Gruden vs. Reggie

[G]

16 hours ago, raidersedge said:

Yeah. Putting them in positions really shows how horrible the drafting has been.

I see the opposite...and I see a lack of high picks...

All those QB's were 'values' where they we're picked. Wilson and Cook were both mentioned as 1st round picks at some time during their last college season. Both fell to 4th and it's because they're not good enough. Carr was a 1st rounder but the last name dropped him to the 2nd.

RB and WR are 5th's and later except for Cooper. 

TE Walford didn't develop and was injured. Rivera overachieved and Kasa was a blocking TE

LB's all started except Stupar

DB's played except for Dowling. Hayden was a REACH because of injury but Reggies biggest wiffs are on the lines...

Berg was a non tradeable 3rd which is really a stuck 4th and ZBS scheme, T Watson and DL Ward were RM's homerun hopes that were major swing and a miss reaches. DE Calhoun was value but just isn't good. The FACT some of our 5th and later picks are on other teams means they we'rn't bad picks, just not worth paying to keep.

Put ANY teams picks out like that and you'll probably see worse results. People always hail the Pats but the reality is their drafting is worse than ours. Hit on a GOAT QB with a 6th rounder and people won't notice a lot of wiffs...

 

[Darbsk]

20 hours ago, raidersedge said:

Here is Reggie McKenzie's draft history with the Raiders by positions. No way is Gruden gonna let him draft anymore. I'm not even saying Gruden is some genius at drafting but I am saying Reggie's time is up and its best we go in a different direction, which I believe we are. Jon tried to bring in Elliot Wolfe for a reason.

QB
R4 - Tyler Wilson - Arkansas
R2 - Derek Carr - Fresno State
R4 - Connor Cook - Michigan State

RB
R6 - Latavius Murray - Central Florida
R5 - DeAndré Washington - Texas Tech
R7 - Elijah Hood - North Carolina

WR
R5 - Juron Criner - Arizona
R7 - Brice Butler - San Diego State
R1 - Amari Cooper - Alabama
R7 - Andre Debose - Florida

TE
R6 - Nick Kasa - Colorado
R6 - Mychal Rivera - Tennessee
R3 - Clive Walford - Miami

OT
R3 - Tony Bergstrom - Utah
R2- Menelik Watson - Florida State
R7 - Anthony Morris - Tennessee State
R7 - Vadal Alexander - LSU
R4 - David Sharpe - Florida
R7 - Jylan Ware - Alabama State

OG
R3 - Gabe Jackson - Mississippi State
R4 - Jon Feliciano - Miami

DE
R5 - Jack Crawford - Penn State
R7 - David Bass - Missouri Western State
R1 - Khalil Mack - Buffalo
R7 - Shelby Harris - Illinois State
R2 - Mario Edwards Jr. - Florida State
R6 - Max Valles - Virginia
R3 - Shilique Calhoun - Michigan State

R2 - Jihad Ward - Illinois

 

DT
R6 - Christo Bilukidi - Georgia State
R6 - Stacy McGee - Oklahoma
R4 - Justin Ellis - Louisiana Tech
R3 - Eddie Vanderdoes - UCLA
R7 - Treyvon Hester - Toledo

LB
R4 - Miles Burris - San Diego State
R7 - Nathan Stupar - Penn State
R3 - Sio Moore - Connecticut
R5 - Ben Heeney - Kansas
R5 - Neiron Ball - Florida
R6 - Cory James - Colorado State
R5 - Marquel Lee - Wake Forest

CB
R1- DJ Hayden - Houston
R4 - Keith McGill - Utah
R7 - TJ Carrie - Ohio
R7 - Dexter McDonald - Kansas
R1 - Gareon Conley - Ohio State

S
R7 - Jonathan Dowling - Western Kentucky
R1 - Karl Joseph - West Virginia
R2 - Obi Melifonwu - Connecticut
R7 - Shalom Luani - Washington State

 

 

Whilst it's interesting to see this in black and white, I think we have to put this in context that he was drafting for scheme in some cases and obviously our recent schemes have been poor. I wouldn't say it's an excellent resume but I don't think it's markedly worse than most GMs. He hit on the 2 most important positions and I might be among the few but I think our problem last year wasn't a lack of talent but rather scheme and coaching.

[Humble_Beast]

5 hours ago, Darbsk said:

Whilst it's interesting to see this in black and white, I think we have to put this in context that he was drafting for scheme in some cases and obviously our recent schemes have been poor. I wouldn't say it's an excellent resume but I don't think it's markedly worse than most GMs. He hit on the 2 most important positions and I might be among the few but I think our problem last year wasn't a lack of talent but rather scheme and coaching.

a few UDFA that made an impact and stuck around should be included on the list..... I also prefer to grade based on class...sadly 2015 draft is starting to look bad

https://www.silverandblackpride.com/2015/5/4/8548443/oakland-raiders-2015-draft-grade

Edwards needs to step up to avoid being the next Watson....   Walford was a bust, Feliciano is a back up, Heeney didn't last, same for Neiron Ball, Valles didn't make it out of camp, same for Andre Debose and Anthony Morrie. Dexter McDonald has stuck around.. so 4 guys have stuck around for a second contract, and two guys are starters in Cooper and Edwards

 

[Humble_Beast]

10 hours ago, G said:

I see the opposite...and I see a lack of high picks...

All those QB's were 'values' where they we're picked. Wilson and Cook were both mentioned as 1st round picks at some time during their last college season. Both fell to 4th and it's because they're not good enough. Carr was a 1st rounder but the last name dropped him to the 2nd.

RB and WR are 5th's and later except for Cooper. 

TE Walford didn't develop and was injured. Rivera overachieved and Kasa was a blocking TE

LB's all started except Stupar

DB's played except for Dowling. Hayden was a REACH because of injury but Reggies biggest wiffs are on the lines...

Berg was a non tradeable 3rd which is really a stuck 4th and ZBS scheme, T Watson and DL Ward were RM's homerun hopes that were major swing and a miss reaches. DE Calhoun was value but just isn't good. The FACT some of our 5th and later picks are on other teams means they we'rn't bad picks, just not worth paying to keep.

Put ANY teams picks out like that and you'll probably see worse results. People always hail the Pats but the reality is their drafting is worse than ours. Hit on a GOAT QB with a 6th rounder and people won't notice a lot of wiffs...