

Given he’s had good games at both OT positions that gives you flexibility in the offseason. Can you get your hands on an elite LT? Cool. Get your hands on a good RT only? Cool. But I said it going into the Tenn game. The in house solution to the OT Cindy drum isn’t there with Moore being LT only, Chuks RT only, and Cook being a body to have around. 

[Dcash4]

2 minutes ago, warfelg said:

Chuks RT only

Chuks isn't RT only, though. He was literally viewed as a LT for the early portion of his career running exclusively behind Villy and only played RT because of injury. This is why I am for them moving him back to his "original" spot and trying to push both players. 

We have plenty of flexibility on this OL sans Moore. Seumalo has repped heavily at both G spots and seen snaps at C and RT briefly and was a C in college. Ditto with Daniels. Herbig hasn't seen a ton of action at C, but has repped there in practices. 

If they wanted to find solutions, I think they could -- options are available. But it's how much of a desire they have to find it, which seems like very little. That leads back to Dan Moore who, for whatever reason, has a stranglehold on the LT spot, despite being bad. 

[warfelg]

5 minutes ago, Dcash4 said:

Chuks isn't RT only, though. He was literally viewed as a LT for the early portion of his career running exclusively behind Villy and only played RT because of injury. This is why I am for them moving him back to his "original" spot and trying to push both players. 

We have plenty of flexibility on this OL sans Moore. Seumalo has repped heavily at both G spots and seen snaps at C and RT briefly and was a C in college. Ditto with Daniels. Herbig hasn't seen a ton of action at C, but has repped there in practices. 

If they wanted to find solutions, I think they could -- options are available. But it's how much of a desire they have to find it, which seems like very little. That leads back to Dan Moore who, for whatever reason, has a stranglehold on the LT spot, despite being bad. 

I’m personally calling Chuks RT only because other than a bit his rookie year and 1 drive in a game 2 years ago he’s always practiced and played RT. You were so upset with Jones playing RT this week for the same reasons. 

I also see a big difference in “can” do something and actual positional flexibility. Semu and Herbig can do those things but they aren’t a solution at those things. 

I don’t think Moore has this unbreakable hold on LT FWIW. The clearly drafted Jones to replace him. I think keeping Jones as a flexible piece was their way of pushing Chuks more. Personally I wonder if things behind the scenes with Chuks have been not so great all season and that’s why he was in more danger than Moore. 

[warfelg]

https://x.com/Steelersdepot/status/1722305492108915039?s=20

This guy might not be that bright.

[Dcash4]

2 hours ago, warfelg said:

he’s always practiced and played RT

This simply isn't true. His lack of playing time at LT comes from the fact that Villy played 48 of 48 games during his tenure here. But even as a rookie, he played behind villy. He also saw pre-season action at LT. While he was in competition for the open RT spot, he also practice on both side of the line in 2019. In 2020, he lost the RT battle to Banner and would have been the swing tackle until Banner tore his ACL. The following year with Villy moving on in FA, Chuks was moved to LT, where Colbert thought he was a better fit and that if the competition the year before with Banner was for LT instead of RT, Chuks likely would have won. 

So he has a history of practice (and playing pre-season games) at LT. He was scouted as a LT. He is left handed which plays better at LT. He was thought of as being the LT when the position opened. Kinda feels like they think he could play LT doesn't it?

Injuries and opportunity took him to RT. So, that's why I am comfortable saying he should be moved back and into a competition at LT and leave Jones alone at RT. 

2 hours ago, warfelg said:

You were so upset with Jones playing RT this week for the same reasons.

Based on what I just said above, I in no way see a player in his 6th year of the NFL, having started 59 games with the same team, and having practiced at the position in the past as being similar to having a rookie who exclusively rep'd at LT and only provided reps for him at RT on a week in which Chuks was in concussion protocol and on a short week in which you have walkthroughs and not actual practice as the same thing....

Edited November 8, 2023 by Dcash4
Also, I will just call myself out in the edit for being wrong in one of my last posts where I said he was "exclusively" at LT. He was not, but he was the the swing tackle and first up to a man who never came off the field at LT.

[warfelg]

38 minutes ago, Dcash4 said:

This simply isn't true. His lack of playing time at LT comes from the fact that Villy played 48 of 48 games during his tenure here. But even as a rookie, he played behind villy. He also saw pre-season action at LT. While he was in competition for the open RT spot, he also practice on both side of the line in 2019. In 2020, he lost the RT battle to Banner and would have been the swing tackle until Banner tore his ACL. The following year with Villy moving on in FA, Chuks was moved to LT, where Colbert thought he was a better fit and that if the competition the year before with Banner was for LT instead of RT, Chuks likely would have won. 

So he has a history of practice (and playing pre-season games) at LT. He was scouted as a LT. He is left handed which plays better at LT. He was thought of as being the LT when the position opened. Kinda feels like they think he could play LT doesn't it?

Injuries and opportunity took him to RT. So, that's why I am comfortable saying he should be moved back and into a competition at LT and leave Jones alone at RT. 

Based on what I just said above, I in no way see a player in his 6th year of the NFL, having started 59 games with the same team, and having practiced at the position in the past as being similar to having a rookie who exclusively rep'd at LT and only provided reps for him at RT on a week in which Chuks was in concussion protocol and on a short week in which you have walkthroughs and not actual practice as the same thing....

So not extensive work. Just spotty here and there?

 

I mean, what you posted isn’t that far off from what you cut off quoting me about his rookie year and 2020. 

Edited November 8, 2023 by warfelg

[Dcash4]

8 minutes ago, warfelg said:

So not extensive work. Just spotty here and there?

I mean, what you posted isn’t that far off from what you cut off quoting me about his rookie year and 2020. 

He was the literal swing tackle on the team for multiple years and seen as the first answer to LT after Villy left yet you make it seem like he would be being introduced to the position for the first time. 

Again, my ask here is that you move a guy that was benched back to a position he has played and give competition to the guy who is the worst offensive lineman in the sport. 

Back to ignoring you at all costs.